You got my attention........

[kundalini]

.......To make a point, I have frequently, and still do, take photos of random stuffed animals around my house for practice. Trying new lighting techniques. Trying out new camera settings. Testing the effects of different Depths of field/focal lengths......

Meet Winston......

..... and Friends.

And because I like to hear myself talk, I'll quote my earlier post on page 1.

These photos are better than the other thread showing that you have a knack for capturing emotion in your images. This is a good thing. Concentrate on the fundamentals of lighting, exposure and composition. I've made this suggestion (from personal experience) to take an inanimate object and run through the paces of aperture, shutter speed and ISO settings. Keep good notes on what has worked and what has failed. When you are confused on why certain settings yield poor results, certainly post and ask. But TBH, you should set aside many hours of lonely and boring practice until these results become second nature. If you snap off a shot and see the bad blinkies or your histogram is off the charts, then you should then be able to make a few adjustments to get it back within reason. It won't happen next week or next month, but before you know it it WILL happen with perseverance on your part.[/COLOR]

You absolutely cannot under appreciate the VALUE of the art of practing with a purpose. This is where you will hone your mad photog skillz.
.

 

[Elizabeth30]

Professional Photographer vs Artist.

Both are valid and worthwhile endeavors and are not mutually exclusive, but they are different.

An artist with true talent can make a living while doing only the work that they want to do. But that is rare. The typical venues will be galleries and art fairs. If people like the work, they might want to hire you for a shoot and give you full creative control. Again, that is rare.

People are called starving artists for a reason.

A professional photographer may have a style or particular subject matter that they specialize in, but they are essentially hired guns to perform a particular task. And that task is whatever the client wants. A professional will be ready and capable to handle any task assigned to them. That means having the technical skills as well as talent.

I started out being an "artist". I did portraits and landscapes. People hired me to do natural, environmental portraits of their families. And I had a landscape architect that needed a portfolio. He liked my artistic approach to landscapes. All was good. I was a working pro! I was making money with my camera. That is until my landscape client referred me to his friend. The guy called me up and said he heard wasa pro photographer and that he needed a product shot of a few boxes of office supplies. It seemed simple, put the boxes on a table and shoot them. No big deal. Long story short, there were so many mistakes such as bad focus, bad lighting, bad exposure that the guy came close to shoving my camera into a place on me where the sun don't shine. As he stormed out he asked how I dared to call myself a pro when I couldn't shoot a simple box of paper.

That is when I decided that if I was going to make a living as a photographer, I better learn what I was doing. For the next 18 months I shot nothing but 4 different shaped blocks of wood...a cylinder, a cone, a square block and a sphere...all painted white. I set them up on a table by the window and started shooting. I learned exposure, composition, DOF and lighting. I added a fill light. I moved into a studio and started working with one light, then two, then three etc. Different backgrounds and bases. My output was contact sheets only, no darkroom manipulation. It had to be perfect in the camera or it got done over.

I forgot about trying to be an artist but worked on mastering my craft. The art could (and did) come later. And when I did start getting artistic again, I had the skills to produce what I was seeing in my head accurately and quickly. The Zen of photography comes when you forget that you are making photos and totally lose yourself in the moment. You won't even notice the camera and neither will your subject.

That won't happen until the basic skills are as automatic as breathing. No matter how good your natural voice may be, you need to learn to talk before you can sing.

It ain't easy, but no one ever said that it should be.

onelove

Wow! Very strong words of advice here and touching. You have my convinced. I feel overwhelmed with everything I still need to learn. Should I work on DOF for a month and then move to Lighting, should I do 1 day on lighting and then composition the next day. should I read books or practice shooting or both in the same day. AHHHHH! I feel out of control. :/

 

[Elizabeth30]

.......To make a point, I have frequently, and still do, take photos of random stuffed animals around my house for practice. Trying new lighting techniques. Trying out new camera settings. Testing the effects of different Depths of field/focal lengths......

Meet Winston......




..... and Friends.







.

Winston's cute, can I have a date? LOL Well I will be practicing then!! There are 101 stuffed animals in my house and 5 beautiful children to practice on as well.

 

[Elizabeth30]

I'm almost afraid to say this but in the last two days I have learned an IMMENSE amount about myself and my goals! I no longer consider myself a good photographer but rather a unskilled photographer is training. So, with all the comments about my editing and my monitor needing calibrated, I should probably stop trying to see my Photoshop actions huh? Yup, I did it! Made actions and put my name on them trying to sell. What a disaster that could be! Gonna take them off the web immediately!!!

