Officers Detain Man For Taking Pictures

fwellers · Jun 9, 2011

Basically I hear you saying that there are two sides to every story, and that you can see both sides.
While that is all well and good, I don't trust our govt, and I think that's a good thing too.
I don't care that the appearance of saftey is provided by this act. It still gives too much power to the executive branch of the govt. They can suspend habeous corpus simply by siting 'terrorism'. they can enact laws on the fly, they can do a lot of crap, and I have no doubt that they will abuse this power. It's human nature.
That's why we have explicit checks and balances in the constitution.

Sure there are times when they can be overridden for emergency situations, all with the full understanding that this is temporary. The patriot act is NOT temporary. There isn't a govt in the world who is ever going to give up power that they have, willingly. We will never get the govt back to where it was before this act. It's just the nature of govt. Self perpetuating, power hungry and ultimately out of control. That is exactly why we need to keep such a close eye on it. ( not the other way around ).

Butter Jeweler said:
fwellers said:

Do I have to be a constitutional scholar to have an opinion on this without being accused of being a puppet ?

Click to expand...

NO you don't but it would be appreciated that you stated all the facts when making accusations. What I have an issue with is this, you said "It does one thing. It gives power to the govt to make their lives easier." Does it? Is that ALL it is about? I think there is much you are leaving out and I just don't buy the "the government is only out to get us" lines....

I will say this, I fight against the government on almost every single time I can when I don't think they speak for us, think for us, act on behalf of us or even care about us. I think they want to bleed us dry, one tax dollar at a time. I think they want to tell us when and where to practice religion and virtually every other freedom that we are entitle under the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.. I think the fat suits in Washington would have us all on modern day reservations given the ability. I think we elect hypocrites that have nothing but self serving interests in mind.

That being said, I think the Patriot Act in all of its shortfalls, has provided very useful tools to enable the Military and Law Enforcement to protect us these years since 9-11. We have not had a single outside intrusion on this nation costing the lives of our friends and family since that day. The Constitution is not even a perfect document for everyone, it is imperfect to some and will never make everyone happy, but it does speak for the majority and is what this nation was founded on and the very premise I "try" and build my morals as an American around. You have heard the term "Freedom isn't Free"? There are some ugly things that happen to keep us safe everyday. If you have ever served in our Armed Forces you will attest to the fact that sometimes things get "dirty".

I was simply trying to state that this issue is not as black and white as it is sometimes described and a lot of the time it is portraid that way due to a lack of complete understanding in the article itself. My statements were not being used to insult or belittle anyone but to point out there are things that happen much deeper behind the scenes than us "little people" get to see.

Psytrox · Jun 9, 2011

Haha, this remindes me of when i was in the airforce, a few years ago. Simuler story, there was a photographer there (a photographer from the airforce) who was taking pictures of our missile defence system. Which obviously is classified. Our Lt asked him to stop, and delete the pictures, the photographer refuesed. He ended up getting all his memory cards confiscated.

Butter Jeweler · Jun 9, 2011

Village Idiot

Try use some common sense here..

You are still too short-sighted to see that I about 95% agree with you! Did you not take the time to read all of the posts? Read all the posts man!!!!! and don't just be a village.... Well you know

fwellers · Jun 9, 2011

I don't know why you insist on trying to make this personal and insulting me ? I heard you, and I was obviously commenting on the "5%" that we are disagreeing about.
You also insulted Village. Not his argument, but him.
It's always a telling thing when someone you are disagreeing with, immediately starts with the ad hominums.:er:

Butter Jeweler · Jun 9, 2011

fwellers said:
I don't know why you insist on trying to make this personal and insulting me ? I heard you, and I was obviously commenting on the "5%" that we are disagreeing about.
You also insulted Village. Not his argument, but him.
It's always a telling thing when someone you are disagreeing with, immediately starts with the ad hominums.:er:

Fwellers, I did agree with you.... You need to see who I was quoting (and his name is Village Idiot)

Butter Jeweler · Jun 9, 2011

And speaking of which Fwellers, did you not read his post either or did you conveniently not see him insult me first??????????????????????????????? I just didn't see you post a funny comment about him immediately starting with the ad hominums when I from the start tied to have a civil argument about something we are conflicting about. I sense I smell a double standard here ;(

fwellers · Jun 10, 2011

Butter Jeweler said:
And speaking of which Fwellers, did you not read his post either or did you conveniently not see him insult me first??????????????????????????????? I just didn't see you post a funny comment about him immediately starting with the ad hominums when I from the start tied to have a civil argument about something we are conflicting about. I sense I smell a double standard here ;(

Sorry must've missed that. It seemed you were insulting me. I usually tend to ignore the overlook the 'crap' unless it's directed at me. These forums are too much to read every thread and every word in them, so I seem to gloss over the rubbish ( personal attacks and stuff like that ). I used to pay close attention to that stuff, but what a waste of time it is.

)
Nice beard btw. hahahaha.