Nightmare shoot, unhappy customer, advice please!

[Derrel]

Great client!!! Wonderful children! NOT!!!!!!

I feel bad for you. The kids will all probably grow up to be little w***ers, with parenting like that.

 

[Rickroll]

If our clients are not completely satisfied with our product FOR ANY REASON (even after delivery of a wall print) we offer another session FREE.

That being said, we make absolutely sure we know exactly what the client REALLY wanted but failed to communicate to us--so we're all on the same page. Sometimes you must change the setting with hard to handle kids. We've found that if studio fails many times an outdoor session will work with children--and that our sales are usually higher as well when we go outside.

Speaking of sales, it sounds like you are doing "PROOFS" online--since she got hold of images and posted them on her Facebook page.

BIG MISTAKE!!! WE DO NOT PUT ANYTHING ONLINE UNTIL AFTER OUR CLIENTS HAVE SEEN THEIR PREMIERE IN OUR STUDIO AND PLACED AND PAID FOR THEIR ORDER IN FULL. ANY DEVIATION FROM THIS PROCEDURE WILL REDUCE PROFITS PER SESSION!!

In our 25 years in business, full time, we have only done session redos for THREE clients--in the worst case senario where we delivered large wall prints and they were not satisfied. However, in two of those cases, they were so thrilled with the new session that they bought enough extra prints that we made a good profit beyond the cost of replacing their wall portrait!

Hang in there, most clients are reasonable and fair and appreciate what you do for them!

The proofs were sent to her electronically because she asked that I not call to see her as she was unsure when she would be free, and again, getting to the studio was an issue for her. All were stamped and watermarked, so ironically she is sort of promoting me by using them on her profiles. I am not connected with her on Facebook, but the comments made by her friends there on the image she is using have been extremely positive and she is at least not saying anything negative on that, but the rest of her profile is unviewable to me so I don't know what else is being said.

As for shooting outside, I suggested this both before the shoot and upon my arrival, but she was very against this. She wanted a plain white background and nothing else. This made the edits easier, but still not as good as she hoped, obviously. There was no crossed wires about what she wanted. She was present for the whole shoot and we corresponded the whole time about everything. The only thing she did not specify, was where to place the children after editing images together, so I put them where they looked best in each image and most realistic.

 

[tirediron]

Do screen captures on all that usage - and then ignore her.

Would that actually count for anything though, if things turned nasty?

This is where you need to speak to a solicitor.

To be totally frank, I think most of the error is yours for carrying on when it was clear that the children weren't going to cooperate. After about 30 minutes (at the MOST), I would have said, "I'm sorry Mrs. Jones, but we're already at the half-way point in the session and based on my experience, I doubt we're going to be able to capture anything that will be of the quality I would require to show you. I will be happy to book another full session for you at no cost at some point in the future, but please remember that if you want all five children photographed, there will be a small extra charge of $____ for that."

 

[Rickroll]

Thanks for your input, it's appreciated. I did do what you instructed, but as I said in my OP, she refused the offer of a reshoot at the time of the original shoot and when I was telling her that the images were not going to be of high quality due to the distractions, she seemed unfazed and wanted to continue on, regardless of my advice to the contrary. Short of flat out refusing to do the shoot, there was little else I could do and while I accept that some responsibility is on me, I don't think that most of the error is mine because I continued on with the shoot at the request of the client. Stopping, especially after she had refused the offer to reshoot, would certainly have left me in a worse position than I am in now, I think

 

[amolitor]

I would ask around and see if she's done this before with other local photographers. What she is angling for is a bunch of free photographs. She may have developed a system for getting them.

 

[pgriz]

One of the costs of doing business is coming across unreasonable and abusive clients. In my experience, the faster you can recognize that you're dealing with "one of those", the faster you can get to the exit. In your situation, I think you've been given some very good advice already. The take-away may be to look back and see if/when the warning signs started to show up, and to see when it would have been appropriate to bail. Fortunately, the proportion of "bad" clients to "good" is generally quite low, and for most clients it is possible to find ways to accomodate even when things went off the rails. For the "bad" clients, there usually is no reasonable way.

 

[Steve5D]

She has said that she wants both a refund and a reshoot. One or the other I am willing to do for an easy life, but not both.

And you absolutely shouldn't.

Basically, she wants you to give her the money she paid you back, and reshoot the screaming little meatheads again.

I've got a better chance of having a baby.

Ask her to explain, logically, how that makes sense. Ask her to explain, logically, why she should receive a completely free portrait session because she was unable to control her little curtain climbers.

Seriously, ask her to do those things. If she can do it, then give her the money back and do the reshoot.

No worries, though, because the two things she would be trying to explain simply defy logic...

 

[Steve5D]

Do screen captures on all that usage - and then ignore her.

Would that actually count for anything though, if things turned nasty?

It would go to show that, despite her telling you she didn't like them, she actually did like them enough to share them with her friends...

 

[Mach0]

I didn't read the entire thread but this happens. It sucks but it does. I've kept candy and toys with me and bribed them or played the goof ball. Usually worked out. However, I have only done this with family. I have never attempted it with actual clients.

 

[EIngerson]

I feel for you man. I couldn't imagine dealing with that. Yet another reason for me to stay at the hobbiest/enthusiast level. You can keep days like that.

 

[yioties]

You won't be able to satisfy customers like this! Cut your losses and give her, her money back and never look back!

