CANON 7D realesed!!!

[gsgary]

Aside from the ISO side (which I am going to wait on till its in peoples hands and in use) this camera is exciting me far more than the 50D did - weathersealing, fast AF and FPS, a flash commander mode, a host of other things and a nice crop sensor video mode (with full manual controls and such). All things I mostly want!

The ISO is the big one for me still though - its what I feel most lacking in my 400D, along with weathersealing aspects - the rest is a nice boon.

Gary, don't you use a 1D model camera anyway - I agree if your in the 1D line of things (and budget) then waiting for the 1DM4 is the best thing to do, but I think for many others this could very well be the upgrade camera for them. Certainly I feel that is a stronger midrange camera than the 50D was

I won't be waiting for a 1Dmk4, when it comes out i will get a cheap MK3 or a 1DS MK3 most top sports photographers actually use a 1DS

 

[blash]

First of all, the 40D and 50D were good at high ISO's. Nikon played catch up until they put out the D90.

How do you know the D300 has better AF performance and ergonomics? Have you held a 7D? Have you seen the AF working? The camera was just announced this week.

You know why the 5D MKII is so hard to find? All the videographers that are shooting video. SLR photographers may not, but there are sure a hell of a lot of video people that were super excited about the 5D MKII and use it. I think it's even getting some time in the spot light for being used in some up coming main stream movie or another.

1) I refer to DPReview's 50D review: Canon EOS 50D Review: 31. Conclusion: Digital Photography Review

"in terms of per-pixel sharpness the 50D cannot quite keep up with the better 10 or 12 megapixel APS-C DSLRs in the market. At higher sensitivities the smaller photosites are clearly producing more noise (as shown from our RAW comparisons) and so Canon is having to apply more noise reduction to keep to acceptable noise levels, this of course means a loss of detail from ISO 1600 upwards."

And

"At a pixel density of 4.5 MP/cm² (40D: 3.1 MP/cm², 1Ds MkIII: 2.4 MP/cm²) the lens becomes the limiting factor. Even the sharpest primes at optimal apertures cannot (at least away from the center of the frame) satisfy the 15.1 megapixel sensors hunger for resolution."

And finally:

"In some areas such as dynamic range and high ISO performance it's actually worse and that simply makes you wonder if the EOS 50D could have been an (even) better camera if its sensor had a slightly more moderate resolution."

which makes me think, we're probably going to see the same concerns about the 7D now. In fact, after seeing the sample images that DPReview took, I have to be a bit concerned with even ISO 800 performance which shows significant loss of detail and noise. From Canon EOS 7D Preview Samples Gallery: Digital Photography Review

http://a.img-dpreview.com/gallery/canoneos7d_preview/originals/img_2601.jpg
2) I'm referring more to the 51-point AF sensor on the D300 with that general "AF is better" statement.

3) I never said adding video to the 5DMkII or to cameras in general was a bad business decision. It's obviously making Nikon and Canon some money. However, it doesn't apply to *my* criteria as a customer nor to many other customers like me, and therefore I couldn't give two twats about whether video was or was not included so long as some other feature didn't suffer as a result.

 

[Overread]

any chance you could change that image to a link? only its massssive and really slowing down the page (And I can't imagin how slow it is for dialup users)

 

[icassell]

I'm sorta interested in the other end too ... it has (if I read it correctly) ISO 50 too.

 

[Hobbes]

1) I refer to DPReview's 50D review: Canon EOS 50D Review: 31. Conclusion: Digital Photography Review

"in terms of per-pixel sharpness the 50D cannot quite keep up with the better 10 or 12 megapixel APS-C DSLRs in the market. At higher sensitivities the smaller photosites are clearly producing more noise (as shown from our RAW comparisons) and so Canon is having to apply more noise reduction to keep to acceptable noise levels, this of course means a loss of detail from ISO 1600 upwards."

And

"At a pixel density of 4.5 MP/cm² (40D: 3.1 MP/cm², 1Ds MkIII: 2.4 MP/cm²) the lens becomes the limiting factor. Even the sharpest primes at optimal apertures cannot (at least away from the center of the frame) satisfy the 15.1 megapixel sensors hunger for resolution."

And finally:

"In some areas such as dynamic range and high ISO performance it's actually worse and that simply makes you wonder if the EOS 50D could have been an (even) better camera if its sensor had a slightly more moderate resolution."

which makes me think, we're probably going to see the same concerns about the 7D now. In fact, after seeing the sample images that DPReview took, I have to be a bit concerned with even ISO 800 performance which shows significant loss of detail and noise. From Canon EOS 7D Preview Samples Gallery: Digital Photography Review

That's exactly what I tried to say with my post in another related thread. I actually ordered the 50D a while ago but changed my mind after reading several reviews and learned that there would be a replacement soon and this is the replacement, an even higher resolution sensor -.- I knew something is wrong with the 50D when the salesperson at the camera store told me with lowered voice that 50D is inferior to my 40D in high ISO performance. I am waiting impatiently for reviews on the 7D and see the high ISO sample pictures with my own eyes but until then I will remain skeptic

and I wonder how many people in this forum who is using dial up. I mean you have to live in the middle of nowhere like Siberia or northern Canada to not be able to use broadband connection.

 

[Playdo]

No spot meter linked to focus point? This should have been a bare essential before adding any of the glitz. Why?

 

[musicaleCA]

I'm sorta interested in the other end too ... it has (if I read it correctly) ISO 50 too.

Eh? I only saw ISO 100.

