Manual Mode

[tirediron]

But whatever you do, avoid Manual mode like the plague. You’ll never take a pic you’ll like...at least not for good long while.

That's just ridiculous.

When I got my first SLR, "Manual" was the only option available. Funny thing..... I got a few pictures I liked.

:thumbup: +1

 

[kundalini]

When I got my first SLR, "Manual" was the only option available. Funny thing..... I got a few pictures I liked.

Yes, but you would have had more if you had auto modes, and even more still if you had a Nikon D3000 and used the Scenes.

Bo11ocks. I was in the learning curve. Granted I may have pulled out a few more keepers, but it wouldn't have contributed to my understanding of the exposure triangle if I depended on the semi-auto modes.

I'm not for or against semi-auto modes, just pointing out a disagreement with your comment to avoid Manual shooting mode like the plague. When I got my first digital camera, it had been about fifteen years since I shot last. TBH, I stayed in an semi-to full auto the first few days, then memory kicked in. Like tirediron mentioned, if you have the basics, the foundations if you will, the rest is only supplemental information. But without those basics, you are walking on thin ice. If you hear that cracking sound underneath your feet, would you know to go prostrate without fundamental knowledge? Unlikely.

The semi-auto modes certainly have their advantages and time of use. I don't often employ them, but I understand them.

 

[icassell]

Interesting discussion. I actually am VERY comfortable with manual mode (and manual focus). That said, I usually shoot either in Aperture priority or Shutter priority semi-automatic mode. My 7D now adds a new twist. It has an auto-ISO mode which I initially avoided like the plague. I've been playing with it recently and find that it is a godsend in shooting birds-in-flight in the early dawn or late afternoon light. In combination with fast shutter speed in shutter priority, I find that I am rarely getting bad motion-blur on these handheld images and the images are properly exposed. Could I do it all manually? Yes I can and have, but this yields many more keepers.

 

[LCARSx32]

There's three basic settings in manual mode that will affect how the image is exposed. These are ISO, Shutter speed, and Aperture.

ISO changes the sensitivity of the image sensor. Lower numbers (100, 200) are less sensitive to light, so you need more light to get a good image. At the same time, the lower the number, the less grainy the image will be. Higher ISO's need less light, but the image will have more grain.

Shutter speed controls how long the shutter is open. Since you will be at a concert, it's unlikely you will have a tripod with you, so you will need a relatively fast shutter speed. I've repeatedly read that in order to get sharp pictures while holding the camera by hand, you should have your shutter speed set to "1/focal length", meaning if your lens is at 100mm, your shutter speed should be no slower than 1/100th of a second. This seems to work well for me. If you can prop the camera up against something or put it on a railing, you can use longer shutter speeds. The longer the shutter is open, the brighter the picture will be. But, while the shutter is open, ANY movement will result in a blurry image.

Aperture is an internal mechanism of the lens. The higher your aperture is set, the smaller the hole in lens gets. So an aperture of f/4 is going to let in more light than an aperture of f/11. Aperture also controls "Depth of field" (DOF). DOF is how much of the image will be in focus. The lower the f/#, the shallower the DOF. For example. If you are focusing on a person's face and you set the camera's aperture to f/4, you may notice that their nose or ears are out of focus while their eyes are in focus. If you increase the aperture to f/8 or f/11, the rest of their face would come into focus. At a concert, where you are far away from your subject, this will be less important, so you'll probably want your aperture open most, if not all the way.

Those three settings together will determine the exposure of the image. There's a meter on the camera's viewfinder to show you what the overall exposure of an image will be. Typically, you want the arrow to point to the middle of the line. You may find that this isn't always the case, however. The meter is averaging the light in the entire frame. So if you have a dark stage and a lit singer, the meter will try to over expose the image because of all the dark areas. So you will have to use your own judgment.

My recommendation is to go out tonight and try shooting some pictures in low light conditions to get an idea of what the settings do. I still struggle with low light conditions myself, so don't expect your first outing to be perfect. It will take a bit of practice.

Good luck! Post the pictures you get and we'll let you know what's wrong and how to fix it in the future.

 

[Bitter Jeweler]

Thanks for the advice..I have read the manual, but I guess not as intensely as I should've. Thanks again!

You should read the manual a few times. However, they tend to be very technical and cold. Look at getting "...for dummies" books either for digital photography in general, or for your specific camera. They teach you in much easier to understand terms how to use your camera, even with a bit of humour here and there.

I started with Digital Photography for dummies, by David Busch.

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Digital-SLR-Cameras-Photography-Dummies/dp/0470466065/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1279579975&sr=8-3]Amazon.com: Digital SLR Cameras and Photography For Dummies (9780470466063): David D. Busch: Books[/ame]

 

[KmH]

But whatever you do, avoid Manual mode like the plague. You’ll never take a pic you’ll like...at least not for good long while.

That's just ridiculous.

When I got my first SLR, "Manual" was the only option available. Funny thing..... I got a few pictures I liked.

