The Myth of the Model Release?

[Vautrin]

I'm assistant/second shooter in a studio mainly because I like it (not my career, but is the photographers) - the models sign a release as they walk into the door. The pics WILL be used

I doubt any model that knows what she's doing, has posed before for anyone other than Joe "FB", would balk at signing it - fairly standard

True, but sometimes there are Tf* situations with a beginning model

These can be very interesting shoots, but you do need to explain now and then what a model release is

 

[Joves]

I'm assistant/second shooter in a studio mainly because I like it (not my career, but is the photographers) - the models sign a release as they walk into the door. The pics WILL be used

I doubt any model that knows what she's doing, has posed before for anyone other than Joe "FB", would balk at signing it - fairly standard

True, but sometimes there are Tf* situations with a beginning model

These can be very interesting shoots, but you do need to explain now and then what a model release is

Yeah because you are not dealing with the sharpest pencils in the box most of the time.

 

[nycphotography]

I'm assistant/second shooter in a studio mainly because I like it (not my career, but is the photographers) - the models sign a release as they walk into the door. The pics WILL be used

I doubt any model that knows what she's doing, has posed before for anyone other than Joe "FB", would balk at signing it - fairly standard

If the model is paying the photographer for his work, she's still expected to sign a release?

 

[Joves]

If you want to use them for self promotion yes I would. Wedding and portrait photographers have been having people sign releases forever it seems.

 

[Vautrin]

I'm assistant/second shooter in a studio mainly because I like it (not my career, but is the photographers) - the models sign a release as they walk into the door. The pics WILL be used

I doubt any model that knows what she's doing, has posed before for anyone other than Joe "FB", would balk at signing it - fairly standard

True, but sometimes there are Tf* situations with a beginning model

These can be very interesting shoots, but you do need to explain now and then what a model release is

Yeah because you are not dealing with the sharpest pencils in the box most of the time.

It has NOTHING to do with brains

Sometimes i meet people who havent modeled before. Beautiful people. Normal people. Fit. Fat.

Its interesting to me to take their photos.

They may have never modeled but that doesnt mean theyre dumb

 

[nycphotography]

If you want to use them for self promotion yes I would. Wedding and portrait photographers have been having people sign releases forever it seems.

IMO, That's a pretty shabby business practice.

As a customer, I'd tell them to either pound rocks... or pay/compensate me for my promotional value to them.

Or someone who conducts themselves like a professional might ask me after the fact if certain specific pictures can be used.

Last thing I want is a picture of my drunk Aunt Alice on some jackasses wedding photography site to show how he "captures the fun of the event".

 

[tirediron]

IMO, That's a pretty shabby business practice.

You mean "normal" don't you... every photographer I know retains the right to use the images for his portfolio (commercial work of course is an exception).

As a customer, I'd tell them to either pound rocks... or pay/compensate me for my promotional value to them.

As a photographer, I'll explain that the price you were quoted is based on the entire contract in front of you (which includes the right to use images for self-promotion) and if you won't allow me to do that, I will have just recalculate the price with that factored in. Never had it happen, but I'm guessing it will go up at least 50%.

Or someone who conducts themselves like a professional might ask me after the fact if certain specific pictures can be used.

I'm always happy to show the client the image(s) I do intend to use.

Last thing I want is a picture of my drunk Aunt Alice on some jackasses wedding photography site to show how he "captures the fun of the event".

Trust me, that's the last thing I want to use to show how I capture an event too!

 

[nycphotography]

Just because "everyone" gets away with something doesn't mean it isn't shabby.

If you plan to show me the pictures before using them, then I plan to approve them once you do. We don't need to sign a carte blanche release in advance for that. And if you'd sit across the table from us and say well then it's going to be 50% more, then I'd suddenly get really sticky about it just on principle.

And just because it's the last thing you want to show doesn't mean some other clown wouldn't decide it's a really cool idea. Or that you won't go nuts in 5 years when your meth habit gets out of control and try to extort my ex-bride and her wealthy new husband (after all, I'm far to principled to ever make any real money, so it's only a matter of time before she comes to her senses and leaves me).

If you think it's worth 50% more to not be able to use my pictures, honestly, unless your work was so much more compelling than what other people are producing for the same money, I'm going to take a pass. every. single. time. Take out a pen, strike out the clause and initial it. I guarantee you that if you won't, I'll find another equally talented, priced and available photographer who will.

