Ok Nikon or Canon mid level dslr?

[fotomumma09]

fotomum,

Try going into a camera shop near you (not sure where you are) and having a play with their cameras. The reason I say this is I was set on one brand/model, and was lucky enough to get some good advice from friends, and my local camera shop has amazing staff. When I arrived I told them there was zero chance of me buying anything on that day, I just wanted to have a look/feel of a few different models and ask a few questions. The staff were excellent, and not only let me look at the cameras but told me to take them outside for a while if I wanted to.

What I am getting at, is the way a camera feels while in your hands makes a big difference IMO, some may feel too big/small or you might not like the way the buttons and gadgets are set up etc. That and budget IMO are the considerations which will narrow down the options of what is best for you.

Good luck

Thank you, I will definitely do that!

 

[KmH]

What I am getting at, is the way a camera feels while in your hands makes a big difference IMO, some may feel too big/small or you might not like the way the buttons and gadgets are set up etc.

I did professional photography for 30 years and used a wide variety of cameras that had vastly differing control layouts, and shapes. I used cameas made by Minolta, Canon, Nikon, Mamiya, Rollei, Pentax, Olympus, Hasselblad, and a few others.

None of my photographs were negatively affected by the very wide range of ergonomics and 'feel' that all those various cameras that I used over the years had.

The 'feel' of a camera in my hands was about # 27 on my list of considerations. Features, functions, and performance usually occupied considerations 1 through 26,

 

[Derrel]

I did professional photography for 30 years and used a wide variety of cameras that had vastly differing control layouts, and shapes. I used cameas made by Minolta, Canon, Nikon, Mamiya, Rollei, Pentax, Olympus, Hasselblad, and a few others.

None of my photographs were negatively affected by the very wide range of ergonomics and 'feel' that all those various cameras that I used over the years had.

3O,20,AND EVEN 15 YEARS AGO, almost all cameras of a "type" had virtually IDENTICAL control layouts. All 35mm SLR's for the most part, had the same basic layout. Same with the majority of medium-format cameras. Cameras of that era had a shutter release button, film advance lever or crank, and f/stop controls on the lens barrel. SHutter speed was on the top deck on all 35mm's, except on the Olympus OM-system, which had it concentric with the lens barrel, a la the Hasselblad 500-type shutter speed layout.

Today's d-slrs have many more control added. Many more buttons. TWO LCD displays. Menu levels four levels deep on some cameras. The cameras of the distant past were basically almost all identical in control layout and ergonomics. Modern d-slrs are decidedly different. I used to sell cameras at retail, and have sold to literally hundreds and hundreds of customers of all skill levels. Trust me--camera companies spend millions of yen on ergonomic design and testing because it MATTERS to customers. Ergonomics is a full-fledged field of study in industrial design. The better a tool feels and fits, the better it will work. Put it this way--one day for chits and giggles, I proved to my fishing partner that I could gut and field dress a salmon using a broken beer bottle. I had success! But you know what? My folding fishing knife is a FAR,FAR superior tool. I can also drive a tack with a brick, or with a tack hammer. Saying ergonomics has no impact is somewhat disingenuous...I've seen customers, hundreds of them, over the counter, take an IMMMEDIATE liking or dislike to various camera models made by competing companies--within the same,exact,specific price range and product class. Customers with absolutely ZERO brand preference, and no knowledge of the product what-so-ever, as well as beginners,intermediates,and advanced shooters. Ergonomics matters to the majority of customers. Otherwise we'd all be happy with a Yugo and a broken beer bottle.

Let's put it this way: when the first generation of Pentax and Olympus AF 35mm SLR cameras hit the market, almost ALL of their customers switched brands because the ergonomics were so,so pitiful. Simply pathetic. Another biggie was viewfinder visibility...the High-Eyepoint concept Nikon premiered in the 1980's was a HUGE, huge advance to many eyeglass wearing shooters. I think the reason the Nikon F3HP (-High Eyepoint) body was the longest-produced Nikon ever (over 20 years continuous production) was that it was perhaps the easiest-to-see-through 35mm SLR ever made for those who shoot while wearing eyeglasses. Today, live view and the LCD screen usability is a big deal...not quite like an old Mamiya C330...where was the Video Record button on those old Mamiyas??? Can't recall...

