Another Moon photo

[Tailgunner]

It finally cleared up today, still cold but clear skies. So I tried my Nikon 70-200mm 2.8 VR II w.TC-17EII out on the moon.

Anyhow, let me what you think.



D7100
Nikon 70-200mm 2.8 VR II
Nikon TC-17EII
290mm
ISO 100
1/50s
F/14

 

[amolitor]

It's pretty soft, but it's definitely the moon.

I'd try it without the TC and crop more. The 7100 is in the land of "pixels to burn" isn't it?

 

[Aloicious]

not bad, it is soft, and f14? 1/50? your settings seem a little odd.

try something closer to F8 1/500 or even f5.6 1/1000 all at ISO100. basically sunny 16 rule, since the moon is lit by the sun, just give or take a little bit depending on seeing conditions.

also tripod + remote release or timer is best. and manual focus using live view method to get the best results.

 

[Tailgunner]

not bad, it is soft, and f14? 1/50? your settings seem a little odd.

try something closer to F8 1/500 or even f5.6 1/1000 all at ISO100. basically sunny 16 rule, since the moon is lit by the sun, just give or take a little bit depending on seeing conditions.

also tripod + remote release or timer is best. and manual focus using live view method to get the best results.

Thanks, it looked a little soft to me as well but I wasn't sure if that was due to being a single photo or my settings. So can you create a sharper image without stacking?

 

[Aloicious]

No need to stack anything for moon pics, its plenty bright.

 

[Tailgunner]

No need to stack anything for moon pics, its plenty bright.

OK, I'll try the above mentioned settings and see if I can get a sharper image.

 

[amolitor]

Someone has mentioned a form of stacking which increases sharpness by selecting sharper sections from each picture. Sparky, maybe? Anyways, it compensates for atmospheric disturbances.

 

[Tailgunner]

Someone has mentioned a form of stacking which increases sharpness by selecting sharper sections from each picture. Sparky, maybe? Anyways, it compensates for atmospheric disturbances.

I was looking around at moon photos and ran across some really sharp photos but a lot of them used something like 20-70 imagines stacked together.

 

[amolitor]

Some astro guys use super-sampling techniques. I think you need a telescope, though, and an astro sensor. Not a DSLR. To make it work you can't have an AA filter in play, and you need a really large aperture (since diffusion is essentially an AA filter as well). So, it's like an Astronomer Thing, not a backyard DSLR owner thing. As near as I can determine.

 

[Tailgunner]

Some astro guys use super-sampling techniques. I think you need a telescope, though, and an astro sensor. Not a DSLR. To make it work you can't have an AA filter in play, and you need a really large aperture (since diffusion is essentially an AA filter as well). So, it's like an Astronomer Thing, not a backyard DSLR owner thing. As near as I can determine.

I'm using a D7100 which doesn't come with an AA filter.


Anyhow, Here is another Moon shot. This one was taken about the same time but is composed of 5 different images taken at different exposures and then merged. It seems a little blurry but not sure.

 

[Aloicious]

trying to focus stack with atmospheric disturbance will be spotty at best, I doubt you'd get too good of results with it personally. and if you're taking different shots at different exposures, that kind of isn't going to help with focus stacking, just keep it simple, keep your settings for a proper exposure, and take various images and pick the best, then process that one alone.

that one still looks like your focus is off, how are you focusing?

you can get good single images of the moon, try shooting it when it's NOT full...full moons are flat lit, try 1/2 or even 1/4 moons, you'll be able to see much more surface details with some good sidelighting.

here's an example of a single moon image I shot about a year and a half ago, no stacking, etc, just one image....however I took quite a few and chose the best one. the 'boiling' effect of the atmosphere will cause a lot of non-keepers.

 

[Aloicious]

Some astro guys use super-sampling techniques. I think you need a telescope, though, and an astro sensor. Not a DSLR. To make it work you can't have an AA filter in play, and you need a really large aperture (since diffusion is essentially an AA filter as well). So, it's like an Astronomer Thing, not a backyard DSLR owner thing. As near as I can determine.

some planetary imaging is done with video where they will film for a length of time and stack the more in focus frames, which works really well for more distant things, but they still only end up with a pretty small image at full size, but they're also using like hundreds of images for stacking, not just a few....

