My first DSLR for travel and street photography: D5600 vs D7200 vs EOS 77D

[rsmoraes]

Hello guys

So, I've come to seek your help and wisdom to help me with the best system to get started in the DSLR world. I currently own a Sony HX20V, which is a pretty capable compact camera that gave me some pretty good shots in the past, but I'm not happy with it anymore. I'm already a bit seasoned on the concepts and know how to work out a well exposed and good looking image, but I know I have already reached the best my camera can give me, thus the need to upgrade and get real on the camera world. Some thoughts and reasons to upgrade:

1) I find the lack of low light performance of my current camera disturbing. My current camera performs really badly even in low ISOs. Besides that, the camera comes with an f3.2-5.8, which is a rather slow lens for my taste. I would really like to be able to take photos at dawn, city pictures at night or even indoor portraits, which the bad performance and slow aperture make impossible without a tripod. I expect I would get at least 3 to 4 stops improvement from a new system (maybe even more).

2) The other things that have a great deal of importance for me are DOF effects and bokeh. Since my lens widest aperture is 3.2 I don't get really smooth bokeh. Besides that, there is no manual focus ring on the camera, and the manual focus has to be achieved through buttons, which is a terrible experience for me. The autofocus is not amazing, which is expected in such an old and cheap camera.

3) Battery: I tend to shoot around 250-350 shots a day when traveling, a limitation imposed by my battery. I believe I could easily reach 500-700 if I had more battery (and there are some low light shots I do not even bother trying because I know the cam will not be able to do it).

That being said, I was primarily looking for bodies that could be bought here in Sweden for around than $750, meaning the Nikon D7200. I'm a little tempted by the D5600, which f is 40% lighter and 25% cheaper. The D7200, however, has more focus point (51 vs 39), more battery (1110 shots vs 820 shots) and can focus at -3EV (vs -1EV). Since I have never used a DSLR before I don't really know how to weight these characteristics, that's when you guys come in. Considering that I'll use it for travel, low light street, and indoor photography and the eventual portrait, will the autofocus, the focus sensitivity, and the weight be a big deal??

More food for thought: I recently moved from Brazil to Sweden, where I plan to stay for the next 5 years. However, I also recently found out that since September 2018 Nikon has moved out of the Brazilian market... That special piece of info got me a little worried since, if I ever decide to move back there, I will not have a Nikon official dealer, and probably no professional support for my camera and lenses either. So, what about the Canon EOS 77D? It is also cheaper, but has some downsides when compared to the D7200: battery (660 vs 1100 shots), lower HDR (14.6 vs 13.3), lower AF points count (45 vs 51, even though Canon AF points are cross-type) and it has an AA filter (is it REALLY noticeable??). So, what are your thoughts??

I would not really go for mirrorless because of the battery, when you're traveling sometimes you don't really have access to a power outlet, so if I could have a camera that could go through a weekend without being charged I'd promptly get it.

I know I kind of wrote a lot, thanks for reading until the end.... Any thoughts for me?

 

[dunfly]

I have a D7200 and a D5200. The D7200 is clearly the better camera, however, when I travel, I carry the D5200. Like the D5600, the D5200 is much lighter and has an articulating screen which comes in very handy while traveling and when taking candid shots on the street (when used with live view). The screen on the D7200 is fixed. I can take about as good an image with the D5200 as with the D7200, it just takes a little more effort. Image quality should be better on the D5600 than the D5200 due to the lack of a low pass filter. As far as focus points, 39 is more than I use and 51 is overkill in my opinion.

So, for general photography, the clear choice is the D7200, but for travel and street photography, I would probably go for the D5600.

Can't help you with the Canon. Like the Canon, my D5200 has a low pass (AA) filter. I don't think it makes a noticeable difference in image quality and the studies I have read tend to indicate it is not noticeable, but, If I were buying now I would go with a camera with no AA filter. I am not into mirrorless at this time, but it looks like it may be the future. I'm just too old to change.

 

[Jeff15]

Why does the camera have to be Nikon or Canon ?

 

[Designer]

Any thoughts for me?

Hello, and welcome!

#2; Since I've never purchased a lens just for its bokeh, I suggest you do some research on what lens(es) you might want. Having said that, I will point out that if you select one of the older screw-drive lenses, it will not auto-focus on a D5xxx body, but a D7xxx body will do it because the focus motor is in the body. At any rate, you can still focus manually with the D5600 body.

