I have no technical knowledge.. Now give me money please.

[Art of Emotion]

And be serious now, if you weren't finding yourself put out, offended, threatened, angry or even sad about the massive influx of competition to the world of Professional Photography, why'd you post this topic to seek the condolences and compassion from others?

I don't see these other people as competition most of whom don't live near me. So it's certainly not about the competition. Consider it one of those little kid rants . I guess the frustration comes out of the time I've put into photography.. Which in comparison to many of you is probably nothing. But I guess it saddens me how a lot of things in life take less 'brains'. However it's nice to come here and read up on those taking the time to hone their skills. It's admirable and has taught me a lot in the past few months.

I'll equate my thread to what I see in the forum I regularly post in. Is this one of those topics that is brought up on an hourly basis that, seasoned posters get annoyed with? If so my apologies. I guess the search tool does wonders. Please note I usually don't take anything personally especially when it comes to online forums. My post was out of line and emotion got the best of me. Where's my dunce hat!?! Emily hand it over!

 

[ChevyBaby]

ooh my, everytime i open a thread in here it's turned into a heated arguement!

I think the competition is the joy of competitive rates for most people and encouragement to beat the rest, be the best! lol

 

[Art of Emotion]

Wait... why do *I* have it? What are you trying to say?

:hail:
If only TN had these emotes

 

[Robin Usagani]

If Erose is in my area.. i would definitely pay her stop by and take pics

 

[Art of Emotion]

ooh my, everytime i open a thread in here it's turned into a heated arguement!

I think the competition is the joy of competitive rates for most people and encouragement to beat the rest, be the best! lol

No one's arguing really it's nice to get opinions from everyone. I think I took it too far with my comment if anything. Everyone else was good in my eyes.

 

[ChevyBaby]

ooh my, everytime i open a thread in here it's turned into a heated arguement!

I think the competition is the joy of competitive rates for most people and encouragement to beat the rest, be the best! lol

No offense... You're certainly a bubbly and joyful individual... but I noticed that you tend to think things are *way* more intense than they are.

If THIS was a heated argument... then hang onto your hat missy, because there's at least one full out WAR here every week. :lmao:

just that little tiff with rekd was a bit shaky there lol. im glad u think im bubbly, everyone else thinks im miserable lol

Today 05:24 PM Schwettylens If Erose is in my area.. i would definitely pay her stop by and take pics
erose reminds me of a character in my favourite soap - just judgin by her bootiful pic.

 

[misstwinklytoes]

It's not just in photography. I work in a building with 3 other jewelers like me (it's a shop, not a retail store). I am the only one that was schooled, I am the only one that choose this as a career. I am the only one who is so busy I just had to hire a secretary. The other three are complaining how slow they are...

Where do you sell your stuff?? I likes the jewels....

 

[Derrel]

Here is a story done by The New York Times about "moms-with-a-camera"

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/27/your-money/27iht-mplay28.4.5478740.html

This is an abridged version of the story. A longer version of the story is here:

Baby on Board, and a Photography Business, Too - New York Times

The NYT article was sort of the announcement of the MWAC phenomenon in the mainstream press. Since 2007, Facebook Photographers (as I refer to them) have become the hot,new thing...

I am going to DIS-AGREE with overread about the prevalence and historical existence of these low-end shooters; the arrival of the $1,000 d-slr with the Canon Rebel,and then the Nikon D70, and the explosion in personal computer power that we saw in the mid-2000's have really caused an EXPLOSIVE growth in the photography business, as shown by the US Chamber of Commerce figures. Back in the early 1980's, part-time wedding photography had much,much higher actual costs than photography does today; the film, processing,and proofing costs for a modest medium-format wedding in the early 1990's could easily run to $300. And that is $300 almost 20 years ago, when $300 was much,much more money than it is these days. The part-timer back in the 1980's and 1990's had tremendous costs in terms of consumables--film, proofing, enlargements...the cost to shoot and proof four or five weddings could in the 1980's and 1990's easily equal the cost of a single medium forma body and one normal lens; today, for $1,000 in inflated funds, a shooter can purchase a Nikon or Canon camera that can deliver the equivalent of $75,000 to $80,000 worth of "free film and INSTANT developing and FREE proofing"..

No, the low end has never,ever,ever had so few barriers to entry as it does today.

 

[Rekd]

I guess the frustration comes out of the time I've put into photography.. Which in comparison to many of you is probably nothing. But I guess it saddens me how a lot of things in life take less 'brains'.

Now we're getting somewhere! First of all, I'm into DSLRs for a little over a year. I shot (professionally) using a glorified point and shoot (Sony DSC H5) for about 4 or 5 years.

Now that I have a good body and a good lens and am learning about ISO, shutter speed, aperture, framing, lighting and a million other things, I consider myself a professional. Not only because I get paid to do it (the New York Times paid for all my equipment many times over), but because I can have a solid conversation with anyone else about the topic and at least know what the discussion is about.

Now, contrast that with my main "profession". I'm a machinist/programmer by trade. Have been for over a quarter century. I'm in the top of my field and have no doubt I am a professional. I've put my entire life into it and it takes good care of me.