 

[Destin]

I'm almost afraid to say this but in the last two days I have learned an IMMENSE amount about myself and my goals! I no longer consider myself a good photographer but rather a unskilled photographer is training. So, with all the comments about my editing and my monitor needing calibrated, I should probably stop trying to see my Photoshop actions huh? Yup, I did it! Made actions and put my name on them trying to sell. What a disaster that could be! Gonna take them off the web immediately!!!

Datacolor Spyder3Express Color Calibration System DC S3X100 B&HYou REALLLLLLY need to invest in one of these. And then an external monitor to hook up to your laptop so you can see what you're doing. Until you have at least the calibrator that I linked to, you may as well not even open photoshop up.

I realize that's a bold statement. But it's true.

 

[Elizabeth30]

I'm almost afraid to say this but in the last two days I have learned an IMMENSE amount about myself and my goals! I no longer consider myself a good photographer but rather a unskilled photographer is training. So, with all the comments about my editing and my monitor needing calibrated, I should probably stop trying to see my Photoshop actions huh? Yup, I did it! Made actions and put my name on them trying to sell. What a disaster that could be! Gonna take them off the web immediately!!!

Datacolor Spyder3Express Color Calibration System DC S3X100 B&HYou REALLLLLLY need to invest in one of these. And then an external monitor to hook up to your laptop so you can see what you're doing. Until you have at least the calibrator that I linked to, you may as well not even open photoshop up.

I realize that's a bold statement. But it's true.

Well shoot!! That looks like a really nifty calibrator BUT I have no money!! UHG! I was really honestly thinking I could just start a photo biz and improve as I go to help compensate for my husbands loss of work. NOPE! And really have no way to make any $. We are on the verge of lose our small 2 bed room duplex with our 5 kids! I don't know what to do but I can't even afford a tooth pick right now. :/

 

[MLeeK]

Professional Photographer vs Artist.

Both are valid and worthwhile endeavors and are not mutually exclusive, but they are different.

An artist with true talent can make a living while doing only the work that they want to do. But that is rare. The typical venues will be galleries and art fairs. If people like the work, they might want to hire you for a shoot and give you full creative control. Again, that is rare.

People are called starving artists for a reason.

A professional photographer may have a style or particular subject matter that they specialize in, but they are essentially hired guns to perform a particular task. And that task is whatever the client wants. A professional will be ready and capable to handle any task assigned to them. That means having the technical skills as well as talent.

I started out being an "artist". I did portraits and landscapes. People hired me to do natural, environmental portraits of their families. And I had a landscape architect that needed a portfolio. He liked my artistic approach to landscapes. All was good. I was a working pro! I was making money with my camera. That is until my landscape client referred me to his friend. The guy called me up and said he heard wasa pro photographer and that he needed a product shot of a few boxes of office supplies. It seemed simple, put the boxes on a table and shoot them. No big deal. Long story short, there were so many mistakes such as bad focus, bad lighting, bad exposure that the guy came close to shoving my camera into a place on me where the sun don't shine. As he stormed out he asked how I dared to call myself a pro when I couldn't shoot a simple box of paper.

That is when I decided that if I was going to make a living as a photographer, I better learn what I was doing. For the next 18 months I shot nothing but 4 different shaped blocks of wood...a cylinder, a cone, a square block and a sphere...all painted white. I set them up on a table by the window and started shooting. I learned exposure, composition, DOF and lighting. I added a fill light. I moved into a studio and started working with one light, then two, then three etc. Different backgrounds and bases. My output was contact sheets only, no darkroom manipulation. It had to be perfect in the camera or it got done over.

I forgot about trying to be an artist but worked on mastering my craft. The art could (and did) come later. And when I did start getting artistic again, I had the skills to produce what I was seeing in my head accurately and quickly. The Zen of photography comes when you forget that you are making photos and totally lose yourself in the moment. You won't even notice the camera and neither will your subject.

That won't happen until the basic skills are as automatic as breathing. No matter how good your natural voice may be, you need to learn to talk before you can sing.

