First Camera. Nikon D3300 or D5500? Or?

[Nucky]

First, of all, welcome to the addiction, er, ah, world of photography and jumping in more seriously by investing in a DSLR. To answer your last question first, no you are not wrong. There are all levels of practitioners with photography...you can be as good as you set out to be and work at. It's an art. And great artists work at their craft. And there are lots of people who are great and that's okay with them. So you decide what level of photographer you want to be and then be realistic about it--do the things you need to do to achieve that. I know plenty of beginners who aspire to be nothing more than that and have a blast. Or they want only to take good vacation photos--and they do that. Or pictures of the kids on their sports teams. Or product photography for their eBay and Etsy jewelry that they sell.

Second, you'll get a bunch of recommendations about cameras here. Here is something to understand...even the most basic DSLR these days will have capabilities that you will likely never use. It's like a modern laptop or smart phone--capabilities that we just never get to. This is not a race to see who can buy the most sophisticated camera or the one with the most bells and whistles "wins" or takes better photos. It's 90% about the person holding the camera.

Some details about the models you're looking at:
--the "swivel and touch" screen is invaluable for macro photography. You put the camera down on the ground to shoot a "ground view" angle of an insect and its' likely too low for you to look in the view finder. Not so with this screen. So if you're really interested in macro photography, this is a big plus. For me, I stayed away from it b/c I think it's easy to snag on clothing and break it. Like any feature on a camera, it can be a strong pro or negative or just "meh" depending upon what you shoot.
--Both the 3000 series and 5000 series have some nice elements that work for beginners.
--Skip the package. There are lots of things you can buy cheap on in photography and do fine. For instance, some off-brand lens are superb and will be 1/3rd the price of the brand name. Some used equipment is a great fit. Do NOT skimp on price for a tripod. A kit tripod is useful as a walking stick and that's about it. So don't buy the kit b/c it comes with a tripod...you should assume you're never going to use that particular tripod when it comes time to stabilize your camera. And getting the camera bag that comes with it is a waste of your money. That bag signals "camera" to a thief. You are either going to have your camera out and ready to use or stored in something bigger (like a backpack). Or you're going to acquire more kit (like another lens or two) and the bag won't cut it. For instance, I've got a messenger bag I sometimes use that holds my MacAir, a body, 4 lens, plus a bunch of other stuff (a speed light, batteries, etc.). The kit sounds attractive to a beginner but the tripod and bag are pretty much a waste for your purposes.
--The 3000 series has no internal autofocus motor. It relies on lens to have an autofocus motor (which shouldn't be a problem if you're buying new kit lens that are Nikkor). How this is relevant is...it's a smaller body (so better for smaller hands), it's lighter (so easier to carry around). Some women and older individuals like the smaller and lighter body for those reasons.

I'm actually going to recommend that you look at a D7000. It's an older model (about 6 years older but more sophisticated than either the D3000 or D5000 series). Why would I recommend it? You can buy just the body for about $400 these days. That's a great price for a very good DSLR that has a fine reputation and can do everything you'd want it to do. Also, unlike the D3000 or D5000 series, the D7000 has "commander mode." What that means is that you can program the camera to talk to speed lights (either Nikon speed lights or ones configured to work with Nikon--there are plenty of generic models that have this built in) so that you can trigger them using your camera without the pop-up flash firing. Why does this matter? B/c a flash head-on produces red eye and a very flat, unflattering light. For portraits you want the light no head-on but at an angle. And the commander mode allows you to do this without having to acquire flash triggers or pocket wizards. I think the commander mode is a really big advantage and you're not going to get it with the D3000 and D5000 series models but will with the D7000.

The $400 for a D7000 (if you're buying it new) is just the body. You'd then get a Nikon 35mm f1.8 lens off of Amazon. It's a prime lens which means it's razor sharp. This particular lens is small and light. It's a wide angle lens. It will be useful for landscapes and architecture or group shots. And b/c it's f1.8, combined with the ISO flexibility on the D7000 body, you'll be able to get a lot of great pictures in very low light. It's designed for a crop body (all of the cameras you're looking at plus the D7000 are crop bodies). You will get some lovely results from that.

