Polarizer for ultra-wide angle lens

[Majeed Badizadegan]

Hello TPF. I'm looking to purchase a circular polarizer to pair with my ef-s 10-22mm lens. To my understanding, if I buy a normal polarizer it will vignette. So it seems I need to get a "slim polarizer". I've narrowed it down to a couple here, but am open to suggestions:

looks like this "slim line" one has pretty shaky reviews, which is surprising because B+W usually gets very high ratings. From the comments, it doesn't look like the product is the highest of quality:
Amazon.com: Customer Reviews: B+W 77mm Slim-Line Circular Polarizer

This one has much better reviews but would cause vignetting:
Amazon.com: B+W 77mm Kaesemann Circular Polarizer with Multi-Resistant Coating: Camera & Photo

Does anyone have any idea how bad the vignetting would be if I went with the second one? Any other ideas or suggestions? Thanks.

 

[Dao]

I am now thinking about getting this one for my Sigma 10-20mm
Amazon.com: Marumi DHG Super Circular Polarizer CPL PL.D 77 77mm Filter Japan: Camera & Photo

And their ND8 filter as well.

That is mainly based on reviews on Amazon and this
Polarizing filters test - Results and summary - Lenstip.com

 

[2WheelPhoto]

Keep in mind its said that with ultra wides (or lenses below 28mm) the sky will be unevenly polarized. Dunno if that matters to you or not but some scrap the polarizor on wides because of it.

I'm not an expert of course but you can google it and find a plethora of info =)

 

[tirediron]

What he said! ^^ Once you get into the 10-15mm FL, polarizers don't always produce ideal results. Read those reviews carefully; almost all of them are whining about the B+W lens cap falling off (Slim filters don't have front threads; B+W includes a lens cap with their slim filters). I use the same filter, and yep the cap won't stay on, but that's easy to fix. Take the filter off when you're not using it, and use the regular lens cap! If you're shooting UWA, the regular one will be almost useless; in fact, I would guess you could even start to see vignetting at 20mm; certainly in the 10-12mm range, it's going to be very bad.

Get the slim one!

 

[480sparky]

Pop for the slim version... you won't be sorry. Save for the fact the B&W won't have any threads on the subject side of the filter, so you can't put a traditional lens cap on.

However, even when shooting with an ND and a CPL on my 10-24 @ 10mm, I get vignetting. However, I tend to 'overshoot' the scene anyway at these focal lengths so I can correct for the perspective distortion in post... so the vignetting gets cropped out anyway.

But yes.......... the issue of uneven polarizing in the sky is an issue. But not every shot where you need a polarizer will have sky in it .

 

[Buckster]

If you're shooting UWA, the regular one will be almost useless; in fact, I would guess you could even start to see vignetting at 20mm; certainly in the 10-12mm range, it's going to be very bad.

Get the slim one!

Let's test that theory.

I happen to have all the components in question: A Canon 10-22mm EF-S, a Canon 7D to put it on, and the B+W 77mm Polarizer Pro, regular, NON-Slim version, with threads on the front for stacking more filters or attaching a lens cap. Let's see how it works out...

For the test, I shot in aperture priority, so that it wouldn't change, and chose f/8 as the standard for all shots, for no particular reason. ISO was at 100 for all shots. Processing in LR4 consisted of importing the 4 RAW files, then without making any changes, not even enabling Lens Corrections, outputting all 4 to full-size JPGs as is. I then renamed the JPGs to keep track of what was what and uploaded them to my server. Here they are:

1. 10mm NO Polarizer:

2. 10mm WITH Polarizer:

"Almost useless"? "Very bad"?

Ummm... I don't think so.

Let's see what happens if we employ the LR4 Lens Correction filter on both, in order to deal with the regular 10mm vignetting, which has nothing to do with, and therefore will not be able to correct, any additional vignetting caused by the thickness of the regular, non-thin 77mm B+W polarizing filter screwed onto the front of the lens:

3. 10mm NO Polarizer WITH LR4 Lens Correction:

4. 10mm WITH Polarizer and WITH LR4 Lens Correction:

"Almost useless"? "Very bad"?

Ummm... I REALLY don't think so.

Now then, just for giggles, let's look at the 22mm images...

5. 22mm NO Polarizer:

6. 22mm WITH Polarizer:

"Almost useless"? "Very bad"?

I offer a somewhat different conclusion:

Use info and data and conclusions from sources who use real, actual testing and can show the results. Internet rumours and opinions spread by people pulling it out of their butts, even when they make it sound as though they actually know what they're talking about, is almost useless and very bad.

 

[2WheelPhoto]

You have an examples with more significant clouds, like a clear blue sky?

Thats where I've seen poor results mostly, trying to remove haze from a clear blue sky on a polarized wide angle

 

[480sparky]

If you're shooting UWA, the regular one will be almost useless; in fact, I would guess you could even start to see vignetting at 20mm; certainly in the 10-12mm range, it's going to be very bad.