But when I see young kids getting into the trade and making their first part and they call themselves a "professional" I don't get erked at all. I get happy about it mostly because I used to teach it and I appreciate when people take a passion in what they do.

The bottom line is that there's plenty of work to go around if that's your thing. And there's plenty of different levels of expertise people will pay for which means there is room for all stages of "professionals". If some pimply-faced kid can make some cash taking photos and wants to call himself a professional, more power to them!

 

[Art of Emotion]

Here is a story done by The New York Times about "moms-with-a-camera"

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/27/your-money/27iht-mplay28.4.5478740.html

This is an abridged version of the story. A longer version of the story is here:

Baby on Board, and a Photography Business, Too - New York Times

The NYT article was sort of the announcement of the MWAC phenomenon in the mainstream press. Since 2007, Facebook Photographers (as I refer to them) have become the hot,new thing...

I am going to DIS-AGREE with overread about the prevalence and historical existence of these low-end shooters; the arrival of the $1,000 d-slr with the Canon Rebel,and then the Nikon D70, and the explosion in personal computer power that we saw in the mid-2000's have really caused an EXPLOSIVE growth in the photography business, as shown by the US Chamber of Commerce figures. Back in the early 1980's, part-time wedding photography had much,much higher actual costs than photography does today; the film, processing,and proofing costs for a modest medium-format wedding in the early 1990's could easily run to $300. And that is $300 almost 20 years ago, when $300 was much,much more money than it is these days. The part-timer back in the 1980's and 1990's had tremendous costs in terms of consumables--film, proofing, enlargements...the cost to shoot and proof four or five weddings could in the 1980's and 1990's easily equal the cost of a single medium forma body and one normal lens; today, for $1,000 in inflated funds, a shooter can purchase a Nikon or Canon camera that can deliver the equivalent of $75,000 to $80,000 worth of "free film and INSTANT developing and FREE proofing"..

No, the low end has never,ever,ever had so few barriers to entry as it does today.

Thank you for this.

 

[Art of Emotion]

I guess the frustration comes out of the time I've put into photography.. Which in comparison to many of you is probably nothing. But I guess it saddens me how a lot of things in life take less 'brains'.

Now we're getting somewhere! First of all, I'm into DSLRs for a little over a year. I shot (professionally) using a glorified point and shoot (Sony DSC H5) for about 4 or 5 years.

Now that I have a good body and a good lens and am learning about ISO, shutter speed, aperture, framing, lighting and a million other things, I consider myself a professional. Not only because I get paid to do it (the New York Times paid for all my equipment many times over), but because I can have a solid conversation with anyone else about the topic and at least know what the discussion is about.

Now, contrast that with my main "profession". I'm a machinist/programmer by trade. Have been for over a quarter century. I'm in the top of my field and have no doubt I am a professional. I've put my entire life into it and it takes good care of me.

But when I see young kids getting into the trade and making their first part and they call themselves a "professional" I don't get erked at all. I get happy about it mostly because I used to teach it and I appreciate when people take a passion in what they do.

The bottom line is that there's plenty of work to go around if that's your thing. And there's plenty of different levels of expertise people will pay for which means there is room for all stages of "professionals". If some pimply-faced kid can make some cash taking photos and wants to call himself a professional, more power to them!

I appreciate your stance on this and explanation. I guess there was some good that came out of posting this after all. My way of thinking is a bit wrong, I'll never be above admitting that when I am.
Thanks

 

[misstwinklytoes]

Just unsubscribing.

 

[Blake.Oney]

That NYT article was good. It reminds me of this girl from my area. She got a T2i about 6 months ago and is charging I believe $100 creative fee and giving the photo's on a disc with the option to buy prints. She has a good eye, but in general she doesn't have a clue what she is doing. She bought one speed light with a stand and an umbrella and is has a rented space now that will very soon be her "studio". She put a couple photo's that I thought were decent (just decent) on Facebook and I told her why I like one over the other. It wasn't a critique or anything, but she flipped out saying she didn't care for critiquing because I was just trying to intimidate her because I have more experience. I tried to tell her that I was trying to help her out because I have more experience, but she wasn't hearing it.

I have absolutely no worries or insecurities about MWAC, but I think some of them are ridiculous and sometimes I can do noting but sit back and laugh at how they think their new dslr makes them so much of an expert that they have nothing to learn. It is even more amusing when they have that attitude and their photo's are trash.

Edit: I also personally do not consider myself a "professional" because to me it has more of a meaning pertaining to skill. I do make most of my income from photography, though.

 

[Robin Usagani]

I dont look down at MWAC. They are basically me, but different gender. But really.. the water is choppy.. You better know how to swim or you are going to sink. Doing selective coloring to impress people can only take you so far.

 

[Blake.Oney]

I'm with you. I don't look down at anyone unless they have a bad attitude as the girl I was talking about did. I have a couple selective color photo's in my body of work. Like 3 or 4, but I agree. I have seen a lot of people do it and try to use it as a gimmick of sort when they first start out. I think it's because they genuinely don't realize how much it is played out.