A D7000 body with a 35mm f1.8 will give you the ability to shoot a lot of stuff with no other equipment. It won't be good for shooting wildlife or sports (you'll need a lens that has a longer reach for those kinds of activities). But for someone who won't have a speed light and is just starting out, this a pretty straight forward, capable, reliable, versatile setup. And if you decide "damn, I'm addicted" then you can go out and buy an expensive zoom (200mm f2.8). And a really good tripod. And a speed light or two. And a circular polarizer to add punch to your skies and sunsets. And a remote shutter release for doing long exposures of water or light painting. And a Macro lens for shooting water drops or insects. And a sling to hold it all (except for the tripod) or maybe a backpack. But a D7000 body with a 35mm f1.8 lens will be cheaper than what you're looking at and it will be better in terms of capabilities.

To begin with, your time is appreciated. Your thoughtful and insightful reply was helpful. I sincerely look forward to spending more time here.

Your comparison of camera features to features on laptops and phones sounds logical. I don't doubt I won't use or understand most of the features. (At least initially) Macro photography sounds like something I would like to experiment with and thats something I'll definitely consider now with the D5500.

"Commander Mode" is a bit over my head but insightful and also noted. Another member mentioned the D7000 series and you've just about closed the deal.... I'll check eBay today and see what kind or prices I can find. I'll also scour my local craigslist site.

Any signs I should be looking for when buying used?

Lastly, please do not let my short reply act as an indication of my thanks. You've covered a lot and I'm still taking everything in.

-Jeremy

 

[Nucky]

I don't get some of the negative comments on the d3300. I don't think you can go wrong with either camera mentioned. For what your doing, the D3300 will serve you well if the price is better for you. I would suggest the D3300 with a AF-S 50mm 1.8g or 35mm 1.8g if you want little wider lens to use in tighter, confined spots. I prefer the 35mm 1.8, I use it more that any other lens and it's extremely sharp and good for landscape / cityscapes as well. Both are prime lenses so you zoom with your feet. You can always add a longer focal length zoom down the road. I would also suggest a SB 600, or newer flash.
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

I was siding that way also but the more I look at the D7000 series I'm leaning in that direction.

Would you personally prefer a new d3300 or a used d7 and why?

 

[Designer]

Any signs I should be looking for when buying used?

Buy from a reputable company.

Adorama
B&H
KEH

 

[JoeW]

First, of all, welcome to the addiction, er, ah, world of photography and jumping in more seriously by investing in a DSLR. To answer your last question first, no you are not wrong. There are all levels of practitioners with photography...you can be as good as you set out to be and work at. It's an art. And great artists work at their craft. And there are lots of people who are great and that's okay with them. So you decide what level of photographer you want to be and then be realistic about it--do the things you need to do to achieve that. I know plenty of beginners who aspire to be nothing more than that and have a blast. Or they want only to take good vacation photos--and they do that. Or pictures of the kids on their sports teams. Or product photography for their eBay and Etsy jewelry that they sell.

Second, you'll get a bunch of recommendations about cameras here. Here is something to understand...even the most basic DSLR these days will have capabilities that you will likely never use. It's like a modern laptop or smart phone--capabilities that we just never get to. This is not a race to see who can buy the most sophisticated camera or the one with the most bells and whistles "wins" or takes better photos. It's 90% about the person holding the camera.

Some details about the models you're looking at:
--the "swivel and touch" screen is invaluable for macro photography. You put the camera down on the ground to shoot a "ground view" angle of an insect and its' likely too low for you to look in the view finder. Not so with this screen. So if you're really interested in macro photography, this is a big plus. For me, I stayed away from it b/c I think it's easy to snag on clothing and break it. Like any feature on a camera, it can be a strong pro or negative or just "meh" depending upon what you shoot.
--Both the 3000 series and 5000 series have some nice elements that work for beginners.
--Skip the package. There are lots of things you can buy cheap on in photography and do fine. For instance, some off-brand lens are superb and will be 1/3rd the price of the brand name. Some used equipment is a great fit. Do NOT skimp on price for a tripod. A kit tripod is useful as a walking stick and that's about it. So don't buy the kit b/c it comes with a tripod...you should assume you're never going to use that particular tripod when it comes time to stabilize your camera. And getting the camera bag that comes with it is a waste of your money. That bag signals "camera" to a thief. You are either going to have your camera out and ready to use or stored in something bigger (like a backpack). Or you're going to acquire more kit (like another lens or two) and the bag won't cut it. For instance, I've got a messenger bag I sometimes use that holds my MacAir, a body, 4 lens, plus a bunch of other stuff (a speed light, batteries, etc.). The kit sounds attractive to a beginner but the tripod and bag are pretty much a waste for your purposes.
--The 3000 series has no internal autofocus motor. It relies on lens to have an autofocus motor (which shouldn't be a problem if you're buying new kit lens that are Nikkor). How this is relevant is...it's a smaller body (so better for smaller hands), it's lighter (so easier to carry around). Some women and older individuals like the smaller and lighter body for those reasons.