As for high ISOs, geese you guys are being incredibly anal-retentive about this. Look at it from the PoV of someone who wants to upgrade. Compared to a lowly 450D, the 7D blows it out of the water with high ISO performance. On the 450D, ISO 400 is the top end of things being clean. At 800 you need serious noise-removal (pitiful Lightroom (!) can't handle it; you need something like Topaz DeNoise or Nik Define to make it close to usable, and then down-sample to cover-up the blurriness...and then sharpen and pray that it works...). ISO 1600 is so disgusting it's useless, and can't be recovered.

The 7D, on the other hand, after looking at the images on DPR, is stellar by comparison. ISO 12800 only looks as bad as ISO 800 on the 450D. That's pretty awesome from where I'm sitting, stuck in a world of ISO 400. The 7D would give me 4 more stops of clean, usable ISO speed, and an extra stop on top of that if I need clean-up. Um, yeah, 4-stops more? I can deal with that. Then maybe my recycle times on my 580 would be reasonable indoors and I wouldn't have to switch-out my batteries all the time.

It's all about perspective.

As for resolution, again, big whoop. I see that as "Yay! I have more information to play with!" Perhaps this will translate into more accurate healing and cloning in some cases, perhaps not. But as for the lens not providing the necessary resolution to squeeze every last pixel of detail? Please, when was the last time you ever uploaded a full-resolution 15MP (let alone 18MP) image to the web? It's not done (at the very least we can agree it's not common practise). Down-sample, and things get sharper. Hooray! (And that the very least, with more pixels of information to work with, noise-removal software is more likely to have a better time of removing noise. So while ISO 1600 on the 450D's 12MP sensor might be impossible to recover, with 18MP to work with, ISO 12800 just might be cleanable. Maybe.)

 

[usayit]

My opinion.....

I too am skeptical of cramming even more sensor sites into a small area. My guess is that the 5D Mark I slightly used is still a better buy than the 7D brand new. That's were I'm headed.... 5D Mark I to accompany my 1D mark II. Both compliment each other quite nicely.

(the 5D Mark I will still have to wait as funds are dedicated to something else at the moment).

 

[icassell]

I'm sorta interested in the other end too ... it has (if I read it correctly) ISO 50 too.

Eh? I only saw ISO 100.

If you look in the "Camera Controls" section of the DP review under Top of Camera Controls, it says there is an L1 setting (ISO 50) and an H setting (ISO12800) which are both enabled with the C.Fn1-3 control. I can't find this anywhere else in the article.

 

[rom4n301]

Now, now ... there were many large-format users who poo-pooed (and those that still do) 35mm film (what many hold up as the 'gold standard' sensor size) when that came out ... and many pros showed how good it could be (and I have seen incredible images taken with smaller format than that). Why is full-frame 35 such a technological limit in your eyes?

uhm what i hate bout it is that if i get a 50mm lens its not really ganna be 50mm.. and if i get a 70-200 lens.. its not really ganna be 70-200

And that's a problem? Buy your lenses for the image they give you, not by focal length. It's not the numerical focal length that's important, it's the image. Ask any large-format user what a 50mm does for him, and he will give you a different answer still.

well... i was ganna buy the canon fisheye.. cuz i do quite a bit of skatephotography.. and itd be a cool lens in general.. but it pointless getting it cuz of the apc... unless i get the tokina fish.. but ide rather get canon..so.. for me the crop is quite a problem... nothin too majore tho.. just for fishes and super wides...

 

[cfusionpm]

uhm what i hate bout it is that if i get a 50mm lens its not really ganna be 50mm.. and if i get a 70-200 lens.. its not really ganna be 70-200

And that's a problem? Buy your lenses for the image they give you, not by focal length. It's not the numerical focal length that's important, it's the image. Ask any large-format user what a 50mm does for him, and he will give you a different answer still.

well... i was ganna buy the canon fisheye.. cuz i do quite a bit of skatephotography.. and itd be a cool lens in general.. but it pointless getting it cuz of the apc... unless i get the tokina fish.. but ide rather get canon..so.. for me the crop is quite a problem... nothin too majore tho.. just for fishes and super wides...

I've got the canon 10-22 and I think it's fantastic. Build quality is very good for a non-L and I've been very pleased with the images I've been able to get. It's about as wide as I need for sure.

 

[Big Mike]

Why is it that every time a new camera model comes out, there are the same tired old arguments & discussions? :gah:

Does and 8x10 image look good when printed out and held at arm's length? If so, then the camera is probably good enough.

 

[icassell]

Why is it that every time a new camera model comes out, there are the same tired old arguments & discussions? :gah:

Does and 8x10 image look good when printed out and held at arm's length? If so, then the camera is probably good enough.

And the funniest part is that no one has even seen one yet ...

 

[inTempus]

Would a mod PLEASE delete that image that Blash won't delete? It's killing this thread.

 

[inTempus]

Why is it that every time a new camera model comes out, there are the same tired old arguments & discussions? :gah:

Does and 8x10 image look good when printed out and held at arm's length? If so, then the camera is probably good enough.

I know, it's kind of funny.

When the 50D came out people ranted and raved about how horrible it was. Then people who actually bought them and used them posted their reviews... low and behold is was highly popular and loved by many (myself included).

Now the 7D is announced and it has an amazing feature set... and we have the same peanut gallery talking about how bad it sucks and how previous bodies did X better... and we haven't even seen it in our greedy little hands yet.

It's a vicious and never ending cycle. People just love being unhappy I guess.

Me? I have great hope for this new body.