Pricing, retouching, limits, happy clients

Discussion in 'Commercial/Product photography' started by Balwazer, Mar 10, 2012.

  1. Balwazer

    Balwazer TPF Noob!

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    HI all,

    I am sure this is not a new subject, but I am facing allot of trouble with this.

    I charge the following for commercial photography including fashion, advertising, portraits and food:

    $212 for one hour

    $800 for up to 4 hours

    $1326 for up to 8 hours

    But I am still under charging because the photo retouching takes allot of my time.

    In average I spend 2 hours to 3 hours when editing a fashion photo.

    The client hates the idea of limiting the photos that He or she is only getting.

    The last client asked for 15 photos retouched for a 4 hours session, if we calculate this. It will mean 15x3hours= 45hours of retouching

    If I hire a freelance Retoucher he will not do a good job as I want and he will charge me $30 per photo which means 15x$30=$450!!!

    so how should it work???

    Should I limit the files to like 1 photo retouched per hour booked?

    Should I charge separately for retouching?

    If they asked for all the photos without retouching, should I give them?

    By the way I'm from Bahrain not USA, so the cost might differ but the concept is the same.


     
  2. tirediron

    tirediron Watch the Birdy! Staff Member Supporting Member

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    My first thought is: Why does every image need two to three hours of re-touching? I would suggest start by reducing that through getting the image better in-camera. If you're doing very complicated composite work and such, make sure that the client is aware of that before-hand and that the contract indicates that 'typical' retouching or enhacement can take three or more hours. Charge the rates that you need to, and don't back down from them. As long as the client is aware ahead of time that this is an expensive process, then you're covered.
     
  3. Bossy

    Bossy No longer a newbie, moving up!

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    I was wondering the same. I'd be interested in seeing these images that require that kind of touching up?
     
  4. KmH

    KmH In memoriam Supporting Member

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    I'm wondering what is going on with the commercial use licensing and the creative fee.

    It seems the OP is doing commercial photography, but is using a retail photography business pricing model.
     
  5. Balwazer

    Balwazer TPF Noob!

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    You can visit my website to check my work www.baderalwazeer.com
     
  6. Balwazer

    Balwazer TPF Noob!

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    Can you explain more?
     
  7. tirediron

    tirediron Watch the Birdy! Staff Member Supporting Member

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    Some really nice work, but do most of those really have 3 hours of PP?

    I think Keith is referring to a per hour rate vice a per project rate.
     
  8. Balwazer

    Balwazer TPF Noob!

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    Yes most of them, the thing is I edit the files to be delivered in the highest resolution possible and they are ready to be printed on whatever size the clients need.

    So I really pay attention for the tiniest details.

    And for the girls models I don't use blurring to hide imperfection, I do real pixel by pixel cleaning.

    Some of the images I used doge and burn to even the skin tones.

    A few in my country do this amount of detailed editing most of them using blurring and smudging the skin and make it look plastic.(unless it is done in purpose and the client insisted, it's not an option for me)

    I know it is time consuming but clients already started to feel the different.

    But we get back to 0 when knowing no body wants to pay extra for the extra quality you provide.

    So I am stuck in the average price range but offering a more polished retouching( comparing to other competitors in my country)

    Can I have example of how does it work in the US, how do you charge and how many edited images you offer? And do you give unedited photos?
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2012
  9. KmH

    KmH In memoriam Supporting Member

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    So it seems what you are saying is, you lack salemanship skills, and cannot show your clients that your work has a higher intrinsic value than what they can get elsewhere.

    I was indeed referring to the use of an hourly rate.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2012
  10. Balwazer

    Balwazer TPF Noob!

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    I will not deny this, I'm not a great sales man.

    And people here are not by default well aware of defining quality work.
     
  11. tirediron

    tirediron Watch the Birdy! Staff Member Supporting Member

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    What may help you is having a before and after album. Produce say, a half-dozen images and edit them to the highest standard you can. Place them in an album with the edited version opposite the original and separated by a blank page (so that when they look at the original image, the edited version is not visible). Now, start your pitch: "Here's an image from a session with Susy; as you can see, there are some issues with her skin/hair/eyes/etc. (Point out all of the issues) Of course she's a pretty girl, but no one ever looks as good as they can right out of the camera. Because I want my clients to leave here with images that are as beautiful as they are, I ONLY provide you with the absolute most finely enhanced (Never use words like 'edit', 'touched-up' etc) images I can. Now of course, this level of craftsmanship does cost a little more, but all quality products do."

    I still feel (and I don't mean this to sound rude) that with a little more work and practice on the front-end, you could really reduce your editing time.
     
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  12. Balwazer

    Balwazer TPF Noob!

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    I liked the way you approach it, I wonder if this just an example or I can use it :)

    Is your feeling based on seeing my work? If yes then I appreciate a more clarification on how can it be improved up-front to reduce the editing?

    For example when I client asks for removing a double chin, or re constructing eyeliner because the model's eyes were tearing all the time.. I don't think it is something that can be avoid before shooting.
     

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