I'm actually going to recommend that you look at a D7000. It's an older model (about 6 years older but more sophisticated than either the D3000 or D5000 series). Why would I recommend it? You can buy just the body for about $400 these days. That's a great price for a very good DSLR that has a fine reputation and can do everything you'd want it to do. Also, unlike the D3000 or D5000 series, the D7000 has "commander mode." What that means is that you can program the camera to talk to speed lights (either Nikon speed lights or ones configured to work with Nikon--there are plenty of generic models that have this built in) so that you can trigger them using your camera without the pop-up flash firing. Why does this matter? B/c a flash head-on produces red eye and a very flat, unflattering light. For portraits you want the light no head-on but at an angle. And the commander mode allows you to do this without having to acquire flash triggers or pocket wizards. I think the commander mode is a really big advantage and you're not going to get it with the D3000 and D5000 series models but will with the D7000.

The $400 for a D7000 (if you're buying it new) is just the body. You'd then get a Nikon 35mm f1.8 lens off of Amazon. It's a prime lens which means it's razor sharp. This particular lens is small and light. It's a wide angle lens. It will be useful for landscapes and architecture or group shots. And b/c it's f1.8, combined with the ISO flexibility on the D7000 body, you'll be able to get a lot of great pictures in very low light. It's designed for a crop body (all of the cameras you're looking at plus the D7000 are crop bodies). You will get some lovely results from that.

A D7000 body with a 35mm f1.8 will give you the ability to shoot a lot of stuff with no other equipment. It won't be good for shooting wildlife or sports (you'll need a lens that has a longer reach for those kinds of activities). But for someone who won't have a speed light and is just starting out, this a pretty straight forward, capable, reliable, versatile setup. And if you decide "damn, I'm addicted" then you can go out and buy an expensive zoom (200mm f2.8). And a really good tripod. And a speed light or two. And a circular polarizer to add punch to your skies and sunsets. And a remote shutter release for doing long exposures of water or light painting. And a Macro lens for shooting water drops or insects. And a sling to hold it all (except for the tripod) or maybe a backpack. But a D7000 body with a 35mm f1.8 lens will be cheaper than what you're looking at and it will be better in terms of capabilities.

To begin with, your time is appreciated. Your thoughtful and insightful reply was helpful. I sincerely look forward to spending more time here.

Your comparison of camera features to features on laptops and phones sounds logical. I don't doubt I won't use or understand most of the features. (At least initially) Macro photography sounds like something I would like to experiment with and thats something I'll definitely consider now with the D5500.

"Commander Mode" is a bit over my head but insightful and also noted. Another member mentioned the D7000 series and you've just about closed the deal.... I'll check eBay today and see what kind or prices I can find. I'll also scour my local craigslist site.

Any signs I should be looking for when buying used?

Lastly, please do not let my short reply act as an indication of my thanks. You've covered a lot and I'm still taking everything in.

-Jeremy

No need to apologize for a "short" reply--I tend to be verbose at times. Regardless of what you buy, I just hope that the exchange here in this thread helped (rather than confused).

Here's a bit more info on "commander mode." You have a camera. it has a pop-up flash. When desperate, you can use it. But generally speaking, pictures with a pop-up flash look crappy. There are exceptions of course. But as a rule, don't use your pop-up flash when you need more light on a subject (especially person or something that will show reflections). Instead, a light source to the side (maybe a 45 degree angle) will produce better light on a person, avoid "flat light" and add separation from the background. But if your light is off the camera and 5 feet to your right, how do you get it to fire? You can run a cable over there (a problem if the light is instead 20 feet away and not 5 feet). You can buy things like pocket wizards or other triggers (put one on your camera, one on the speed light, and the camera talks to the speed light and says "Fire Now!!!"). With the "commander mode" on many Nikons (like the D7000), your raise your little pop up flash but set it to commander mode so it doesn't flash, instead it sends signals to your speed light that is off camera and says "Fire Now!!!" It's not identical to a pocket wizard but functionally it does a lot of the same things you'd ask it to do. So if you think you're going to be taking portraits or shooting people outside of bright light, then you'll eventually acquire a speed light (I have 4 of them). And you'll need to communicate with those speed lights. The "commander mode" allows you to do this.