 

[Rickroll]

Thanks for all the input guys, I appreciate it.

I haven't heard from her today at all, which I thought may have been a good sign, however a friend of mine phoned me to let me know that she had approached him this morning asking if he was able to edit out my watermark from the proofs that I had sent over to her so that she could get them printed. My assumption is that she didn't know that we are friends and that it would get back to me, because she told him that I had sent her the proofs before Christmas (I didn't) and that she has not been able to get hold of me since in order to let me know what she wants printed, and so she is left with a selection of unusable proofs that she wants printing. He told her he wasn't able to and then contacted me. He wasn't aware that there had been an issue and assumed she was just trying to pull a fast one, which is now what I'm starting to think to, however I'm still sort of over a barrel because I can't prove that she has done this and if she still demands a refund or a reshoot I guess I'm sort of obligated, meaning I will either lose out on the money or end up working a load more hours for free. I'm not so bothered about the money, tbh. To get this over with I'd happily give it back, but I feel reluctant knowing that someone is obviously trying to do me over on this one, and doesn't have a genuine complaint.

 

[kathyt]

Thanks for all the input guys, I appreciate it.

I haven't heard from her today at all, which I thought may have been a good sign, however a friend of mine phoned me to let me know that she had approached him this morning asking if he was able to edit out my watermark from the proofs that I had sent over to her so that she could get them printed. My assumption is that she didn't know that we are friends and that it would get back to me, because she told him that I had sent her the proofs before Christmas (I didn't) and that she has not been able to get hold of me since in order to let me know what she wants printed, and so she is left with a selection of unusable proofs that she wants printing. He told her he wasn't able to and then contacted me. He wasn't aware that there had been an issue and assumed she was just trying to pull a fast one, which is now what I'm starting to think to, however I'm still sort of over a barrel because I can't prove that she has done this and if she still demands a refund or a reshoot I guess I'm sort of obligated, meaning I will either lose out on the money or end up working a load more hours for free. I'm not so bothered about the money, tbh. To get this over with I'd happily give it back, but I feel reluctant knowing that someone is obviously trying to do me over on this one, and doesn't have a genuine complaint.

Wow. I would kindly let her know that you own the copyright to the images and that having someone remove the watermark is illegal and unethical. Then ask her if she needs help finishing her order, because the gallery will only be active till XYZ date.

 

[tirediron]

Thanks for all the input guys, I appreciate it.

I haven't heard from her today at all, which I thought may have been a good sign, however a friend of mine phoned me to let me know that she had approached him this morning asking if he was able to edit out my watermark from the proofs that I had sent over to her so that she could get them printed. My assumption is that she didn't know that we are friends and that it would get back to me, because she told him that I had sent her the proofs before Christmas (I didn't) and that she has not been able to get hold of me since in order to let me know what she wants printed, and so she is left with a selection of unusable proofs that she wants printing. He told her he wasn't able to and then contacted me. He wasn't aware that there had been an issue and assumed she was just trying to pull a fast one, which is now what I'm starting to think to, however I'm still sort of over a barrel because I can't prove that she has done this and if she still demands a refund or a reshoot I guess I'm sort of obligated, meaning I will either lose out on the money or end up working a load more hours for free. I'm not so bothered about the money, tbh. To get this over with I'd happily give it back, but I feel reluctant knowing that someone is obviously trying to do me over on this one, and doesn't have a genuine complaint.

I feel your pain! My feeling is that at this point, anything you can do to separate yourself from this person is what you need to do! If it were me, and knowing that your secure legally (at least so it would seem - consult your solicitor for confirmation), I might even go so far as to send her a refund cheque along with a 'don't say something I will make you regret' letter from my lawyer. If you do refund her the money, make sure you have a witness to the refund and preferably do it in a form which can be tracked, but whatever you do, get away from this person.

 

[robbins.photo]

Thanks for all the input guys, I appreciate it.

I haven't heard from her today at all, which I thought may have been a good sign, however a friend of mine phoned me to let me know that she had approached him this morning asking if he was able to edit out my watermark from the proofs that I had sent over to her so that she could get them printed. My assumption is that she didn't know that we are friends and that it would get back to me, because she told him that I had sent her the proofs before Christmas (I didn't) and that she has not been able to get hold of me since in order to let me know what she wants printed, and so she is left with a selection of unusable proofs that she wants printing. He told her he wasn't able to and then contacted me. He wasn't aware that there had been an issue and assumed she was just trying to pull a fast one, which is now what I'm starting to think to, however I'm still sort of over a barrel because I can't prove that she has done this and if she still demands a refund or a reshoot I guess I'm sort of obligated, meaning I will either lose out on the money or end up working a load more hours for free. I'm not so bothered about the money, tbh. To get this over with I'd happily give it back, but I feel reluctant knowing that someone is obviously trying to do me over on this one, and doesn't have a genuine complaint.

Try to think about it in these terms, if you bend over backwards to give her everything she wants then your just encouraging her to do the same thing next time to some other small business - she needs to learn that she doesn't just get to throw a hissy fit and get her way. Maybe if she understood that she could have passed that lesson along to her children and the whole photoshoot would have gone smoothly as a result. However since she obviously feels entitled to have her cake and eat it too, her kids are turning out to be little monsters as well. So tell her no.. in fact not just no but hell no. Do it for the children.. lol