+10. :thumbup:

 

[kundalini]

I started with Digital Photography for dummies, by David Busch.

Amazon.com: Digital SLR Cameras and Photography For Dummies (9780470466063): David D. Busch: Books

My first field guide fo rmy D80 was by David Busch. Since then I have discovered there are better authors for technical info IMO. Things Nikon, I tend to lean towards Thom Hogan.

But, the premise is the same. Find an auxiliary source of information. The manual is fundamental, but typically written in a very dry state.

 

[flyin-lowe]

I bought Petersons understanding exposure and it was one of the best things i did. It is the type of book that you can read in about 4 hours and it will save you months of trial and error. When I bought it I read it twice and the 2nd time I learned some stuff that got by me the first time. It's easy to understand and it will help you.

 

[kundalini]

“Understanding of the exposure triangle”? What’s there to understand?

Perhaps I should gather my ball and go home. Obviously I walk a path alone.

True understanding of exposure is to know when the meter will be fooled, and why.

Explain how this occurs without the basics, the fundamentals, the foundation of understanding the exposure triangle? How can you compensate for an unknown? Have you not seen enough threads on TPF where the OP hasn't even considered reading their owners manual. How does that bode well when yunguns' are suckling the teet and drawing only on dried milk? Without understanding of when, why and how to change settings, the basic settings, why are you throwing in a spanner in the works with EV compensation? Yeah, it's handy, but FFS, there are more important things to consider.

Sluff it off if you will, but I think you are doing a disservice to the noobs with your position.

Understanding exposure means to understand the use of Exposure Compensation.

I disagree. If you don't have the three legs down pat, you're just whistling in the wind.

Don't forget what they say about Superman's cape.

Cheers......
Done & dusted.....

 

[tirediron]

“Understanding of the exposure triangle”? What’s there to understand...

Oh, I'm sorry, I thought this was a serious discussion. Has anyone seen my troll-chow?

 

[Overread]

It’s you who is doing the beginner a disservice by teaching him how to control a machine without providing any understanding of why the machine will sometimes misbehave.

errm the same meter that can be fooled in manual mode can be fooled exactly the same in the semi auto (aperture and shutter priority); full auto and in the scenic modes.

I can't agree with your sentiment that full manual should be avoided. My own path through learning (only a few years of learning thus far!) was indeed to start with the auto and scene modes - they got my ok pics but I was not in control nor was I understanding the settings (aperture, shutter speed or ISO) I was simply understanding what the scene modes were producing to a limited extent.

I shifted to aperture priority mode quite quickly and soon after really started to take note and learn the three settings and the effects that they have on my photos - how to control them - what limits there were as well as experience which started to teach me what situations the meter would be fooled under and how I might correct for that (eg in strong sunlight I found that to preserve my highlights it was good to underexpose the shot - using exposure compensation).

I never avoided manual mode though I will admit whilst I was simply following the meters recomendation and setting one primary setting and basingthe other off the meter there was no need for me to move out of the semi-auto modes. If you set the aperture and ISO and then base your shutter speed of the meter you might as well shoot in aperture priority mode - if you set the shutter speed and ISO and base the aperture of the meter reading then shoot in shutter priority.

However if I wanted to ever set both or if I wanted to do something very different to what the meter thought I should be doing then I had no choice but to shift into manual mode. I didn't avoid it nor did I attach to it some seal of wonder that I was using manual mode - it was a mode that gave me control over the 3 settings and allowed me to arrive at a combination of the three that would give me the creative result in the camera that I was after at the time.
I approach using all the settings this way - its not what mode you shoot that is important it is how you arrive at the settings that gives you the shot you want. Sometimes thats a semi auto mode sometimes its full manual; and when you start out its often the full auto or scenic modes. When one wants to learn its encouraged that you leave the scenic modes and start to take control over the settings - to force yourself to learn one setting - to see how it affects your shot.

Understanding Exposure (the book as referenced above) is good guide that helped me as well through this phase. As well as lots of practice and the camera manual (this should be living with your camera - never leave homewithout both - nothing worse than needing to find out how to change/control something and not having the manual with you)

 

[Boomn4x4]

I thought the "modern way" was to click away shooting RAW and fix it post processing?

 

[Dao]

When I want consistency, I will for sure set my camera to manual mode.

Especially for product photography. I helped my friend to take over hundreds squeeze toys (for company promotional). Power output of the flashes (diffused) were set manually. Do I want to use auto mode or semi-auto mode with exposure compensation? No way!

 

[o hey tyler]

errm the same meter that can be fooled in manual mode can be fooled exactly the same in the semi auto (aperture and shutter priority); full auto and in the scenic modes.

That's my entire point! Learning to recognize this condition, and understanding why it happens, is far more useful than knowing the relationships of the exposure triangle.

they [auto modes] got my ok pics but I was not in control

I've heard this before...it is a common sentiment, but it's wrong. People who believe that they're not in full control of their cameras when using auto modes, simply don't know how to use their cameras. With Exposure Compensation a person has as much control over exposure as in Manual mode.