It ain't easy, but no one ever said that it should be.

onelove

Wow! Very strong words of advice here and touching. You have my convinced. I feel overwhelmed with everything I still need to learn. Should I work on DOF for a month and then move to Lighting, should I do 1 day on lighting and then composition the next day. should I read books or practice shooting or both in the same day. AHHHHH! I feel out of control. :/

You can't start with DOF and lighting, you have to first start with exposure and understanding each element and what does in terms of exposure and creatively. Once you understand that and how to control it, then move to DOF and motion-stopping motion and capturing motion. THEN move to adding in lighting. Don't mix in lighting while you are learning the very basics. Flash changes the rules a bit and can change them a WHOLE LOT if you get into advanced flash techniques. Until you know how to control the basics adding light will actually make it much harder on you to learn.
You have to build a foundation. Kind of like in grade school: First you learned to count to 10. Then you learned to count to 100. Then you learned to add and subtract. Then you learned to multiply and divide... They are all layered starting with the basic first. Same thing here.
I have some materials you are welcomed to if you are interested send me a PM and I'll link you.

You WILL get there and if your un-edited images are any indication it won't take you all that long. You have an eye for what you want to capture and you have figured out how to at least accidentally get it. Now we just need to get you to where you can get it 100% every time all by yourself without praying it's right.
If you really want to develop a style like the one you've shown you absolutely can do that.
Photoshop and editing are the same as photography. You have to learn the basics first and the where and how and why of it AND what it will look like in print-because looking good on a monitor is not always the same as a print. You can get away with much on a monitor that looks exactly the same in print but when compared side by side you wouldn't like the print so much.
You often mention raw and that's where you need to start in Photoshop. You have to know how to fully use the raw editor and what each thing does AND how to properly use it because (again) you are working on a monitor and what may look amazing on the monitor-which is actually a very small image compared to print-will look like total dog poop in print. I truly do not edit more than 95% of the time and the edits I do are only things like adding a texture or designing an album, etc. EVERYTHING is done in Adobe camera raw. I cannot afford a minute an image to edit. Your style or what you are pointing to as your style does not even require that you open PS for most of it.
I also have some awesome resources on PS from raw to polish you are welcomed to use if you want them.

Well shoot!! That looks like a really nifty calibrator BUT I have no money!! UHG! I was really honestly thinking I could just start a photo biz and improve as I go to help compensate for my husbands loss of work. NOPE! And really have no way to make any $. We are on the verge of lose our small 2 bed room duplex with our 5 kids! I don't know what to do but I can't even afford a tooth pick right now. :/

For the calibration-order several 8x10 prints and do your best to make your monitor look like them. When you get the prints in let us know and we'll come up with some good resources for hand calibrating for the time being.

I can understand your reasoning and thought process, however photography isn't something you can make a quick buck at. A LOT of people with that first DSLR think it is and A LOT of them end up selling their gear when they realize that in reality they just lost a LOT of money making that $50 CD for a client. A wise person said... The quickest way to make money in photography is to sell your gear. It's totally true.
We don't want you to fail-or anyone else. That's why we do what we do around here. Success is there for the asking.
ANY business that is not started with a thorough business plan and a GOOD education in BUSINESS is pretty doomed from the get go. Your business education doesn't have to be in school either just like your photography education doesn't have to be in school. But you do have to have the business end covered. You didn't even know that you were losing a TON of money when you sold that $50 CD. You probably literally lost about $50 to $100 assuming that you have next to nothing invested in gear, computer, programs, etc. You didn't hand the money out that day. You have already bought your gear PERSONALLY. You have to pay back "personally." You also have to be putting $ in the kitty for the next camera and the additional gear you NEED. You also didn't consider sales tax.
Please, please, please don't get caught advertising any kind of business on facebook or the internet by the state. They are truly out there trolling for un-registered businesses. I've been checked, I know others who have been checked and we just had someone posting in here a short while ago who had their town find out which then turned to the state and the IRS. She was in the same exact financial boat as you just trying to survive with her kids. You have to know what your requirements are for your municipality, county, state and of course federal.
Back there somewhere someone said you made $16.66 per hour. That was BEFORE you considered gas in your vehicle and wear and tear (you had to have the vehicle insured and registered to be able to use it.) Before you considered the cost of the equipment or the CD or the computer to make it. When you add all of THOSE things in you made NEGATIVE money.
Business is complicated and it's expensive. There are a LOT of programs out there for women and minority businesses for education and even for loans and grants. Take a look at The U.S. Small Business Administration | SBA.gov There is a wealth of information there and there is usually a local chapter of the SBA or SBDC (small business development corp.) They do FREE business workshops at local colleges across the country. Take them!!!!

