Question about Providing Full-Res Photos to Friends

[crownlaurel]

Why is he obligated to give away his time, effort, money and skill just because these people were too cheap to buy their own cameras? You guys are being too harsh. You don't have to be a doormat in order not to be called a jerk. I don't recall anywhere the OP mentioning charging them (I think he said he might want to sell some of the photos to others).

There is nothing wrong with providing decent quality 4X6 jpgs on disk for your friends to take to have printed. I usually just upload them to a photo lab and let people buy their own prints from there. You also don't necessarily have to provide them pictures they aren't in. They want memories of their trip.

Provide them with the pictures they are in, group photos, etc. If they want bigger pictures or if they ask specifically for a landscape photo, let them pay the photo lab for you to make 5X7 or 8X10 prints. You can upload to online photo labs and give them a password so they can choose print sizes.

 

[JerryPH]

Why is he obligated to give away his time, effort, money and skill just because these people were too cheap to buy their own cameras?

Becuase he told everyone he said he was going to do JUST that. Its not a question now of charging, he said he would do it for free.

What he did not say was how or what he would give them from his camera. If he has ANY concerns about the abuse of his pics, he should have thought of that before offering to be "the nice guy". As it now stands, he painted himself into a corner. If he doesn't do what he said, he appears the jerk. If he charges, he appears the jerk. If he lowers the res of his pics compared to everyone else's, he appears the jerk. If he tries to sell his stuff to them, he appears the jerk.

There is just one move to do in this case, follow through with what he promised to do, learn from this lesson and think a little more in the future.

Only thing he can do is hold off on some pics that he feels he wants to place in competition or not have dsitributed without his permission. He basically gave up all other rights when he offered what he did.

 

[crownlaurel]

I didn't get teh idea he ran out and offered to take all the pictures and give free hi res images. It sounded to me like he was taking pictures and his friends who didn't bring cameras started asking him to make sure he gave them copies. That happens to me all the time and it's hard to say "no, you should have brought a camera" at that moment. People think they can obligate me to take all the pictures since I have a bigger camera and then they think they can obligate me to give them copies of all of them. I just don't oblige.

And unless you have a recorded copy of the conversation, how do you know he promised high resolution images of everything he took? You seem to be assuming that he eagarly asked everyone not to bring their cameras so he could take all the pictures and then get stingy afterward.

And how does giving them a decent 4X6 file of the pictures they are in make him out to be a jerk? Unless their cameras shoot in RAW or have 10MP files they don't have to majorly crop, he's probably still giving them more than they could have had otherwise.

Man, the entitlement age has gone so far.

 

[Rrr3319]

hmm. i guess my question is, what is your biggest concern here? do you think they will try to steal your pictures and sell them for profit? i could be completely wrong here, but my assumption is that they all are expecting to get a nice little copy of pictures, maybe to print for an album or as you said, make some prints for their office. again, not knowing anything about them i can only assume, but i don't think the average person is going to look at this as their big chance to steal all of your photos, sell them for big bucks and retire back to hawaii. my guess would be that when they receive the dvd they won't give any thought to it other than maybe showing their friends and family to say "look how awesome hawaii is!"
in response to the comments on why you have to give up all your time and skills... you're going to do it anyway. even if they weren't in the picture, it seems to me you'd be editing them for yourself.
if you feel you've made a mistake in promising to do this for them, then i suppose it's your choice whether to just learn from it or keep all of your pictures out of it. personally, i'd do what you said you were going to do; give them a dvd with everyone's pictures on it. if you are super-attached to a couple and are that afraid they'll be stolen from you, then keep some out. i don't think this is as much of a problem as you are perceiving it to be. again, i could be wrong, just my opinion.

 

[astrostu]

Alright, the last few posts have been slightly more comforting. But basically the situation is what crownlaurel said with a little bit of JerryPH.

Regardless, I talked with a friend of mine that went on the trip and I showed her some of the prints. Her first question was, after seeing them, "Are those for sale?" So off of that, I explained basically this thread to her. She basically agreed with me on several points:

- I did agree to give the photos to people (digital copies).

- Watermarking them would appear arrogant.

- I shouldn't really worry about this particular group of people printing them off and trying to sell them as their own work, especially if I explain to them when I hand out the disk with the photos that I'm working on developing my photographic skills to do this semi-professionally, and that while they can use the photos personally, that I still maintain the copyright and they can't sell them, etc. She thought that making a statement along those lines wouldn't seem too arrogant nor tacky, but just explain it.

