New camera and VERY stupid 120 question!

[Canon Fan]

OK so I got my new/old Argoflex E TLR and film yesterday. After going through the debocle of figuring out how to load 120 rollfilm I decided I better research how to get it back out once exposed since there is no rewind So let me get this straight, I leave the film ON the take up spool and simply send it in? And I can unload it in simply "subdued" light and not total darkness? Dumb question but this is the first time I have even HELD 120 film let alone worked with it! Wow thats embaressing! :?

I have not actually loaded the film yet which brings me to question #2 (not as dumb!)

The shutter mechanism on this camera is WILDLY inconsistant. I can hear, see and feel MAJOR differences at all speeds. One click does actually sound look and feel like 1/10 and the next is more like 1/200. Same problem at almost every setting. Obviously it would be surely fooling to waste a roll of film trying to use it this way. What should I do to attempt a fix for this? Worn springs? Sticking blades? I have not disassembled it yet. Any thoughts? I want to get shooting!

 

[MDowdey]

loading 120 film on a TLR is a snap. the spool that came with the film gets loaded at the bottom depending on the camera. then you feed the leader into the take up spool. and wind it until the red arrows line up with the marks on the camera. close the door and wind it until you are at frame #1. when you are all done, just pop open the back and take the filled up take up spool out and use the sticky leader of the film and close it up. it should say "exposed".


the old film spool will now be used as your new take up spool for the next go round.

as far as the shutter goes...your guess is a good as mine.


md

 

[ferny]

Is the camera auto in any way? I got a Polaroid 320 and it seemed to me like the shutter was getting stuck open. Turned out it has a meter built in and it was just giving me the right shutter speed for a dark room. I didn't realise until I found where the battery was hidden.

As for 120 film. My understanding is that you put your film in, connect it to the empty spool, use it, take out the spool which it is now wrapped around, make sure it's tightly wrapped and then stick it back in the packet it came in for safe keeping. Oh, and move the now empty spool in the camera over to the other side. It's best to load in shadows and the like. But you shouldn't have any problems if you do it in bright daylight.

As I said, that's just my understanding. I've five rolls of 120 waiting to be opened myself.

 

[Canon Fan]

Oh no this thing is about as MANUAL as it gets Their is no meter, battery, or auto anything of any kind. The shutter has options for 10, 25, 50, 100, 200, B, and T. I don't really think it's a sticking problem as much as it is it closing too soon most of the time. Alot of times 1/10 seems just as fast as 1/200 :?

 

[ferny]

Maybe the srping is on it's way out?
Take it to a local shop. They'll probably take one look at say "oh, that is..." straight away.

 

[Canon Fan]

Well this could be dangerous! I have been looking for a reason to go to this one camera store for quite some time and now I have it

 

[ksmattfish]

The shutter mechanism on this camera is WILDLY inconsistant. I can hear, see and feel MAJOR differences at all speeds. One click does actually sound look and feel like 1/10 and the next is more like 1/200. Same problem at almost every setting. Obviously it would be surely fooling to waste a roll of film trying to use it this way. What should I do to attempt a fix for this? Worn springs? Sticking blades? I have not disassembled it yet. Any thoughts? I want to get shooting!

I think you should try a roll of film, and see what you get. You may find that some speeds are more accurate than others. In mint condition this camera is somewhere between a Holga and say a Yashica TLR. And since yours sounds like it's not in perfect condition it's going to have quirks and problems, but those are part of the fun. The photos may not be perfect, but if that's what you want I think you need to look into a higher quality camera like a Yashica, Zeiss Ikontaflex, Mamiyaflex, or Rolliecord. These cameras go for $75 to $150 in working condition.

You can disassemble it and see what you can repair yourself, but I don't think it's worth having professionally repaired. You could probably buy 6 or 7 more for the repair price. The shutter mechanism is probably dirty; if it was broken it wouldn't work at all. If you can find a camera store where the person at the counter actually knows much about this sort of camera let me know. That's my kind of store.