 

[TCampbell]

not bad, it is soft, and f14? 1/50? your settings seem a little odd.

try something closer to F8 1/500 or even f5.6 1/1000 all at ISO100. basically sunny 16 rule, since the moon is lit by the sun, just give or take a little bit depending on seeing conditions.

also tripod + remote release or timer is best. and manual focus using live view method to get the best results.

The moon uses the "Loony 11" rule rather than Sunny 16. It's similar but the base aperture where the inverse of the ISO is used as the shutter speed is f/11 -- a stop brighter than Sunny 16. The moon has extremely low surface albedo -- it's basically about as reflective as a black tire. f/11, ISO 100, 1/100th sec... or any equivalent exposure.

 

[Tailgunner]

trying to focus stack with atmospheric disturbance will be spotty at best, I doubt you'd get too good of results with it personally. and if you're taking different shots at different exposures, that kind of isn't going to help with focus stacking, just keep it simple, keep your settings for a proper exposure, and take various images and pick the best, then process that one alone.

that one still looks like your focus is off, how are you focusing?

you can get good single images of the moon, try shooting it when it's NOT full...full moons are flat lit, try 1/2 or even 1/4 moons, you'll be able to see much more surface details with some good sidelighting.

here's an example of a single moon image I shot about a year and a half ago, no stacking, etc, just one image....however I took quite a few and chose the best one. the 'boiling' effect of the atmosphere will cause a lot of non-keepers.

Nice photo!

So barring gear settings, you basically keep shooting away hoping for a clear spot in the atmosphere?

As for my lens, it didn't seem to have any issues focusing, so I left it on auto focus. It could have been that or me manually pressing the shutter button. Next time I'll try it with manual focus and the cable remote.

not bad, it is soft, and f14? 1/50? your settings seem a little odd.

try something closer to F8 1/500 or even f5.6 1/1000 all at ISO100. basically sunny 16 rule, since the moon is lit by the sun, just give or take a little bit depending on seeing conditions.

also tripod + remote release or timer is best. and manual focus using live view method to get the best results.

The moon uses the "Loony 11" rule rather than Sunny 16. It's similar but the base aperture where the inverse of the ISO is used as the shutter speed is f/11 -- a stop brighter than Sunny 16. The moon has extremely low surface albedo -- it's basically about as reflective as a black tire. f/11, ISO 100, 1/100th sec... or any equivalent exposure.

Sounds Loony to me but I'll give it a try

Thanks

 

[Aloicious]

Nice photo!

So barring gear settings, you basically keep shooting away hoping for a clear spot in the atmosphere?

As for my lens, it didn't seem to have any issues focusing, so I left it on auto focus. It could have been that or me manually pressing the shutter button. Next time I'll try it with manual focus and the cable remote.

sort of, but once you get the exposure and focus settings correct you'll get more good ones than you suspect. the atmospheric effect that is seen is amplified the longer the focal length, with just 290mm you shouldn't have too much to worry about, sure you'll get some issues, but the examples you're posting have other problems going on like missed focus, from what I see it's not due to various atmospheric diffractions...my image was taken at 1600mm, and out of maybe 40 images, I had maybe 10 or so usable ones without too many issues of one kind or another, and a few of those were the top examples. although you can't expect to get the same level of detail from a moderate telephoto vs a telescope though.

autofocus isn't really great in instances like this, it could be back/front focusing (which is far FAR more likely with the TC on it if you haven't adjusted the AF tuning on your body for that focal distance), or any other anomalies. switch to manual focus, turn on live view, and zoom in to the highest magnification that you can in live view and manual focus using that display. then use your shutter release, and mirror up mode too.

you can also get out of town to a nice dark and cool place that will give you the best seeing conditions. though first thing is first, get your focus issues corrected, get your exposure set up right, then worry about combating the other things.

+1 on loony 11, I forgot about that one, just knock the settings I recommended up by 1 stop, so f8 + 1/200 to 1/250 or f5.6 + ~1/400 to 1/500.