Posting Meme Pics

[jake337]

Does all this mean I could print out a meme, post it in times square, take a picture focused on something a foot away, then post it here?

-Ken Turner

You could definitely make your own.

 

[Buckster]

Not specific to memes, but a related question: Suppose someone were to post a picture they shot of something like Times Square or some other heavily advertised public space that shows copyrighted images as either art or adverts or both? Or maybe just a photo that has say, a bus stop in it, with copyrighted images on the bus stop?

I believe it depends on if the image is being used as a documentation, or as an advertisement and if the copyrighted material is truly in a public space. These issues start to get extremely complicated, but usually only if used in a commercial setting.

I can appreciate that, but I'm truly only interested in TPF's take on it at this time.

 

[unpopular]

I think that there is room here for moderator discretion, as there seems to have been in the past.

 

[unpopular]

Not specific to memes, but a related question: Suppose someone were to post a picture they shot of something like Times Square or some other heavily advertised public space that shows copyrighted images as either art or adverts or both? Or maybe just a photo that has say, a bus stop in it, with copyrighted images on the bus stop?

I believe it depends on if the image is being used as a documentation, or as an advertisement and if the copyrighted material is truly in a public space. These issues start to get extremely complicated, but usually only if used in a commercial setting.

I can appreciate that, but I'm truly only interested in TPF's take on it at this time.

Of course ideally TPF's policy would follow that of the laws and courts

But who really understands the Niagra Transformative Test?

 

[Buckster]

I believe it depends on if the image is being used as a documentation, or as an advertisement and if the copyrighted material is truly in a public space. These issues start to get extremely complicated, but usually only if used in a commercial setting.

I can appreciate that, but I'm truly only interested in TPF's take on it at this time.

Of course ideally TPF's policy would follow that of the laws and courts

To my knowledge, the laws and courts only get involved when someone actually files a breach of copyright claim against someone who's violated it. I do know of some sites that have such a policy - they don't actively police images looking for violations, but react immediately to take down any image wherein someone has contacted the administration with a claim of copyright violation.

Again, that has no bearing on what TPF officials consider acceptable, and I just go with the house rules when I'm in somebody else's house, as I am here at TPF. They can make any rules they want, even exceeding those of say, US copyright law, and it just is what it is. I'm fine with that actually.

It would be nice to get as clear on it as possible, that's all. And I realize that can be difficult, if not impossible. A lot of times a violation of forum rules are a judgement call on the part of the mods and admins of any site because it's near impossible to cover every contingency with a simple rule, and there's no reason to have to put together a law library full of volumes of text on a forum just to try to give the members and owners a mutually satisfying experience. Usually, whatever call you make as a mod or admin will be seen as absolutely wrong by at least some of the members, while others will support it. It's rarely cut and dried with a unanimous reaction.

Even US Copyright law isn't clear enough to prevent people from ending up in court arguing over it. Trying to put together simple and clear rules on a forum is that much more prone to loopholes and judgement calls. All they can do is try their best and work with it and refine it as things progress over time and variations of it come up. On the part of the members, a warning to stop should be taken seriously. Taunting the mod or admin that has delivered the warning by repeating the offense in never justified.

 

[unpopular]

That is exactly my point. While KMH points to the copyright office's general and mostly accurate guidelines on appropriation and derivation, the Second Circuit Court of Appeals says that this isn't really the case under some circumstances.

Is the image above, titled Fallacious, "transformative enough" for me to call my own, or is it a violation of H&R Block's intellectual property rights?

 

[bentcountershaft]

Aren't memes considered parody?

 

[unpopular]

Perhaps. But they are by definition transformative. Starting on Page 11, Line 21 "Fair Use" the court discusses how some memes may fit in the Blanch v. Koons ruling.

http://www.softic.or.jp/Ysemi/2009/4_090917/Blanch v.Koons.pdf

However, simply repurposing an image as I had here is not absolutely protected. You have to actually do something with the appropriation, rather than just repackage it into a new context.

 

[Jaemie]

Here is the exact TPF FAQ in question, and all of TPF's FAQs are found here - Photography Forum & Digital Photography Forum FAQ

* You agree to only post images and/or other material to which you have exclusive copyright, or permission from the copyright holder that you are able to present to TPF Staff. Under no circumstances will any instance of copyright infringement be tolerated.

Note: My added emphasis in the quote.

Okay. Thank you.

 

[JoshuaSimPhotography]

Its a real shame. These pictures are intended to be shared throughout the internet. People only use memes to make others laugh, yet people see it as a crime. But something like the troll face was actually copyrighted, yet there are millions of sites that use it! but are we allowed to use the meme, but put our own caption?

 

[Jaemie]

Its a real shame. These pictures are intended to be shared throughout the internet.

That's true. Furthermore, as a form of parody, they are most likely protected by US free speech laws, though I don't know what that means for members in other countries. But that's not really the issue, here.

This is a private forum and the owner(s) has, for whatever reasons, decided he/she doesn't want members embedding images to which they do not hold exclusive copyright or permission. It's simply an arbitrary rule; the rationale is irrelevant, however sound or unreasonable it might appear. As members we are obliged to abide by these rules. This isn't a democracy.

It's like being invited to someone's home for dinner and being told to keep your shoes on. Many of us would find this silly and uncomfortable and even against our cultural norms, but what choice do we have in the matter if it's not our home and not a public space? I know, that's a weird analogy - lol.

On the other hand, I think there is a social phenomenon here that transcends the it's-simply-a-private-forum model. I think at some point a forum like this becomes more than simply a collection of guests. I hate the word "community" for a variety of reasons I won't bother discussing here, but I think that, after some time, a forum such as TPF becomes a community of sorts. And, as a community, I think some limited democratic governance can be a good thing. Of course, there's no obligation for the owner to indulge the membership's opinions, but I think it ultimately makes for a friendlier and happier atmosphere to allow some input from time to time.

Anyway, that's how this peace and love California girl sees it.

 

[JoshuaSimPhotography]

This isn't a democracy.

That is very true, this depends on what rank you are to actually get people to 'listen' to you, and I was also wondering, is this the worlds biggest photography forum? Or the one with the most members

 

[manaheim]

This whole "you can't post memes" thing is so ****ing stupid it makes my eyes bleed.

It's the rule, fine, I certainly won't do it... but I find it absolutely ridiculous.

I suppose I'll get banned for re-using someone elses opinion in my own words without getting their permission.

Oh hey... they fixed the stupid wrapping problem on the theme. Hurrah. TPF: providing value every day.

 

[Ernicus]

I think everyone should take a break and take some pictures, for one.

Two, I also think you should direct such things towards admins if you really are that butthurt about it.

Admins make the rules
Moderators help enforce the rules.

It appears those that are quibbling are not liking the rules...so take it up with the admin(s), not the moderators. Moderators just moderate not create.

 

[unpopular]

I wouldn't have a problem with this if the moderators would acknowledge that they have some discretion in the matter, or if not enforce the rules consistently. Either way is fine with me, but I think that the administration here needs to make a decision about how this place will be moderated.