 

[robbins.photo]

"Commander Mode" is a bit over my head but insightful and also noted. Another member mentioned the D7000 series and you've just about closed the deal.... I'll check eBay today and see what kind or prices I can find. I'll also scour my local craigslist site.

Any signs I should be looking for when buying used?

Lastly, please do not let my short reply act as an indication of my thanks. You've covered a lot and I'm still taking everything in.

-Jeremy

I shot both the D7100 and D5200, really liked both cameras. Overall the improvements in the AF system for the D7100 mean you will get a lot more "keepers" if your shooting action shots, which is a big plus. The other really big plus for the 7100 is the second command dial. At first when you start shooting you'll probably be making use of automated modes a lot more so it won't be quite as handy, but eventually as you start to progress you'll probably want to be able to take more control over the camera and start manipulating settings like the Aperture, ISO and Shutter speed yourself to obtain the best results.

That's when the 7100's extra command wheel becomes worth 100 times it's weight in gold, believe me. The 5200 is still a very capable camera, and it does have the swivel screen if that is a big selling point for you.

In used cameras, I would recommend an outfit like KEH first, everything I've bought from them has been first rate and they have always been great to deal with:

Home Page | KEH Camera

If you'd prefer to go the ebay route you might save a few bucks here or there, but if such is the case I'd recommend you find one that is being sold by the owner (not by a dealer), avoid bundle deals like the plague, look for someone with at least 100+ transactions with all positive feedback and more importantly check their feedback on items they've sold - not just the stuff they bought. Hopefully they will have sold at least a few items, preferably at least one big ticket item before.

The big thing about Ebay.. get everything in writing. Assume nothing. If the ad says the camera is "in good shape" etc, actually ask about the things that are important to you in an email and keep the response before you bid a dime. Ask if the LCD screen has any nicks/scratches, etc. If they don't specify a shutter count, ask for it - etc. If they didn't put it in the ad, don't assume, ask and save the response.

 

[jcdeboever]

I don't get some of the negative comments on the d3300. I don't think you can go wrong with either camera mentioned. For what your doing, the D3300 will serve you well if the price is better for you. I would suggest the D3300 with a AF-S 50mm 1.8g or 35mm 1.8g if you want little wider lens to use in tighter, confined spots. I prefer the 35mm 1.8, I use it more that any other lens and it's extremely sharp and good for landscape / cityscapes as well. Both are prime lenses so you zoom with your feet. You can always add a longer focal length zoom down the road. I would also suggest a SB 600, or newer flash.
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

I was siding that way also but the more I look at the D7000 series I'm leaning in that direction.

Would you personally prefer a new d3300 or a used d7 and why?

D7xxx series are better no doubt, I guess I would have chose one if I were doing mainly birding photography. Better viewfinder, autofocus system, weathersealed, and more dials. I looked at it and for my use, I felt the D3300 was a wise choice. One thing I regret though is the viewfinder, I wish I would have went into store and looked through both, if I did, I would have went with a D7xxx. The D3300, D5500, and D7100 all have the same sensor if I recall correctly. I think the D7200 has the better sensor and processor, just way better on all fronts over the others mentioned.

Also, the d3300 is capable of producing excellent images but my skill level just isn't there yet.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[goodguy]

When it comes to the simple ability of producing good images the D3300, D5500 and D7100 will be very close in all categories.

D3300 is the cheapest and most basic
D5500 has the most modern sensor thus you get a little bit better dynamic range and low light performance
D7100 is a camera I used to own, better AF then the other, weather sealed body, in body AF system, its bigger, heavier and has more features then the other 2

Please remember that more important then the camera is the lenses so leave money to get lenses.

 

[Dao]

Beside used camera and gears, refurbished is another route to save few bucks. I believe Nikon refurbished camera comes with 90 days warranty.