Outdoor portrait lighting

lonewolfsx · Jun 28, 2012

Hey everyone, looking for some advice on my next lighting purchase. With Canon, I used a 550EX (old school) and a Sigma EF-510 (also old school), and they were reasonably useful flashguns, but I was limited as to where I could put them and had issues firing the Sigma off-camera. Anyway, now I've moved to Nikon with the D800 and am planning a purchase in the near future with some funds I have. I don't have my own studio. but mainly do outdoor portraiture and full-length models/seniors/pageants/events etc.

So I have a budget circling the $450 mark plus or minus (if it's $500 I wouldn't die, but lower is always good haha), and am wondering where I should go with this. I already have an on-camera SB-21 Macro Speedlight that mounts to my 105mm, which is my primary portrait lens right now. With my 24-70 I can use the pop-up flash but that's only so effective during the daytime. I'm torn between going with something like an Alien Bee AB800 plus a large softbox and stand (and a battery pack to use it outdoors), or a pair of used speedlights (possibly SB-700's, seems to me the SB-700 just as good as the 900 minus a little power).

Any opinions? If it were only headshots and such, I think I'd probably just go with the speedlights and a reflector, but since I sometimes do full length and plan on doing more shots like that in the future, I'm leaning towards a larger oval reflector and the AB800 setup, but I've never used a monolight like that and know nothing about triggering them or anything (well I understand PC Sync, but supposely the AB800 can fire wirelessly but I'm not sure how that'd work covered up with a softbox...)

One last thought, for this budget I could also scrap the flash idea and pick up something like the Nikon 85mm f/1/8G, but I feel like my 105 and 24-70 2.8 combos are solid and adding lighting is more effective than an in-between focal length. Most of my previous portraits, taken on an APS-C sensor, were equivelent to either 80mm or 135mm (50mm and 85mm on a crop cannon).

KmH · Jun 28, 2012

Speedlight power is stated as a GN number, where as monolight power is rated in watt seconds.

However, a SB-700 at full power is about 65 or 70 ws, while an AB800 is rated at 320 ws, or 4+ times more power than a SB-700 can deliver.

Alien Bee's are somewhat unusual as strobe lights in that their flash duration gets longer, rather than shorter, as power is reduced. (This is noted in the AB user's manual.)

The sensor AB's use to 'see' the flash of light that can trigger them in slave mode is on the AB rear control panel outside of the softbox. (This is also noted in the AB user's manual.)
http://www.paulcbuff.com/manuals/alienbees.pdf

Alien Bee's are also noted for having a color temperature shift as power is adjusted. AB's are not really designed to be moved around a lot, though no doubt people do use them on location.

Village Idiot · Jun 28, 2012

I guess the first question is, do you ever find yourself needing more power from your lights? If so, skip the speed lights. There's cheaper options than Bees as well.

lonewolfsx · Jun 28, 2012

Village Idiot said:
I guess the first question is, do you ever find yourself needing more power from your lights? If so, skip the speed lights. There's cheaper options than Bees as well.

Ah see, thats exactly the thing. If I were primarily shooting headshots and such like I've done in the past (full body shots I've dabbled in have been entirely natural light), I wouldn't have a problem with the power of the speedlights. But I want to get into bigger stuff, so I'm trying to future-proof my setup to some degree. I don't want to pick up speedlights then realize I need a much more powerful strobe to pull off the shot I want outdoors. I've even heard some people complain that the AB800 isn't powerful enough outdoors, so a speedlight at even less power would be even worse.

@KmH Thanks. I'm aware that the AB800 is much more powerful than the speedlights. I'm also familiar how strobes work regarding flash duration and the AB color temperature shift (they are consumerish level lights). But derr, I should've read the manual. Thank you for the link!
So I guess I just need to decide if the power increase is worth the possible change in color temp and duration if I didn't end up needed all of that power (like when I can place the lights closer like for shoulders-up pictures).

lonewolfsx · Jun 28, 2012

I've also been reading about "budget" speedlights, obviously the Yungnou and Vivitar 285's are popular, but has anyone used the Meike MK900? From the looks, it's pretty much a clone of the SB900, but with cheaper plastics and likely less quality (power/temperature) flash head. Otherwise it seems to have almost all of the same features as the SB-900, and it's "only" $180. That's slightly more than I'd be willing to risk without it being recommended by a few others first.

morganza · Jun 29, 2012

KmH said:
Speedlight power is stated as a GN number, where as monolight power is rated in watt seconds.

However, a SB-700 at full power is about 65 or 70 ws, while an AB800 is rated at 320 ws, or 4+ times more power than a SB-700 can deliver.

Alien Bee's are somewhat unusual as strobe lights in that their flash duration gets longer, rather than shorter, as power is reduced. (This is noted in the AB user's manual.)

The sensor AB's use to 'see' the flash of light that can trigger them in slave mode is on the AB rear control panel outside of the softbox. (This is also noted in the AB user's manual.)
http://www.paulcbuff.com/manuals/alienbees.pdf

Alien Bee's are also noted for having a color temperature shift as power is adjusted. AB's are not really designed to be moved around a lot, though no doubt people do use them on location.

Thanks for the link

kundalini · Jun 29, 2012

After quite a bit of reading, speaking with PCB customer service and staying within budget, I went with White Lightning line. Much better build quality and any color shift is negligible. I often use them in combination with Nikon speedlights.

Village Idiot · Jul 2, 2012

It all comes down to your budget. We could tell you to get two B1600's which would give you 640w/s or two Adorama Flash Points that would give you 600w/s each for a decent price, but if flash duration and color/exposure consistency matter enough, they'll not be good lights for what you want. The problem is, two B800's will probably cost you about $700 and that's without a battery, IIRC. My next suggestion would be an Elinchrom monolight setup or something similar, but then you're spending even more money.

You next option would be used lights. You could get something like a Speedotron pack and head system, but then if you're doing on location lighting you're going to have to deal with the weight. That's why I sold my two packs and 5 heads and went with a Dynalite setup. It's a lot more expensive than what I paid for the Speedotrons, but I need the lighter weight. When I work alone, I would have to pull a Pelican 1654 case that weighed over 100lbs for just the lights. That didn't include the battery, modifiers, and my camera bag.