Today: try and grab a Nikon 1...see if you drop it...you might want to buy that new $54 accessory handgrip they sell to make it hand-holdable...

Ergonomics? Science? Or superstition?

 

[Nikon_Josh]

What I am getting at, is the way a camera feels while in your hands makes a big difference IMO, some may feel too big/small or you might not like the way the buttons and gadgets are set up etc.

I did professional photography for 30 years and used a wide variety of cameras that had vastly differing control layouts, and shapes. I used cameas made by Minolta, Canon, Nikon, Mamiya, Rollei, Pentax, Olympus, Hasselblad, and a few others.

None of my photographs were negatively affected by the very wide range of ergonomics and 'feel' that all those various cameras that I used over the years had.

The 'feel' of a camera in my hands was about # 27 on my list of considerations. Features, functions, and performance usually occupied considerations 1 through 26,

Your statements get more and more wild by the day Keith, I know for a start I chose Nikon over Canon partly due to ergonomics and the feel of the camera. For me, Canon ergonomics do not feel right to me.

To say ergonomics are not important.. let me ask you this, would you like too use a Nikon D3000, where you have to dig through the menus to change the ISO??

 

[APHPHOTO]

I would agree with you as far as Nikon or Canon. They dominate the market. Anything you could possibly need for both is readily available. The lense choises are the best you can find. No other camera manufacturer makes as many lense, flash, accessories choices as Nikon or Canon. As far as which to chose. Well you need to do some research on bodies. Because as far as lenses go. Each has what the other offers with some minor differances. I personally chose Nikon. Why? Because of their history. Nikon was the first to make lenses. In fact Nikon made lenses for Canon back in the day. Plus any lense you find made from Nikon will work on any entry level on up body. Yes some features wont work such as auto focus, but the lenses will still work. Canon on the other hand changed their lense mount design in the 80's when they introduces EOS. If you own a EOS than older lenses wont even mount to it. But if your new to photography and buying new gear than that is not a problem. Also Nikon bodies are easier to navigate through the menu with less searching. If you search for lenses for both Nikon or Canon you will find that for the most part, a Nikon lense will be a little cheaper. Good luck with your choices. Let us know what you've decided and why.

 

[Derrel]

One MAJOR ergonomic difference between Nikon and Canon in the digital age has been the tremendous similarity between Nikon's enthusiast body controls and the professional systems, and Canon's polar opposite: professional cameras that operate NOTHING AT ALL like the enthusiast cameras operate. Canon's earlier 1-series bodies had what many would call "bad" control systems, and Canon has re-engineered the 1D series controls and operation methods twice, if my memory serves me correctly. Keith has been a Nikon user for quite some time. Nikon's design ethos has remained quite consistent for many years; here's an interesting web link: Nikon D4 designed by Giugiaro? | Nikon Rumors

Basically, there's a rumor out there that Giorgetto Giugiaro, the actual, NAMED, KNOWN designer of the Nikon F3 camera, has had a hand in designing a "new Nikon" body that has not yet been announced. Hmmmm....Giugiaro and his Italian design firm have designed every high-end Nikon body since 1980. As NikonRumours wrote, "His company Italdesign has designed almost every high end Pro Nikon camera since 1980 (F3, F4, F5, F6, D3). We know that Nikon is conservative and likes to work with the same people they have used in the past."

Huh...Nikon has employed one of the world's most renowned design firms to design camera body ergonomics and exteriors and controls??? The 800-person Italian design firm responsible for designs for Alfa-Romeo,Audi, BMW,Bugatti,Chevrolet,Ferrari,Fiat,Hyundai,Izusu,Ford,Lamborghini,Lancia,LOtus,,Maserati,Saab,and Volkwagon (to name just a FEW!!!) has also worked on basically every high-end Nikon body design since 1980...huh...