 

[Ilovemycam]

Lawyer told me editorial = no release. Advertise commercially = need a release.

 

[pixmedic]

I was reading a photographer a while back who took a picture of a homeless man while doing street photography and could never sell it because he didn't have a model release. How is that any different?

It sounds like the photographer was short on legal knowledge and/or salesmanship.

A famous case (from a legal perspective) -Nussenzweig v. DiCorcia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Here is some info from a models perspective - About Model Releases

Call it a hunch, but it probably wasn't the photographer that backed out of the transaction due to the missing release. Almost all purchasers of images are publishers or in the media business in some way, and they have burrocratic rules to follow that are set by some of the least creative people in the media industry, and on the corporate lawyer side, maybe on the planet.

The last thing you're going to get a media house to do is bend a rule set by their bosses and lawyers when it comes to releases and rights.

Was the buyer likely well informed? of course not. But would it have likely made it difference if they were? of course not.

Welcome to cya corporate thinking.

burro...donkey...a$$...
I see what you did there!

 

[skieur]

Lawyer told me editorial = no release. Advertise commercially = need a release.

He was correct.

 

[tirediron]

Just because "everyone" gets away with something doesn't mean it isn't shabby.

It's in the contract; what precisely is the photographer "getting away" with?

If you plan to show me the pictures before using them, then I plan to approve them once you do. We don't need to sign a carte blanche release in advance for that. And if you'd sit across the table from us and say well then it's going to be 50% more, then I'd suddenly get really sticky about it just on principle.

I will generally tell you which ones, if any I intend to use, but that is a courtesy only.

and just because it's the last thing you want to show doesn't mean some other clown wouldn't decide it's a really cool idea. Or that you won't go nuts in 5 years when your meth habit gets out of control and try to extort my ex-bride and her wealthy new husband (after all, I'm far to principled to ever make any real money, so it's only a matter of time before she comes to her senses and leaves me).

If you think it's worth 50% more to not be able to use my pictures, honestly, unless your work was so much more compelling than what other people are producing for the same money, I'm going to take a pass. every. single. time. Take out a pen, strike out the clause and initial it. I guarantee you that if you won't, I'll find another equally talented, priced and available photographer who will.

The simple fact is, if you are going to be "principled" about my potentially using your images in portfolio, I am going to chalk you up as trouble, at which point I pull out a list of other local photographers and say, "I don't think I'm going to be able to provide what you need for your event. May I suggest you call X, Y, or Z?"

 

[nycphotography]

Just because "everyone" gets away with something doesn't mean it isn't shabby.

It's in the contract; what precisely is the photographer "getting away" with?

If you plan to show me the pictures before using them, then I plan to approve them once you do. We don't need to sign a carte blanche release in advance for that. And if you'd sit across the table from us and say well then it's going to be 50% more, then I'd suddenly get really sticky about it just on principle.

I will generally tell you which ones, if any I intend to use, but that is a courtesy only.

and just because it's the last thing you want to show doesn't mean some other clown wouldn't decide it's a really cool idea. Or that you won't go nuts in 5 years when your meth habit gets out of control and try to extort my ex-bride and her wealthy new husband (after all, I'm far to principled to ever make any real money, so it's only a matter of time before she comes to her senses and leaves me).

If you think it's worth 50% more to not be able to use my pictures, honestly, unless your work was so much more compelling than what other people are producing for the same money, I'm going to take a pass. every. single. time. Take out a pen, strike out the clause and initial it. I guarantee you that if you won't, I'll find another equally talented, priced and available photographer who will.

The simple fact is, if you are going to be "principled" about my potentially using your images in portfolio, I am going to chalk you up as trouble, at which point I pull out a list of other local photographers and say, "I don't think I'm going to be able to provide what you need for your event. May I suggest you call X, Y, or Z?"

Fair enough. At least we'd be in agreement on the point.

 

[Vautrin]

I dont get what the big fuss is.

Walk into ANY decent wedding photogs shop and hell have pictures on the walls, and available to look at with what he can do.

None will be of drunk aunt alice

Its normal to reserve the right for this type of display

What would not be normal would be to reserve the right for GALLERY display

 

[DGMPhotography]

What's the difference?