- She thinks it's a good idea if when I give out the disk that I also bring some of the prints I made and ask if people would like me to order them for cost plus a small bit extra (like maybe 25% for gas and time). So a 4x6 would be 25¢, 8x12 $2, 12x18 $3.50, and 12x36 $6.50. And say that if people would like other prints after looking at them, I'd be happy to run them off at those prices.

- She also volunteered the idea that I shouldn't offer to give out my photos for next year's field trip, which will be to Yellowstone.


So I think that's the best of both worlds. In other words, I'm still doing what I initially said I would - give people digital copies of the photos I took and put them on a disk with others' photos from the trip. And while I can't control what people do with the files afterwards, I've at least explained the situation to them, and I've also provided them a simple way to get prints themselves where I control the process, and my printer puts a small printed "Copyright" and my name on the back of the print.

While I think that the invitation to make prints for folks could be sketchy, I think that if it can be tactfully done then I won't come off as seeming too full of myself. It will be a "look at me" moment without the obvious "look at me" part, if that makes sense.

 

[Rrr3319]

:thumbup: sounds like a good solution.

 

[JerryPH]

- She also volunteered the idea that I shouldn't offer to give out my photos for next year's field trip, which will be to Yellowstone.

It all sounds good, except her last suggestion, that one I think is the BEST. I would also add that you no longer make any more "offers" unless you think things out a lot better.

Old czech saying roughly translated is: "with one butt, you cannot sit on two chairs". Make a decision and stick to it, don't change it afterwards.

If I was one of your friends, I would either decline the CD and your offer to print out anything for me as I would feel as if you were trying to make money off me, even if it is a small amount.

Your original offer was to give me everyone's pics on a CD... not to give me your CD with everyone's pics on it and place restrictions on it... even if I had no initial desire to do anything more than to make a screen saver for myself at home.

A gift with strings attached is no gift and friends do not do that to their friends.

 

[Peanuts]

Well, personally from what I have read from your initial post (haven't read the rest) I would slap the full res files on a single disc, have them pass it along and make new discs for each other. I don't think it is fair in this circumstance when you offered to take their images to charge them up the gazoo (not saying your prices are high, but I personally would be quite peeved if someone offered to take my photos on a trip, then decided to profit when I wasn't aware of that beforehand)

If there are ones special to you and you alone (some sunset panoramics for instance) you don't have to include those - if they ask, just say you will provide them with a web sized image.

Personal opinion.

 

[astrostu]

If I was one of your friends, I would either decline the CD and your offer to print out anything for me as I would feel as if you were trying to make money off me, even if it is a small amount.

Your original offer was to give me everyone's pics on a CD... not to give me your CD with everyone's pics on it and place restrictions on it... even if I had no initial desire to do anything more than to make a screen saver for myself at home.

A gift with strings attached is no gift and friends do not do that to their friends.

I disagree with this (these) statement(s) for three main reasons.

First, we are all in science - either geologists, astronomers, or some combination of the two - and so we are used to citing our sources and not copying stuff that's not ours. Before this "issue" even came up (as in before I had looked at my photos), I told people that all the files would have a prefix with the last name of the photographer so everyone knew who did what and that I would include any restrictions anyone wanted in a README file that will go on the disk.

Second, I'm really not trying to make a profit on these. Gas is expensive, the place that I print them is off a toll road, and it does take time to have them printed, pick them up, and then deliver them to people.

Third, it's not a gift with strings attached, per say. There have been numerous discussions on this site about friends asking for copies of photos and the like, and the consensus has been that if you provide them with a digital copy, make sure they know the copyright still belongs to you - it's your intellectual property regardless of whether you give them the file, give them a print, watermark it, etc. Me verbalizing it in a non-confrontational and tactful manner simply would reinforce that. And the friend that I mentioned in my previous post is much more practical and tactful than I and has offered to help me with the wording.

 

[Peanuts]

Eh? If you aren't printing them you don't have to pay for gas to get the prints.

I would still hand them a CD with the full res files, included with a release from them to print. That doesn't mean you are signing copyright over.

I am also in sciences and have had correct citing pounded into my head, so I see where you are coming from, but if it is 'people' pictures I don't get the whole deal. Technically you can't do much with them without releases from them so...

As you stated

I will be including a README file on the DVD, and in it I will at least have for my photos a statement saying something to the effect that they are for personal use only, they cannot be edited nor used for any commercial purpose, and any use must have a caption stating that I did the photo.

I would leave it at that and not even get money involved - that can get dirty.