Wait wait wait...you JUST said a moment ago that when using auto modes you were not in control, but now you're saying that you can control exposure in auto modes.

However if I wanted to ever set both or if I wanted to do something very different to what the meter thought I should be doing then I had no choice but to shift into manual mode.

Again, you said above that you use Exposure Compensation to control your exposure, yet for some reason now you are unable to do so. I don't understand that.

Obviously, Manual mode is not only useful, but essential in certain situations. That's why it's still on the dial. But for the vast majority of situations, and especially for beginners, there is nothing that Manual mode can do that you can't do with an auto mode.

I didn't avoid it nor did I attach to it some seal of wonder that I was using manual mode - it was a mode that gave me control over the 3 settings and allowed me to arrive at a combination of the three that would give me the creative result in the camera that I was after at the time.

But creative images that take advantage of gross under or over exposure is not within the realm of beginners. You don't teach someone how to drive in an F1 car.

Gaystar, I find your lack of intelligence and intentional disregard for the fundamentals of photography appalling.

I like your debate "You have more control of your camera in FULL AUTO MODE". Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. It's really easy to expose for a backlit subject with exposure compensation. Especially when you're shooting in direct sunlight and you can only compensate for 2 stops. That sounds like a real fun time trying to do that on full auto.

Simply put, letting the camera decide on what exposure and aperture to use is stupid. There's a reason that there are manual controls for them. And that reason is so that you can decide how much blur and depth of field you want. Even down to the very inch if you're good with math and you like setting up your shots perfectly. Can you change your aperture in full auto? No, you can't. But your flash can pop up when there's insufficient lighting and make a terrible photo.

Oh, you want zero creative control over your photos, while at the same time learning nothing about photography? Great! Well you can have your little dial set to Automatic Green (the A for auto really stands for AWESOME though, at least that's word on the street). But everyone else on the forum is going to stay in the real world. Where concepts are learned, applied, and then retaught to people willing enough to carry on the fundamentals.

 

[Overread]

errm the same meter that can be fooled in manual mode can be fooled exactly the same in the semi auto (aperture and shutter priority); full auto and in the scenic modes.

That's my entire point! Learning to recognize this condition, and understanding why it happens, is far more useful than knowing the relationships of the exposure triangle.
.

No one is saying that learning about the meter is not important, but that you also have to learn about the exposure triangle and how to control it - heck as Tyler points out exposure compensation will only compensate the exposure so far (My 400D has 2 stops up and down whilst some cameras have 3, 4 and I think 5 is the most). If you want to work outside of those zones you have to shift into manual mode. (eg all my macro flash work is done in full manual with f13, ISO 100, 1/200sec (mostly) I cannot get my camera settings to match those readings in any situation outside of manual mode.)

they [auto modes] got my ok pics but I was not in control

I've heard this before...it is a common sentiment, but it's wrong. People who believe that they're not in full control of their cameras when using auto modes, simply don't know how to use their cameras. With Exposure Compensation a person has as much control over exposure as in Manual mode.

Wait wait wait...you JUST said a moment ago that when using auto modes you were not in control, but now you're saying that you can control exposure in auto modes.

In the scenic and full auto modes there is no exposure compensation control (at least on my 400D camera body). So no in these modes I don't have any control at all over the settings that the camera is picking.
In Program mode (I honestly have never used this mode ever) and the semi-auto modes (aperture and shutter priority) yes there is exposure compensation - but as said its limited in how far it can compensate by.

I didn't avoid it nor did I attach to it some seal of wonder that I was using manual mode - it was a mode that gave me control over the 3 settings and allowed me to arrive at a combination of the three that would give me the creative result in the camera that I was after at the time.

But creative images that take advantage of gross under or over exposure is not within the realm of beginners. You don't teach someone how to drive in an F1 car.

Well it never stopped me from experimenting.
Unlike an F1 car if you make a mistake with a photograph you don't end up in intensive care units. Infact mistakes are highly valuble things to have when you learn - you can look at the settings used, look at the results and come to better understand where you are going wrong.
Also I would argue that creativity needed for a beginner to learn is dependant upon what the beginner is learning. If they are wanting to shoot low light club/bar shots their early learning skills will be totally different from someone who wants to learn how to shoot creamy water at the beach or sports where their child is playing.

Whilst each draws upon the common elements of exposure control and manipulation they each have their own specific demands and skills to learn.

Again I am not saying jump right into manual mode - I am saying start in the semi auto (aperture priority is very popular) and learn to shoot, learn to control the aperture and balance it to the ISO and shutter speed - but keep a mind for manual mode. Never view it as impossibly hard nor as some acolade or oneupmanship to shoot in manual mode.
Its about achiving the settings that give you the shot you want to create in the lighting that you are in/controling - if that called for manual mode, aperture priority or heck even full auto then use that mode - but be aware and fluent with using the other modes so that when you need them they are there for you to use.