#5; I don't think you will miss having a Nikon repair facility in Brazil, as you can ship your camera anywhere. Even we who live in the hinterlands of the US need to ship our camera to an official Nikon repair facility somewhere far, far away, should the need arise. Besides; with your new government, who knows? Nikon may decide to reopen an official facility Brazil.

Another thought; the D7200 has , for instance; two function wheels and several other quite useful features over the D5xxx bodies. They are more of an "enthusiast" level camera over the D5xxx line which is more of a beginner-level line.

 

[dunfly]

Any thoughts for me?

Another thought; the D7200 has , for instance; two function wheels and several other quite useful features over the D5xxx bodies. They are more of an "enthusiast" level camera over the D5xxx line which is more of a beginner-level line.

I have both, so does that make me an enthusiastic beginner?

 

[RVT1K]

If you do decide on a Nikon system, I would reiterate what a previous post said about making sure it has an internal motor for autofocus. This will allow you a wider range of lenses.

If you're worried about battery life, there is always the option of getting a grip that holds another battery.

 

[Designer]

If you're worried about battery life, there is always the option of getting a grip that holds another battery.

Right.

Except for the new "Z" mount cameras, of course.

 

[rsmoraes]

Hey guys, thanks for your messages, let me answer some of them...

Why does the camera have to be Nikon or Canon ?

It doesn't, actually, those are the best models according to the reviews, but I know user experience can be a better input than reviews, that's why I came to you guys...

Any thoughts for me?

#5; I don't think you will miss having a Nikon repair facility in Brazil, as you can ship your camera anywhere. Even we who live in the hinterlands of the US need to ship our camera to an official Nikon repair facility somewhere far, far away, should the need arise. Besides; with your new government, who knows? Nikon may decide to reopen an official facility Brazil.

Another thought; the D7200 has , for instance; two function wheels and several other quite useful features over the D5xxx bodies. They are more of an "enthusiast" level camera over the D5xxx line which is more of a beginner-level line.

Actually, I think the operation in Brazil was closed because it was not profitable enough... Brazil is a big market on paper, but when it comes to "luxury" or "high-end products" the market is not really that big. The same phenomena were observed concerning some luxury car brands, like Lotus and Aston Martin, leaving Brazil in the last decade or so...

About the "several other quite useful features ", how much of a difference, in your personal opinion do those make? Are they worth the 25% higher price tag? (I want your personal input here, I know every one of you has some experience with those features so I'd just like those out)

If you do decide on a Nikon system, I would reiterate what a previous post said about making sure it has an internal motor for autofocus. This will allow you a wider range of lenses.

If you're worried about battery life, there is always the option of getting a grip that holds another battery.

I'm aware of the autofocus issues, I've been looking into some glass choices and since I'm not going for the "ultra-budget" lenses, almost all of them have motors...

The battery grip is indeed a good thing, but I'm guessing that considering the price and weight difference between the D7200+grip and the D5600 I could always carry an extra battery and leave it at the hotel, for example....

I have a D7200 and a D5200. The D7200 is clearly the better camera, however, when I travel, I carry the D5200. Like the D5600, the D5200 is much lighter and has an articulating screen which comes in very handy while traveling and when taking candid shots on the street (when used with live view). The screen on the D7200 is fixed. I can take about as good an image with the D5200 as with the D7200, it just takes a little more effort. Image quality should be better on the D5600 than the D5200 due to the lack of a low pass filter. As far as focus points, 39 is more than I use and 51 is overkill in my opinion.

So, for general photography, the clear choice is the D7200, but for travel and street photography, I would probably go for the D5600.

Thanks, dunfly, that's the kind of input I was looking for... I do see the benefits of the pivoting screen on the D5600, I don't mind using the view-finder, but I can imagine it can become very useful for composition when taking shots above your head or near the ground... Since I'll not be photographing sports nor wildlife I can believe the autofocus will not be a problem for me then (anyone else has a different opinion on the autofocus)...

How do you feel about the weight? is the D7200 really a pain compared to the D5600 when it comes to long days shooting and walking around 12km (7.5mi) a day as I usually do on my trips?

 

[dunfly]

I find the D7200 noticeably heavier and bulkier than the D5200 and the D5600 is even lighter. I travel with the same lenses for each, a Tokina 11-16 f2.8, a Nikon 18-140 and sometimes a Nikon 55-300 or Nikon 35 f1.8 prime (all of which are relatively light). I like to travel light, so this is a big issue to me. Of course, for those who travel with big full frame cameras, this may seem trivial, but I am out there to enjoy myself, not lug around a lot of gear. Image quality is going to be about the same, so it boils down to a decision between the better controls, features and more robust build of the D7200 vs the lighter weight and articulating screen of the D5600.