Get the slim one!

Let's test that theory.

I happen to have all the components in question: A Canon 10-22mm EF-S, a Canon 7D to put it on, and the B+W 77mm Polarizer Pro, regular, NON-Slim version, with threads on the front for stacking more filters or attaching a lens cap. Let's see how it works out...

For the test, I shot in aperture priority, so that it wouldn't change, and chose f/8 as the standard for all shots, for no particular reason. ISO was at 100 for all shots. Processing in LR4 consisted of importing the 4 RAW files, then without making any changes, not even enabling Lens Corrections, outputting all 4 to full-size JPGs as is. I then renamed the JPGs to keep track of what was what and uploaded them to my server. Here they are:

1. 10mm NO Polarizer:


2. 10mm WITH Polarizer:


"Almost useless"? "Very bad"?

Ummm... I don't think so.

Let's see what happens if we employ the LR4 Lens Correction filter on both, in order to deal with the regular 10mm vignetting, which has nothing to do with, and therefore will not be able to correct, any additional vignetting caused by the thickness of the regular, non-thin 77mm B+W polarizing filter screwed onto the front of the lens:

3. 10mm NO Polarizer WITH LR4 Lens Correction:


4. 10mm WITH Polarizer and WITH LR4 Lens Correction:


"Almost useless"? "Very bad"?

Ummm... I REALLY don't think so.

Now then, just for giggles, let's look at the 22mm images...

5. 22mm NO Polarizer:


6. 22mm WITH Polarizer:


"Almost useless"? "Very bad"?

I offer a somewhat different conclusion:

Use info and data and conclusions from sources who use real, actual testing and can show the results. Internet rumours and opinions spread by people pulling it out of their butts, even when they make it sound as though they actually know what they're talking about, is almost useless and very bad.

Helluva lot just to counter someone's "I would guess" statement.

 

[Dao]

Even if the filter did cause vignetting, I believe it should be a easy fix in post.

As for the how even the polarizing effect is, I guess it depends on the scene.

 

[tirediron]

My apologies to the OP; I'm impressed by this example, and while I can, at this time, offer no evidence to support my earlier statements (as the necessary images are buried on HDDs in another location) I do know that when I was using a B+W slim CPOL on an 18-70 on a DX body, vignetting would start to appear at between 19 and 20mm. With a 12-24, the vignetting was so significant at the wide end, as to, IMO, render the image only fit for the bit-bucket.

 

[Buckster]

You have an examples with more significant clouds, like a clear blue sky? Thats where I've seen poor results mostly, trying to remove haze from a clear blue sky on a polarized wide angle

I was only interested in the vignettes question.

 

[fjrabon]

I've never really had the vignetting issue tirediron is speaking of. But you will absolutely get unevenly polarized skies with a polarizer if you're shooting anything much wider than about 20mm on a crop, 35 on a FF.

ie you'll get a very full, dark blue in areas where the polarization is strongest, and a light blue in areas where it isn't polarizing as much.

 

[Majeed Badizadegan]

Thanks everyone for your input.

"Almost useless"? "Very bad"?

Ummm... I REALLY don't think so.

Use info and data and conclusions from sources who use real, actual testing and can show the results. Internet rumours and opinions spread by people pulling it out of their butts, even when they make it sound as though they actually know what they're talking about, is almost useless and very bad.

Buckster, although your means are a bit "aggressive", I can't argue with the end result! Thank you very much for running this test. This is extremely useful information for me and others who will have the same question in the future.

Do you recommend the multi-resistant coating, or is single coating adequate? There's a price difference, so I thought I should pose the question here.

 

[SCraig]

Hello TPF. I'm looking to purchase a circular polarizer to pair with my ef-s 10-22mm lens. To my understanding, if I buy a normal polarizer it will vignette. So it seems I need to get a "slim polarizer". I've narrowed it down to a couple here, but am open to suggestions:

looks like this "slim line" one has pretty shaky reviews, which is surprising because B+W usually gets very high ratings. From the comments, it doesn't look like the product is the highest of quality:
Amazon.com: Customer Reviews: B+W 77mm Slim-Line Circular Polarizer

This one has much better reviews but would cause vignetting:
Amazon.com: B+W 77mm Kaesemann Circular Polarizer with Multi-Resistant Coating: Camera & Photo

Does anyone have any idea how bad the vignetting would be if I went with the second one? Any other ideas or suggestions? Thanks.

How about getting a step-up ring and a larger filter? Don't know what size you need, but perhaps go from a 67mm to a 72mm. That way you wouldn't have to worry about vignetting. I haven't tried it, and there may be some vignetting from the step-up ring, but it might work.

 

[Majeed Badizadegan]

Hi Scraig, all threads I'd be using this on would be 77mm.