If you are in a financial pickle take a good hard look at college. You would then qualify for state and federal college money. Each semester my husband gets back roughly $2K from his state and federal grants that goes to pay his living expenses while in college. You could take business or basket weaving or even photography. When doing that you are getting 2 things from it-obviously the education and a little bit of a shot in the income dept. Not much, but it helps a little. And the education is free. Education is NEVER a waste.

While you are building a business that has a plan and will succeed find something else. Troll the salvation army and start selling crap on ebay or God knows there are a million ways to do it. Hell, I see people selling total CRAP on craigslist every day that you know came out of someone's unwanted crap! Do clean-outs after people move, pick up some house cleaning for others... There are a million things you can do in the mean time for a buck or two. This is a business you want to invest in properly and to succeed in the long term. You want to build something here and you can-if you do it right.

 

[Destin]

I'm almost afraid to say this but in the last two days I have learned an IMMENSE amount about myself and my goals! I no longer consider myself a good photographer but rather a unskilled photographer is training. So, with all the comments about my editing and my monitor needing calibrated, I should probably stop trying to see my Photoshop actions huh? Yup, I did it! Made actions and put my name on them trying to sell. What a disaster that could be! Gonna take them off the web immediately!!!

Datacolor Spyder3Express Color Calibration System DC S3X100 B&HYou REALLLLLLY need to invest in one of these. And then an external monitor to hook up to your laptop so you can see what you're doing. Until you have at least the calibrator that I linked to, you may as well not even open photoshop up.

I realize that's a bold statement. But it's true.

Well shoot!! That looks like a really nifty calibrator BUT I have no money!! UHG! I was really honestly thinking I could just start a photo biz and improve as I go to help compensate for my husbands loss of work. NOPE! And really have no way to make any $. We are on the verge of lose our small 2 bed room duplex with our 5 kids! I don't know what to do but I can't even afford a tooth pick right now. :/

I'm currently unemployed also, so I feel your pain. I've been out putting applications in EVERYWHERE, but nobody is hiring right now. It's terrible. Granted I'm young and have no kids, and not many bills, but it still sucks. Hope things work out for you!

 

[Elizabeth30]

While you are building a business that has a plan and will succeed find something else. Troll the salvation army and start selling crap on ebay or God knows there are a million ways to do it. Hell, I see people selling total CRAP on craigslist every day that you know came out of someone's unwanted crap! Do clean-outs after people move, pick up some house cleaning for others... There are a million things you can do in the mean time for a buck or two. This is a business you want to invest in properly and to succeed in the long term. You want to build something here and you can-if you do it right.

You are such a sweetheart! I love EVERYTHING you advise me on! I will take this to heart and yes would love any resource you can give me! Funny you should say "troll the Salvation army" Because that's where I just came from! HA! I have been "trolling" the Salvation army and selling crap on ebay for about 10 months now. Not a great profit but yea it's a buck or two and I also have a cleaning job, I lastly I make hair bows and tutus for little girls and sell those. But it's still not enough. My husband is getting about $1200 a month on unemployment and looking for a job EVERY DAY! We are 3 months behind on our rent and about to get our power and phones shut off too! Luckily I can get help for the power bill but everything else is falling apart. we just keep falling behind. $1200 a month plus whatever I make in my side businesses cannot support a family of 7!! IT SUCKS!!!

 

[inallseriousness]

^THIS! People are a vertical subject... we are long and skinny on a vertical axis (except for Roseanne!) So make the viewfinder fit that subject.. like I mentioned in a previous post! Shooting people in landscape is a NOOB thing to do, unless there is a really good reason! And NOT knowing better (when you have been told) is not a good reason.

This seems like as good a place as any to jump in...

Choosing to shoot people in a horizontal orientation has nothing to do with one's time spent behind the camera. ("Shooting people in landscape is a NOOB thing to do...") Shooting someone in vertical orientation doesn't define you as experienced any more than shooting someone in horizontal orientation designates you as inexperienced. It's beyond ludicrous to even make such a suggestion.

Both formats have their inherent qualities for conveying a wonderful portrait. Vertical orientation allows more of the body, of course. They also tend to have more of a formal quality. Horizontal orientation allows, if one chooses, to include more of the surroundings giving an environmental context. We're very used to seeing in this format - television, movies, computer monitors. They also tend to have more of an informal vibe.

