Short listed on Flickr??? (Semi Urgent)

j-digg · Apr 21, 2009

I just recieved a message that one of my images has been "short listed" for publication in Schmap Fort Myers Guide. No idea what this means.. heres a copy of what it said:

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"I am writing to let you know that one of your photos has been short-listed for inclusion in the seventh edition of our Schmap Fort Myers Guide, to be published early May 2009.

www.schmap.com/shortlist/p=34066898N06/c=SK20473341

Clicking this link will take you to a page where you can:
i) See which of your photos has been short-listed.
ii) Submit or withdraw your photo from our final selection phase.
iii) Learn how we credit photos in our Schmap Guides.
iv) Browse online or download the sixth edition of our Schmap Fort Myers Guide.

While we offer no payment for publication, many photographers are pleased to submit their photos, as Schmap Guides give their work recognition and wide exposure, and are free of charge to readers. Photos are published at a maximum width of 150 pixels, are clearly attributed, and link to high-resolution originals at Flickr.

Our submission deadline is Wednesday, April 22. If you happen to be reading this message after this date, please still click on the link above (our Schmap Guides are updated frequently - photos submitted after this deadline will be considered for later releases).

Best regards,

(Name)
Managing Editor, Schmap Guides"

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The link will send you to a place with terms and conditions.. maybe I should've posted this in the legal section? Any help would be greatly appreciated. And I think the deadline is tonite at midnight. Id love to get the pic published, but fail to completely understand the situation as a whole. Heres the pic

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tsaraleksi · Apr 21, 2009

Here's the thing. Schmap is making money from their guides, or else they would no longer be in business. Hence, there is no reason, other than cheapness (and the fact that they can get away with it) for them not to pay photographers. I would not submit it for something like this with no pay. You might not agree with me, but read the terms very carefully, because there is a good chance you will be signing over rights to the image, which is a bad idea in basically every case.

Village Idiot · Apr 21, 2009

If you have everything on your Flickr set to copyright and they publish it without your concent, they're breaking copyright laws.

j-digg · Apr 21, 2009

I definitely see where you're coming from tsara.. money would be awesome, but I'd be extremely happy to just have my stuff recognized some :lol:

. I suppose I will post the Terms here so people can read them over.. they don't look all that bad to me, it says they won't subliscense, and that they will indicate all rights belong to me. Here are the terms and conditions in their entirety ( now I'm sure this belongs in the legal section, lol )

TERMS OF SUBMISSION
THESE TERMS OF SUBMISSION (THE "TERMS") REPRESENT A LEGAL AGREEMENT BETWEEN YOU, EITHER AN INDIVIDUAL PERSON OR A SINGLE LEGAL ENTITY ("YOU"), AND SCHMAP, INC. ("SCHMAP"). BY CLICKING THE "SUBMIT" BUTTON, YOU CONFIRM YOUR ACCEPTANCE OF THE TERMS.

1. PHOTOS
The term "Photos" refers to one or more photographs and/or images licensed by You to Schmap pursuant to the Terms.

2. LICENSE GRANT
Subject to the terms and conditions herein, You hereby grant Schmap a worldwide, royalty-free, non-exclusive, perpetual license to include the Photos in the current and/or subsequent releases of Schmap's destination/local guides.

3. FAIR USE RIGHTS
Nothing in these Terms is intended to reduce, limit, or restrict any rights arising from fair use, first sale or other limitations on the exclusive rights of the copyright owner under copyright law or other applicable laws.

4. LIMITATIONS
The license granted in Section 2 above is made subject to and limited by the following express limitations:
(a) Schmap may only distribute, publicly display, publicly perform, and/or publicly perform the Photos pursuant to the Terms.
(b) Schmap shall be required to keep intact all copyright notices for the Photos and provide, reasonable to the medium or means of utilization, the name of the original author (or pseudonym, if applicable) if supplied, for attribution in Licensor's copyright notice, terms of service or by other reasonable means, and a credit (implemented in any reasonable manner) identifying the use of the Photos in any derivative Photos created by Schmap.
(c) Schmap shall, to the extent reasonably practicable, provide Internet link(s) to your Photos.
(d) Schmap shall not sublicense the Photos.
(e) Schmap shall indicate to the public that You reserve all rights with respect to use of the Photos.
(f) Schmap shall continue to make its destination/local guides available at no cost to end users.
(g) Schmap shall display the Photos at a maximum width of 150 pixels.

5. RIGHTS
You confirm that You own or otherwise control all of the rights to the Photos and that use of the Photos by Schmap will not infringe or violate the rights of any third parties.