Pay a visit to NIKON's very own web site... Nikon | Imaging Products | Nikon D Technology THE POWER TO CHANGE YOUR PHOTOGRAPHY

where Nikon shows the D3s and the D300s side by side. An for those who do not know, the "red stripe" premiered on the FIRST Nikon Giugiaro designed....the Nikon F3...

As Nikon's own web copy states,

has a long history of collaboration that began with the design of the F3 in 1980, Nikon entrusted the design and basic modeling of the D3 series to legendary Italian industrial designer Giorgetto Giugiaro.
Nikon's principal requirement was that the design be suitable for the first flagship of its new FX-format series, a new form that works as a basic platform for the new Nikon digital SLR cameras family starting with the D3. The design was to combine the basic operability inherited from the D2 series with substantial improvements in operation."

 

[Overread]

Wait - Nikon gets its cameras designed by car designers

no wonder I can never get along with them

 

[table1349]

One MAJOR ergonomic difference between Nikon and Canon in the digital age has been the tremendous similarity between Nikon's enthusiast body controls and the professional systems, and Canon's polar opposite: professional cameras that operate NOTHING AT ALL like the enthusiast cameras operate. Canon's earlier 1-series bodies had what many would call "bad" control systems, and Canon has re-engineered the 1D series controls and operation methods twice, if my memory serves me correctly. Keith has been a Nikon user for quite some time. Nikon's design ethos has remained quite consistent for many years; here's an interesting web link: Nikon D4 designed by Giugiaro? | Nikon Rumors

Basically, there's a rumor out there that Giorgetto Giugiaro, the actual, NAMED, KNOWN designer of the Nikon F3 camera, has had a hand in designing a "new Nikon" body that has not yet been announced. Hmmmm....Giugiaro and his Italian design firm have designed every high-end Nikon body since 1980. As NikonRumours wrote, "His company Italdesign has designed almost every high end Pro Nikon camera since 1980 (F3, F4, F5, F6, D3). We know that Nikon is conservative and likes to work with the same people they have used in the past."

Huh...Nikon has employed one of the world's most renowned design firms to design camera body ergonomics and exteriors and controls??? The 800-person Italian design firm responsible for designs for Alfa-Romeo,Audi, BMW,Bugatti,Chevrolet,Ferrari,Fiat,Hyundai,Izusu,Ford,Lamborghini,Lancia,LOtus,,Maserati,Saab,and Volkwagon (to name just a FEW!!!) has also worked on basically every high-end Nikon body design since 1980...huh...

Pay a visit to NIKON's very own web site... Nikon | Imaging Products | Nikon D Technology THE POWER TO CHANGE YOUR PHOTOGRAPHY

where Nikon shows the D3s and the D300s side by side. An for those who do not know, the "red stripe" premiered on the FIRST Nikon Giugiaro designed....the Nikon F3...

As Nikon's own web copy states,

has a long history of collaboration that began with the design of the F3 in 1980, Nikon entrusted the design and basic modeling of the D3 series to legendary Italian industrial designer Giorgetto Giugiaro.
Nikon's principal requirement was that the design be suitable for the first flagship of its new FX-format series, a new form that works as a basic platform for the new Nikon digital SLR cameras family starting with the D3. The design was to combine the basic operability inherited from the D2 series with substantial improvements in operation."

The F3 was the biggest Fuster Cluk that Nikon ever produced in their top line film bodies. First time I got my hands on one I KNEW I was sticking with my various F2's. The F4 was what the F3 should have been.