 

[Canon Fan]

True, I may give it a shot and see what happens. Good thing for neg print film latitude

 

[mygrain]

Sounds like the shutter blades a bit gummed up. Its one of the most common problems with old cameras. It's kind of scarry cracking yer toys open but once you get it apart it's not so bad and you get to figure out the goods too. a good source that i found was "Camera maintenace and repair vol1 and 2" by Thomas Tomosy.

Good Luck.

 

[Canon Fan]

I have downloaded repair diagrams of the shutter but haven't tried anything yet

We'll see what kind of time I have in the next cpl days I suppose

 

[ksmattfish]

True, I may give it a shot and see what happens. Good thing for neg print film latitude

If you aren't developing the film yourself, you might try a C41 BW film. Huge exposure latitude.

When buying and using vintage cameras sometime you just have to go through a few to get a good one. I've bought many a $10 to $20 beat up hunk of junk, run a test roll through it, and been impressed enough to look for and spend a little more money on a clean and functioning model.

Good luck. It's a learning experience, and that's always good.

 

[rangefinder]

Using 120 film is really simple.

Most TLRs load from the bottom to the top. So going this way:

1. Remove the empty spool from the bottom and put it at the top.

2. Remove the 120 roll from the foil wrapper, break and remove the paper tape, put the fresh roll at the bottom.

3. Pull the leader to the top, which is now the take-up spool and start the leader on the spool.

4. Advance the film until the arrows (full width of the paper leader) match up with the red dot on the camera body. Sometimes this is a dot or an arrow or a triangle and color may be red or yellow or white. This is your STARTING POINT.

5. Close the camera.

6. Advance to frame #1.

7. If this is square format (6cm X 6cm/2.25" X 2.25") you'll get 12 exposures.

8. After making the 12th exposure continue to advance the film until you are sure the paper leader/trailer comes off the bottom spool and is wrapped around the take-up spool.

9. Open the camera and remove the film. Moisten the paper tape and wrap the tape around the film. This prevents the film from unraveling.

10. Now the film is ready to be processed. To run another roll just repeat the steps.

SHUTTER PROBLEM: Sounds like over the years, especially from lack of use, the springs may be weak. There is probably nothing you can do about this. BUT sometimes you can just work the shutter over a few days and things may straighten out. MAYBE.

Repairs will probably not be cost effective.

Other TLRs are available. I think Russian made TLRs are available at a reasonable cost. The Chinese also make two brands - Sea Gull and Pearl. I have a Chinese Sea Gull. It's a Chinese version of the Yashica Mat. I've used it infrequently but it does take good pictures. www.porters.com is listing a Seagull Deluxe for $239. They also list at Kalimar Reflex 66 for $189. I believe Kalimar was either Russian or East German.

You can also check www.freestylephoto.biz. They used to carry them as well.

 

[Bob_McBob]

I know it's been mentioned before in this thread, but make sure you glue the backing paper down when you're finished the roll, or it will unwind. The Ilford backing adhesive strip has a lovely minty flavour .

 

[Mitica100]

CF, with dirty shutters there's not much you can do aside from disassembly and CLA. It'll take you way too mucho dinero to do it at a camera repair. As someone mentioned before, get a Yashica D and enjoy the MF. If your mind is set on trying to clean it yourself, try getting a can of compressed air with a narrow tube (you can get them at Office Max or Office Depot I think), try to stick that narrow tube where you find an opening in the shutter, perhaps by the cocking lever and give it a few blasts of air. Try the shutter after that to see if it's any better. For lubrication I found that lighter fluid (the old style lighters, with liquid benzene) in which you mix some very fine graphite powder works the best. Apply with something like a syringe inside the shutter, little by little and work the shutter by cocking and firing many times. Most of the time it works like a charm.

 

[paul rond]

It sounds like your camera shutter needs a good cleaning. Old cameras get caked up if not maintained over the years, it's common.

Check out this site if you are interested in fixing it yourself...

http://www.kyphoto.com/classics/forum/

Click on LAST WEEK to get a recent listing on the forum. They also have a section where you can download reapir manuals for many old cameras. Most of the people there are retired repairmen as well and are always willing to offer expert advice.