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That seems to be the most reasonable account I've seen so far.
Nature Lovers, Sign the Petition
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IMO, this is not a valid comparison. As the hunter, he should know what the rules are.
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Agree; if he's pulling the trigger, he's ultimately responsible.
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Ok, don't disagree with you here persee, but I think maybe there is some bigger picture stuff here that might help explain why I'm not all that keen myself on turning this guy over to Zimbabwe's "authorities".
Do some reading on the "Green Bombers" sometime, what they call the "National Youth Service" in Zimbabwe. Having some idiot dentist shoot a lion for no other than reason that he felt it was "sport", that sucks. But compared to most of the stuff that goes on over there? Doesn't even count as a blip on the atrocity radar I'm afraid, and that's just the atrocities that are government sponsored.
So do I feel a lot of sympathy for the Dr. Diplittle? Nope. But trust me when I tell you that turning him over to Zimbabwe, well the punishment definitely doesn't fit the crime.
AlanKlein81 21
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Look, I fish off New Jersey on charter boats. The rules on the size of the different fish and quantity you can take varies season to season and can change during a season. Location matters too. Upper NJ into NY harbor, you have to take larger fish. Lower NJ you can take smaller fish. Where the line is known by the captain. He steers the boat and knows where that line is. You rely on the captain and his crew to keep current and to tell you what you can and can't take. If he steers in to northern Zone, he has to be the one to advise you can only keep the larger fish. And this is in a place where I live all year long. If you were to fish, or hunt, in a country on another continent, you're even more reliant on your guides. If the guide takes you to a place where he says you can take a lion, how would you know different? Of course the hunter or fisherman is ultimately responsible. So maybe, if I was the dentist, and the guide was the one who steered me wrong, I would sue the guide (who is licensed) for failing to do his job properly and causing me to lose my business and reputation. (Note that I haven't read anything that the guide said that put any blame on the hunter). If an accountant misfiles you tax return due to error on the accountant's part, he has to reimburse the penalty if not the interest that the IRS imposes. (Well you could get into a lawsuit with him.)
If it turns out the hunter was complicit in setting up an illegal hunt, than all bets are off and I'd agree with you. But that just doesn't seem reasonable at this point because he paid $50,000 for the hunt. While I understand why people are upset, it was the guide who should have made sure the hunt was completely legal.
rexbobcat
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He pleaded guilty in 2008 for poaching a black bear.
He knew what he was doing.
What we know about Minnesota dentist Walter Palmer - StarTribune.com
He knew what he was doing.
What we know about Minnesota dentist Walter Palmer - StarTribune.com
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Good lord….
I'm glad our priorities are straight….
A cat was killed in Zimbabwe? I've heard 9 amber alerts in the past week. Countless murders on the news in my local area. Thefts, wild fires, govt corruption….the list goes on.
How many of you gave a damn about a lion 2 weeks ago? My guess is none.
Hell, the Zimbabwean Govt doesn't even care about this cat. Half of them didn't even know it happened.
Sorry Tirediron. Couldn't hold back.
I'm glad our priorities are straight….
A cat was killed in Zimbabwe? I've heard 9 amber alerts in the past week. Countless murders on the news in my local area. Thefts, wild fires, govt corruption….the list goes on.
How many of you gave a damn about a lion 2 weeks ago? My guess is none.
Hell, the Zimbabwean Govt doesn't even care about this cat. Half of them didn't even know it happened.
Sorry Tirediron. Couldn't hold back.
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Then I would add we should not be perplexed on who profits, from hunts in Africa or wars in Iraq.
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You spend 50k to go to a foreign country with a corrupt government to kill something....but knowing rules should be left up to a couple of guides? WOW.
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I guess it kind of baffles me a little, I mean I realize that the folks that are up in arms about this have their hearts in the right place and I really don't fault them for being upset with the dentist.
But when you see 9 year old kids given AK-47's and forced into becoming killers for a local militia, given illegal drugs and forced to take them, etc - well when this is more or less commonplace practice it gets pretty hard to muster any righteous indignation over some bozo killing the wrong lion.
For me the thought of hunting any lion, well, it's repugnant. I'm not "anti-hunting" persee, but I guess I'm of the mind that if it's not something you are going to eat then it shouldn't be something you shoot.
But knowing what goes on over there, well it sort of gives you a much different perspective on the whole debate. Things like Gukurahundi,the Green Bombers, the list just goes on and on.
Wife of Mugabe rival burned alive after having feet hacked off Daily Mail Online
Stuff like this is par for course, and nobody really seems to get to worked up about it. Some dentist shoots a lion.. and bam, international outrage. I mean I get it, I understand why people get worked up over a beautiful critter like that getting put down for no good reason.
But I guess it just amazes me that all of this other stuff has been going on for years and years over there, and nobody really seems to take much notice.
rexbobcat
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I forgot that we can only care about, and discuss, one issue at a time. My bad.
I mean, you're worried about a few puny murders in your backyard? Don't you know there's a BILLION DOLLAR SEX TRADE? Children and young adults are sold into sex slavery, sometimes by their own families, and no telling how many are killed after a certain point to keep things hush hush.
People's priorities are all wrong indeed.
Besides, it's not like poaching is a problem or anything.
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AlanKlein81 21
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Well, maybe he poached the lion, and maybe not. The article you reference says this:
"The Zimbabwe National Parks and Wildlife Authority and the Safari Operators Association said Tuesday that Theo Bronkhorst, a professional hunter, lured Cecil to a farm owned by Honest Trymore Ndlovu, where the lion was killed by an American tourist. Both Bronkhorst and Ndlovu have been arrested, and Zimbabwean authorities said they are looking for Palmer in connection with the case."
There's no comment regarding whether the hunter was present when the luring was going on or that the guides set this up beforehand. Even if the dentist was present, how would he know the lion came from a protected area? Luring lion and other animals for the hunt is standard procedure and not illegal.
AlanKlein81 21
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I wonder how many lions previously were lured by the guide to the farmer's property to be killed by other visiting hunters. The dentist may be just the last hunter in a long line of illegal hunts set up by this guide and his friend the farmer whose farm is adjacent to a natural preserve loaded with lions to be hunted if just drawn over to the farm area. Easy and profitable business and the visiting hunters are just saps caught up in a fraud. Unfortunately, Cecil was the last of the lions and the whole thing blew up in the guide's and farmer's face and now the dentist is caught up in it as well.
rexbobcat
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I don't know what he did or didn't know, but given his history, I have no doubt he didn't care where the animal came from and wouldn't have been above it if he thought he could get away with it.
I've met enough trespassing unlicensed hunters on my dad's land to know that the "Trespassing? Killing without a license or lease to hunt on this land? I had no idea!" speech isn't so innocent. I have no sympathy for the guy.
That being said, I do think the news and social media have blown this up beyond what it should be.
It's all just an emotional circlejerk. This guy has become the face of poaching in general, which isn't fair to him, but it gives people the warm and fuzzies because it gives their righteous anger some specificity rather than just "Poachers kill animals illegally!? This is an outrage! Please validate my slacktivism on your Facebook feed."
It has all the parts to be a PERFECT media storm:
Rich white guy
American
Previous issues with the law for a similar situation
Killing or an animal that the West has romanticized
As a trophy
Using his wealth
Did it by luring the animal out
Hunter has disappeared
It's got something for everyone. The animal-rights people are mad because, duh, it's killing an animal. The hunters are mad because of the illegality and because they feel the hunt is unethical in the first place.
Even if he didn't break the law, you would still have people saying "Well, he should be shot anyways."
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