 

[greybeard]

Any dslr from the major camera makers will more than fill the needs of most photographers. You are really splitting hairs. Go to a store that handles several different brands and line them up. Look through the view finder, press the shutter release, take off the lens and see how it mounts. Compare them feature for feature and get the one you like the best. My choice is a Nikon d5100 but, it was a close choice between it and several other cameras. Have fun. =]

 

[Jeroenofzo]

Look at it this way; for the budget you described there are a few options.
Nikon D3100 = 3.0'' LCD, battery life for around 850 photos and Full HD video mode. Also it does autofocus in liveview.
Canon 1100D = 2.7'' LCD, Battery for 800 pictures, 720p videomode and no autofocus in liveview.
Nikon D5100 = 3.0'' Vari-angle LCD, Full HD video and superior high iso performance at 16 MP.
Canon 600D = 3.0" Vari-angle LCD, over 100k more resolution over the D5100 one. Higher MP count but high ISO performance isn't as good as the 5100. Lesser battery life due the high resolution LCD.

Now the matter is what you are going to do with it. You say portraits, I think well lit environroments, whereas high ISO doesn't really count. In a studio battery life doesn't count as much as in the field, same for the resolution of the onboard LCD's if you're hooked on to a computer screen. Video won't really matter to you, except if you want to shoot some familly stuff. Where i'm getting at is this: For the amount of money you can't buy a 'bad' camera, but maybe use it incorrectly. Personally I'd save up a little more for either the 60D or the D7000 for the superior viewfinders on there. After all, that's the main feature you're going to be using. Built in AF for the nikon can save you some money when going for used glass. The 60D has the vari-angle screen and allows for more extreme points to shoot from. If you want to go cheaper I strongly agree on the D90 option. Alas, there you have it. Atleast 7 bodies to choose from ranging from cheap to slightly out of budget.

 

[fotomumma09]

Look at it this way; for the budget you described there are a few options.
Nikon D3100 = 3.0'' LCD, battery life for around 850 photos and Full HD video mode. Also it does autofocus in liveview.
Canon 1100D = 2.7'' LCD, Battery for 800 pictures, 720p videomode and no autofocus in liveview.
Nikon D5100 = 3.0'' Vari-angle LCD, Full HD video and superior high iso performance at 16 MP.
Canon 600D = 3.0" Vari-angle LCD, over 100k more resolution over the D5100 one. Higher MP count but high ISO performance isn't as good as the 5100. Lesser battery life due the high resolution LCD.

Now the matter is what you are going to do with it. You say portraits, I think well lit environroments, whereas high ISO doesn't really count. In a studio battery life doesn't count as much as in the field, same for the resolution of the onboard LCD's if you're hooked on to a computer screen. Video won't really matter to you, except if you want to shoot some familly stuff. Where i'm getting at is this: For the amount of money you can't buy a 'bad' camera, but maybe use it incorrectly. Personally I'd save up a little more for either the 60D or the D7000 for the superior viewfinders on there. After all, that's the main feature you're going to be using. Built in AF for the nikon can save you some money when going for used glass. The 60D has the vari-angle screen and allows for more extreme points to shoot from. If you want to go cheaper I strongly agree on the D90 option. Alas, there you have it. Atleast 7 bodies to choose from ranging from cheap to slightly out of budget.

That's great info, thank you!

 

[Redbaron]

The 'feel' of a camera in my hands was about # 27 on my list of considerations. Features, functions, and performance usually occupied considerations 1 through 26,

As a pro (you) may feel that way, but the OP, like myself, is a beginner, and I'm guessing, like me, she would rather play with a camera she feels comfortable with rather than struggle with something which is either too big and cumbersome (for now), or too small and fiddly. I also stand by my comment it is a good idea to have a play with the things in or near the shop, and have the features shown to her rather than shelling out some hard earned cash for something without even trying the thing out.
No use thinking, "Canon 1D looks good" and ordering it only to find when it arrives she doesn't like the way it feels.. Same as test driving a car IMO

 

[BZSPhotography]

Well, here goes my first post. i have spent lot of time on the internet researching this kinda stuff, i currently own a 60D, which I LOVE!
As you enter your semi-pro range, i would recommend a Canon 7D or a Nikon D7000. Enjoy

 

[o hey tyler]

the a77 from what I've been reading has a pretty big noise issue at a high ISO.

LOL (Because it's true!)

 

[2WheelPhoto]

Ford vs. Chevy on car forums are winning threads too