 

[Designer]

About the "several other quite useful features ", how much of a difference, in your personal opinion do those make? Are they worth the 25% higher price tag? (I want your personal input here, I know every one of you has some experience with those features so I'd just like those out)

As for me, yes, it was worth the extra. A couple of years ago I traded off my D5000 and bought a new D7100, so I do have that experience.

You might be able to get a new D7100, which may cost less than the D7200, so shop around.

 

[otherprof]

Hello guys

So, I've come to seek your help and wisdom to help me with the best system to get started in the DSLR world. I currently own a Sony HX20V, which is a pretty capable compact camera that gave me some pretty good shots in the past, but I'm not happy with it anymore. I'm already a bit seasoned on the concepts and know how to work out a well exposed and good looking image, but I know I have already reached the best my camera can give me, thus the need to upgrade and get real on the camera world. Some thoughts and reasons to upgrade:

1) I find the lack of low light performance of my current camera disturbing. My current camera performs really badly even in low ISOs. Besides that, the camera comes with an f3.2-5.8, which is a rather slow lens for my taste. I would really like to be able to take photos at dawn, city pictures at night or even indoor portraits, which the bad performance and slow aperture make impossible without a tripod. I expect I would get at least 3 to 4 stops improvement from a new system (maybe even more).

2) The other things that have a great deal of importance for me are DOF effects and bokeh. Since my lens widest aperture is 3.2 I don't get really smooth bokeh. Besides that, there is no manual focus ring on the camera, and the manual focus has to be achieved through buttons, which is a terrible experience for me. The autofocus is not amazing, which is expected in such an old and cheap camera.

3) Battery: I tend to shoot around 250-350 shots a day when traveling, a limitation imposed by my battery. I believe I could easily reach 500-700 if I had more battery (and there are some low light shots I do not even bother trying because I know the cam will not be able to do it).

That being said, I was primarily looking for bodies that could be bought here in Sweden for around than $750, meaning the Nikon D7200. I'm a little tempted by the D5600, which f is 40% lighter and 25% cheaper. The D7200, however, has more focus point (51 vs 39), more battery (1110 shots vs 820 shots) and can focus at -3EV (vs -1EV). Since I have never used a DSLR before I don't really know how to weight these characteristics, that's when you guys come in. Considering that I'll use it for travel, low light street, and indoor photography and the eventual portrait, will the autofocus, the focus sensitivity, and the weight be a big deal??

More food for thought: I recently moved from Brazil to Sweden, where I plan to stay for the next 5 years. However, I also recently found out that since September 2018 Nikon has moved out of the Brazilian market... That special piece of info got me a little worried since, if I ever decide to move back there, I will not have a Nikon official dealer, and probably no professional support for my camera and lenses either. So, what about the Canon EOS 77D? It is also cheaper, but has some downsides when compared to the D7200: battery (660 vs 1100 shots), lower HDR (14.6 vs 13.3), lower AF points count (45 vs 51, even though Canon AF points are cross-type) and it has an AA filter (is it REALLY noticeable??). So, what are your thoughts??

I would not really go for mirrorless because of the battery, when you're traveling sometimes you don't really have access to a power outlet, so if I could have a camera that could go through a weekend without being charged I'd promptly get it.

I know I kind of wrote a lot, thanks for reading until the end.... Any thoughts for me?

For me, the weight issue is solved by a cross-body stap. I use a Bosstrap which attaches to one is the camera lugs. It is very simple - no padded part yo shift around - and not expensive. (I think most people on the Forum use Black Rapid straps.).
The battery time on the d7200 is great, but you can always carry an extra battery. (I do.)
The advantage of the body focusing in the D7200 is you have so many great used Nikon lenses to choose from, so that can cut down on cost.
I do miss the articulating screen on my d5100, but I’m glad I upgraded to the d7200.

 

[RVT1K]

I find the D7200 noticeably heavier and bulkier than the D5200 and the D5600 is even lighter. I travel with the same lenses for each, a Tokina 11-16 f2.8, a Nikon 18-140 and sometimes a Nikon 55-300 or Nikon 35 f1.8 prime (all of which are relatively light). I like to travel light, so this is a big issue to me. Of course, for those who travel with big full frame cameras, this may seem trivial, but I am out there to enjoy myself, not lug around a lot of gear. Image quality is going to be about the same, so it boils down to a decision between the better controls, features and more robust build of the D7200 vs the lighter weight and articulating screen of the D5600.

