Reinvest or keep buying Canon ?

Derrel · Jan 19, 2010

Village Idiot said:
This:

Derrel said:

Yes, a full frame body makes much more sense for somebody who wants to do top quality portraiture.

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Doesn't really have anything to do with this:

pcacj said:

My level is absolute beginner and I currently have a Canon XTi with two decent lenses and several low-end lenses. I have experimented with these lenses and do not currently modify my pics for color enhancement. My pics seem drab.

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Uh, yeah, actually it has a LOT to do with drabness. Go to DXO Mark and compare the sensor performance of a D700 against a Rebel 450D. The results might surprise you: the D700 has a signifcantly, significantly better image sensor. Compare cameras

The D700 has an overall sensor performance score of 80.5; the Canon scores 60.6. The D700's overall color depth score is 23.5, the Canon scores
21.9. The Nikon beats the little Canon in Dynamic Range, with the Nikon pulling 12.2 stops, the Canon 10.8. In the low light High ISO category, the D700 kicks the little Canon's butt, with a near top of the d-slr pack score of 2,303, while the Canon limps in with a score of 692.

Both cameras have 12 megapixel sensors, but the Nikon performs hugely better in low light and at higher ISO's, the Nikon has deeper, richer color, and wider dynamic range. So, unfortunately, a technical analysis of the 2.3x larger D700's sensor shows that its a significantly better imager than the economy Canon; as the 80.5 to 60.6 score shows, the difference is not slight, not a little, but a hugely significant margin in favor of the FF Nikon.

inTempus · Jan 19, 2010

Derrel, you're missing the point entirely.

His pictures look drab because he's not post processing them at all. Even if he's shooting JPG he's probably not adjusted his camera profile to increase saturation, sharpness or contrast.

That's the point

I have experimented with these lenses and do not currently modify my pics for color enhancement. My pics seem drab.

Buying a D700 isn't going to solve his problems. He's looking to buy a pro-sumer body to rectify a problem that should be addressed through post processing or even properly setting up the camera he's currently using.

lawnchair_alchemist · Jan 19, 2010

The XTi is a good camera. You don't need to upgrade the equipment you're using unless you want to get rid of a few of your lower quality lenses and get another good one. However, a tool is only as good as the user directing it. Ansel Adams could probably use a homemade pin-hole camera and compose an image that would take your breath away. Or, likewise, you could give a Canon 1D Mk III to a complete amateur and his pictures would look like they were taken with a disposable drugstore camera.

A few things to look out for:
-Seem a little drab? Bump up the saturation on your camera!
-WHITE BALANCE! This is crucial for getting your colors right. Unless you shoot in RAW, then it doesn't matter
-I'd probably bump up the contrast a little bit too. It will help define things and hopefully get that "pop"
-none of this can help unless you have a CORRECT EXPOSURE.

Sorry if any of that sounds harsh, it wasn't meant to be.

robertwsimpson · Jan 19, 2010

Here are some of the pictures I have taken with my XTi:

These were taken with the 18-55mm kit lens, the 55-250mm IS, and the 50mm f/1.8... nothing too special.

I can give you some pointers if you want, cause it's definitely not the camera.

Natalie · Jan 19, 2010

Holy crap, fantastic shots! :thumbup:

I love the last one... I don't know what that heron thinks he's going to see through all that duckweed!

inTempus · Jan 19, 2010

Thank you for a dose of reality Robert, your images are stunning.

As we can clearly see, the problem isn't with the camera. The issue is that the OP seems to think his woeful images are the result of not having invested enough money in equipment. We don't need to add fuel to this fire by telling him to go buy a D700 as if it's going to solve his problems.

It's not.

What we need to be doing is helping the OP to learn how to configure their camera and how to properly post process their images.

robertwsimpson · Jan 19, 2010

Natalie said:
Holy crap, fantastic shots! :thumbup:

I love the last one... I don't know what that heron thinks he's going to see through all that duckweed!

I'm pretty sure he caught a fish right after I took that picture. Shame I didn't get a photo of THAT. part of the 3fps downfall of the XTi I suppose. I just got a 50d last week, after spending an entire YEAR of saving and learning how to use my XTi to its fullest. Even then, the only real reason that I got the 50d is that I want to be able to shoot with my girlfriend. I gave the XTi to her. Now we have another together activity!

robertwsimpson · Jan 19, 2010

The turning point for me was the day I started shooting in RAW rather than JPG. It truly is a WORLD of difference. I shot in JPG+RAW for a week with my 50d in several different situations, and without exception, the RAWs were vastly superior to the JPGs. Food for thought.

Also, Thanks InTempus for the compliments.

SrBiscuit · Jan 19, 2010

/thread.

well done robert.

CLEARLY the camera can take brilliant shots.
perhaps a better understanding of the issue would be a good first step rather than dropping tons of cash on a new outfit. what are your incam settings? are you shooting raw? what color mode are you shooting in vs. viewing?

Village Idiot · Jan 19, 2010

SrBiscuit said:
/thread.

well done robert.

CLEARLY the camera can take brilliant shots.
perhaps a better understanding of the issue would be a good first step rather than dropping tons of cash on a new outfit. what are your incam settings? are you shooting raw? what color mode are you shooting in vs. viewing?

Which is why I posted that by all means, if the OP has the money and the want for a D700, then go for it. But as was also posted, that is not going to solve their problem.

Give me a Canon 300D, an EF-S 18-55, and a set of lights and I'll post photos that far surpass what the OP could do with a D700 and 24-70 f/2.8 because of the knowledge I have.

robertwsimpson · Jan 19, 2010

Village Idiot said:
SrBiscuit said:

/thread.

well done robert.

CLEARLY the camera can take brilliant shots.
perhaps a better understanding of the issue would be a good first step rather than dropping tons of cash on a new outfit. what are your incam settings? are you shooting raw? what color mode are you shooting in vs. viewing?

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Which is why I posted that by all means, if the OP has the money and the want for a D700, then go for it. But as was also posted, that is not going to solve their problem.

Give me a Canon 300D, an EF-S 18-55, and a set of lights and I'll post photos that far surpass what the OP could do with a D700 and 24-70 f/2.8 because of the knowledge I have.

that really isn't fair to say until we see photos and understand exactly what (s)he is talking about. Hopefully that will happen soon.

jnm · Jan 19, 2010

have you tried renting a pro lens and maybe studio lights to see if the difference in image quality is there? if pro glass and good lights on an XTi doesnt get you close to what you want then i'd have to say its likely user error. the XTi is a great camera, with some good equipment surrounding it you should be able to get great results. i'd try that first. well that and some PP work.

Tighearnach · Jan 19, 2010

I owned an XTI and shot almost exclusively in RAW simply as i had read about its advantages over jpeg and i figured i might as well get learning immediately. I noticed that as my ability to use Photoshop elements increased by pics began to look a lot better in terms of colour and contrast. Also another reason I moved to RAW was because I found the XTI jpeg setting as you mentioned - very drab. I am not even sure if there is the option to change the saturation etc of jpegs in camera (maybe Robert can comment on this) If your not interested in using photo software such as photoshop and you want good quality jpegs straight out of the camera I would recommend you upgrade your camera although the D700 might be a bit much.

Maybe the 500D or the 50D to get you started. I would also say to you to use your quality glass as much as possible if not always.