6. NO OBLIGATION
Schmap shall have no obligation whatsoever to reproduce, distribute, broadcast, or otherwise make use of the Photos licensed by You to Schmap hereunder.

7. NO AFFILIATION
While the Flickr website and/or Flickr API have been used to short-list your Photos, Schmap claims no affiliation or partnership with Flickr.

8. MISCELLANEOUS
If any provision of the Terms is ruled unenforceable, such provision shall be enforced to the extent permissible, and the remainder of the Terms shall remain in effect. The Terms constitute the entire agreement between the parties with respect to the Photos licensed hereunder. There are no understandings, agreements or representations with respect to the Photos not specified hereunder. If there is any dispute about or involving the Terms or the license granted hereunder, You agree that such dispute shall be governed by the laws of the State of California without regard to its conflict-of-law provisions. You agree to personal jurisdiction by and venue in the state and federal courts of the State of California, City of San Francisco. The license granted in the Terms may not be modified without the mutual written agreement of You and Schmap.

JerryPH · Apr 21, 2009

They're making money off your photo and not giving you anything but a credit. That credit form them, to be honest, is not going to make you known or famous. I'd ask for payment or pull the picture.

Schmap does pay for the pictures, but they take from others when they can, for free.

I'd say, don't be the fool, ask for payment or lose the shot. If they are making money off your shot, why should you not either?

bdavison · Apr 21, 2009

If they need your photo so bad for their publication, they should be paying you for it.

j-digg · Apr 21, 2009

This sort of seems pretty small time, the picture would just be used as basically a thumbnail when you scroll over a point of interest, similar to google earth..heres a link to basically the exact same thing it would be used for:

Schmap Fort Myers Guide

nickisonfire · Apr 21, 2009

yeah i got asked to submit a picture for that to, i just gave it to them. i don't see it as much of a big deal.

gravity0 · Apr 21, 2009

JerryPH said:
They're making money off your photo and not giving you anything but a credit. That credit form them, to be honest, is not going to make you known or famous. I'd ask for payment or pull the picture.

Schmap does pay for the pictures, but they take from others when they can, for free.

I'd say, don't be the fool, ask for payment or lose the shot. If they are making money off your shot, why should you not either?

I agree, if it were me I'd tell them to kiss my butt. Besides I do photography for me, not to get famous or get recognition.

EPhoto8 · Apr 21, 2009

I have been asked by them to use my photos a few times. Each time I said no. Its neat to have an image published, its even neater to get paid for it and when you start giving images away you lessen the value of your work.

That being said, if you don't care about those things then go for it, but maybe ask them to pay for it first, just to see if they will.

Katier · Apr 21, 2009

I think it depends on how experienced you are. If your new to photography it's worth doing as long as you retain copyright control of the work as it's a string to your portfolio.

hourglass · Apr 21, 2009

I've also got one of my shots short-listed for a Schmap guide recently; actually I don't expect the terms of submission to pose any problems, and even if I too do photography primarily for myself as a hobby, getting some recognition doesn't hurt me either.

Garbz · Apr 21, 2009

j-digg said:
I definitely see where you're coming from tsara.. money would be awesome, but I'd be extremely happy to just have my stuff recognized some .

It won't be. That's the issue. If this is good enough to be published it's good enough to be paid for or at least good enough to be cited. I would not ever have an image of mine published without my name being attributed, and I very much doubt that would happen in this case.

So read these words carefully. There is NO recognition here. You won't be famous. No one will even know it was you who took it. And while you may feel smug now I'm sure when you see some random photo plastered in some guide with no attribution you won't feel that good.

Joves · Apr 21, 2009

Im in the if they are short listing me and, want my photo they pay. While yes I do see the photographers name below their photo on the site, I would still want to get paid. They are paid by the businesses for listing them so, you should be paid for your photo.

craig · Apr 21, 2009

"2. LICENSE GRANT
Subject to the terms and conditions herein, You hereby grant Schmap a worldwide, royalty-free, non-exclusive, perpetual license to include the Photos in the current and/or subsequent releases of Schmap's destination/local guides."

You have got to be kidding me. Giving away that kind of usage is business suicide. I guess if you are a hobbyist that is fine and it is "cool" to have your work published. I perceive Schmap's as praying on hobbyists for free photography. Yeah your work is amazing, but by not buying photos Schmap's is making close to 100% profit. They will get bigger and photography as a business will conceivably get smaller. Photography as a whole needs to stop being about "me" and start being about a community.

Love & Bass