I guess that would be me.

I've lugged every bit of gear I own with me whenever I went on a vacation where photographing things was going to be a big part of the trip. That would have been either a D90 or a D7000 both with grips or a D3, a Nikon 70/200mm f/2.8 and a ton of other stuff including my monopod.

I certainly understand the advantages of going small and light. I saw it up close and personal on a trip with a friend who took a good compact with him. He could put all his tools in his pocket while I was carrying around my big, heavy bag.

But there were also times where I changed lenses three times in one location (I may have too much fun with my fisheye). I also had the better low-light opportunities like the OP pointed out.

As far as an option from the strap, I highly recommend the Sun Sniper sling. I love mine.

 

[rsmoraes]

Thanks again guys, I appreciate your feedback...

I find the D7200 noticeably heavier and bulkier than the D5200 and the D5600 is even lighter. I travel with the same lenses for each, a Tokina 11-16 f2.8, a Nikon 18-140 and sometimes a Nikon 55-300 or Nikon 35 f1.8 prime (all of which are relatively light). I like to travel light, so this is a big issue to me. Of course, for those who travel with big full frame cameras, this may seem trivial, but I am out there to enjoy myself, not lug around a lot of gear. Image quality is going to be about the same, so it boils down to a decision between the better controls, features and more robust build of the D7200 vs the lighter weight and articulating screen of the D5600.

I see, it'll really come down to my experience then... I'll probably be going to a shop this weekend and try to handle both cameras and see how I feel about their weights.

About the "several other quite useful features ", how much of a difference, in your personal opinion do those make? Are they worth the 25% higher price tag? (I want your personal input here, I know every one of you has some experience with those features so I'd just like those out)

As for me, yes, it was worth the extra. A couple of years ago I traded off my D5000 and bought a new D7100, so I do have that experience.

You might be able to get a new D7100, which may cost less than the D7200, so shop around.

Thanks for sharing that. In spite of being a beginner on the DSLR world, I know I 'll probably find myself using the camera on manual mode very often, so those extra controls may indeed become quite handy for me too...

For me, the weight issue is solved by a cross-body stap. I use a Bosstrap which attaches to one is the camera lugs. It is very simple - no padded part yo shift around - and not expensive. (I think most people on the Forum use Black Rapid straps.).
The battery time on the d7200 is great, but you can always carry an extra battery. (I do.)
The advantage of the body focusing in the D7200 is you have so many great used Nikon lenses to choose from, so that can cut down on cost.
I do miss the articulating screen on my d5100, but I’m glad I upgraded to the d7200.

That was a nice insight, I had not yet thought about the difference a strap could make for a long day, reading your answer and some reviews helped me realize that I'll really need one.

 

[rsmoraes]

I certainly understand the advantages of going small and light. I saw it up close and personal on a trip with a friend who took a good compact with him. He could put all his tools in his pocket while I was carrying around my big, heavy bag.

That is precisely my point, nowadays I can just put my HX20V on my pocket and I'll be good (I can always take that camera with me too, even having the DSLR, which is nice). If it were not because of the poor high-iso performance and slow aperture and I don't even think I would want or feel the need to change from compacts...

But there were also times where I changed lenses three times in one location (I may have too much fun with my fisheye). I also had the better low-light opportunities like the OP pointed out.

That is exactly my point, a good high-end superzoom compact, and a DSLR with a 24-300mm f/4.5-6.3 can both take good pictures 90% of the time under ideal conditions and good lighting where DOF is not a concern. I want my DSLR and lenses to cover exactly those last 10% (or at least 8% of those since really-low-light is in the FF department). I like the idea of having a fast prime for the shallow DOF and low-light situations, and, at the same time, have a fisheye or an ultra-wide at hand to capture that amazing landscape.

 

[jaomul]

I have both the d5600 and d7200. I like both, the d7200 is more capable in certain situations such as inclement weather and can use older lenses without motors. It is definitely more to carry, more so in bulk than weight.

Street and travel photography you say, I'd look into an Olympus em5 mark 2, the olly 12-50 weather sealed kit lens and a single prime such as the 17mm f1.8, light, lovely photos, great image stabilized body. Not quite dslr standard, but very close