"And NOT knowing better (when you have been told) is not a good reason." Wow. When you have been told? Dad, is that you? wth?

No, there does not have to be a really good reason to shoot a portrait in a horizontal orientation. Hell, shoot both... see which you like better.

And really? Portrait and Landscape is language better suited to telling your printer how you want to print your latest manifesto. (I'd go portrait, by the way) Photographers shoot in vertical and horizontal orientations.

 

[inallseriousness]

Here's my photo of the day. Experimenting with shutter speed and exposure. I figured snow was a good way to practice not over exposing my photos.

A quick edit - 1:1 crop, corrected the underexposure on her only and left the background dark. Her OOF face cannot be made in focus.:

The edit is so washed out. Definitely not an improvement. The deep pink on the nose and cheeks from the cold is all but vanished. The hat is washed out. The crop makes the photo less interesting. There's already a downward gaze to contend with, now all the snow falling around the child is nearly gone as well. More is more in this case - more snow. This one tells a much better story with more of the environment.

 

[punch]

Datacolor Spyder3Express Color Calibration System DC S3X100 B&HYou REALLLLLLY need to invest in one of these. And then an external monitor to hook up to your laptop so you can see what you're doing. Until you have at least the calibrator that I linked to, you may as well not even open photoshop up.

I realize that's a bold statement. But it's true.

Well shoot!! That looks like a really nifty calibrator BUT I have no money!! UHG! I was really honestly thinking I could just start a photo biz and improve as I go to help compensate for my husbands loss of work. NOPE! And really have no way to make any $. We are on the verge of lose our small 2 bed room duplex with our 5 kids! I don't know what to do but I can't even afford a tooth pick right now. :/

For God's sake... if people were paying you even $50 for a photo shoot, regardless of whether or not you're deemed ready by people and you're also losing your home... then I say ignore people and take the $50. Seriously. If you need money and clients are paying, then take the money. :| It's not like they don't know what they're getting.

 

[rexbobcat]

Well shoot!! That looks like a really nifty calibrator BUT I have no money!! UHG! I was really honestly thinking I could just start a photo biz and improve as I go to help compensate for my husbands loss of work. NOPE! And really have no way to make any $. We are on the verge of lose our small 2 bed room duplex with our 5 kids! I don't know what to do but I can't even afford a tooth pick right now. :/

For God's sake... if people were paying you even $50 for a photo shoot, regardless of whether or not you're deemed ready by people and you're also losing your home... then I say ignore people and take the $50. Seriously. If you need money and clients are paying, then take the money. :| It's not like they don't know what they're getting.

That's what I say. I mean, if you show someone your portfolio and they like it, they can't really complain when the images they get are similar to the ones that you show them....unless you show them a portfolio of work that spans 30 years, in which you've only gotten a handful of good photos in that time. Consistency is key. If you're consistent with your images, then people won't be angry when you produce what was expected.

 

[Bitter Jeweler]

Here's my photo of the day. Experimenting with shutter speed and exposure. I figured snow was a good way to practice not over exposing my photos.

A quick edit - 1:1 crop, corrected the underexposure on her only and left the background dark. Her OOF face cannot be made in focus.:

The edit is so washed out. Definitely not an improvement. The deep pink on the nose and cheeks from the cold is all but vanished. The hat is washed out. The crop makes the photo less interesting. There's already a downward gaze to contend with, now all the snow falling around the child is nearly gone as well. More is more in this case - more snow. This one tells a much better story with more of the environment.

Yep, you can't polish a turd.

 

[thereyougo!]

Here's my photo of the day. Experimenting with shutter speed and exposure. I figured snow was a good way to practice not over exposing my photos.

A quick edit - 1:1 crop, corrected the underexposure on her only and left the background dark. Her OOF face cannot be made in focus.:

The edit is so washed out. Definitely not an improvement. The deep pink on the nose and cheeks from the cold is all but vanished. The hat is washed out. The crop makes the photo less interesting. There's already a downward gaze to contend with, now all the snow falling around the child is nearly gone as well. More is more in this case - more snow. This one tells a much better story with more of the environment.

The area around the girl has little interest. Keith was just trying to recover part of the shot. The shot doesn't work because her legs have been amputated and she is looking down at her feet. There are indeed times when a landscape orientation works, but definitely not here.