What's your approach to gear?

[Tbini87]

Thanks Derrel for all the insight. My wife and I have only really worked with low grade gear (D40 and Rebel), and have just grown used to having small, light cameras. The D7000 might be a good mix of higher quality but similar ergonomics, and a stepping stone to bigger, heavier models.

 

[orljustin]

"We are planning on doing everything from portraits to newborn to wedding to sports."

Sounds like a plan for failure.

"So, what approach would you professionals recommend?"

What does your business plan that you've developed tell you? Or are you just off to B&H to buy whatever you end up deciding on and hoping for the best?

 

[Tbini87]

"We are planning on doing everything from portraits to newborn to wedding to sports."

Sounds like a plan for failure.

"So, what approach would you professionals recommend?"

What does your business plan that you've developed tell you? Or are you just off to B&H to buy whatever you end up deciding on and hoping for the best?

Not sure how this is a plan for failure. Blanket statements like that without anything to back them up are useless on forums like this. I also don't understand how the first part of your post has anything to do with the approach professionals take towards purchasing gear. The first part has to do with what type of photography we will be doing. The second part has to do with pros think it is better to start with smaller, cheaper gear and build up, or spend a lot more money right off the bat to get the best gear available.

I don't understand how our business plan could "tell" us what approach to use when deciding what gear to buy. Weddings, portaits and newborn shots are going to be using a lot of the same gear and lighting. We have also enjoyed shooting a ton of landscape stuff when we visiting 13 national parks this summer, and the results were great using a D40 and kit lenses. I understand that sports are much different, and I don't think that this would be an area we would focus on or make much money on. However, having lettered in 3 sports in highschool, then playing tennis in college, and having lived and breathed sports for the first 21 years of my life, I wouldn't mind doing some work on the field or court if possible. I would not tailor our gear around sports, but I don't see why it would be impossible to shoot sports with a D90 or D300 and a 50-200 2.8 lens.

Now if you had some specific stuff you would like to add or talk about that would be great. I am obviously not "off to B&H to buy whatever and hope for the best". If that was the case would i be ASKING THESE QUESTIONS on this forum?! I am hearing different approaches from people who are making useful posts filled with useful information and then will make educated purchases from there. Thanks.

 

[JerrfyLube]

Sounds like a plan for failure.

Not necessarily.

They are new to the scene of professional photographers and not everyone, right out of the gate, knows what they want to shoot in the long term.

I got into the game being a "jack of all trades". Id shoot anything for money...weddings, parties, sporting events, portraits, advertisement, stock, etc. I thought sports would be where I wanted to go but somehow ended up with portraits being my biggest volume of customers and what I ended up being my best at.

I still do a little bit of everything but have focused my attention on portraits and social events and have built a fairly successful little business out of it, all the while having other pros tell me I would fail miserably because I refused to pick one specific niche and follow it. Well, I did eventually mostly settle on something that I enjoy but im not afraid to go into the realm of the unfamiliar and give it a go. Thats how we grow...

Find your area of expertise...and dont be afraid to shoot anything under the sun to find it. Charge accordingly...

 

[Tbini87]

Sounds like a plan for failure.

Not necessarily.

They are new to the scene of professional photographers and not everyone, right out of the gate, knows what they want to shoot in the long term.

I got into the game being a "jack of all trades". Id shoot anything for money...weddings, parties, sporting events, portraits, advertisement, stock, etc. I thought sports would be where I wanted to go but somehow ended up with portraits being my biggest volume of customers and what I ended up being my best at.

I still do a little bit of everything but have focused my attention on portraits and social events and have built a fairly successful little business out of it, all the while having other pros tell me I would fail miserably because I refused to pick one specific niche and follow it. Well, I did eventually mostly settle on something that I enjoy but im not afraid to go into the realm of the unfamiliar and give it a go. Thats how we grow...

Find your area of expertise...and dont be afraid to shoot anything under the sun to find it. Charge accordingly...

This is kind of the approach we are going to try out. We will probably be primarily wedding and senior/family portrait photographers. However, adding maternity and newborn shooting seems like a no brainer. And I would be more than open to shoot sports if people wanted me to do that. I love sports and nature and would have no problem shooting mountain bikers, football, basketball, soccer, etc. We are in a smallish town in CA that probably does not have a huge market for any 1 of these areas, so branching out may be the best way to stay busy for us.

 

[JerrfyLube]

We are in a smallish town in CA that probably does not have a huge market for any 1 of these areas, so branching out may be the best way to stay busy for us.

Exactly.

The High Desert region where I live is saturated with Portrait photographers, which is what I market myself as and honestly, I can see the big hits it takes against my business. I constantly have potential clients telling me "well so and so said they would do the same shoot for half the price..." Well, go with "so and so" then because im not going to jockey around my prices to stay competitive with other photographers who do a subpar job.

But while I have marketed myself as a portrait photographer, im still amazed at the constant flow of people, mostly former clients of friends and family of former clients, who approach me and want me to shoot weddings, bar\bat mitzhavs, their kids little league or soccer games, etc... Just yesterday I booked a fairly large job shooting and putting together a product brochure for a small company that specializes in boating accessories...all because I shot senior pictures for one of the employees daughters.

I guess what im saying is that different markets support all ranges of photography, whether it be a specific niche or photographers who shoot everything under the sun. Don't let the few negative nancy's who say you will fail just because you market yourself as versatile spoil the party for ya!

 

[orljustin]

"Not sure how this is a plan for failure. Blanket statements like that without anything to back them up are useless on forums like this. I also don't understand how the first part of your post has anything to do with the approach professionals take towards purchasing gear. The first part has to do with what type of photography we will be doing. The second part has to do with pros think it is better to start with smaller, cheaper gear and build up, or spend a lot more money right off the bat to get the best gear available."

Well, ok. "Newborn to wedding to sports". How do you plan to be an instant expert in every variety of photography genre to be able to fully satisfy your clients? By "newborn", I assume you mean in studio portraits. Do you have plans to purchase posing tables, fabric, backgrounds and setup an online proofing gallery for parents to look at? Simple shots of a newborn in a studio does not require a camera with a high frame rate shooting ability.

Weddings - Are you instantly well versed in producing trendy albums, you know all the shots that clients expect, do you have a camera that can shoot in low light due to venue restrictions? Do you have proper attire for events, as well as the extended hours to shoot? Small flashes and modifiers that allow you to move about the reception, getting good exposure while keeping the ambient high, or are you going to look like Uncle Joe with his P&S?

Sports? Do you have a camera with a high FPS, like a 1dsMk3? A wide range of autofocus points to be able to lock on to the action? An account at a printer offering all those keychain and calendar things? Or are you planning portraits, and you have 4 shooters, with duplicate cameras, lighting setups, and a system for tracking what team and individual you are shooting?

See? You can't really just walk into Photography, and say "I'm going to shoot everything. What's the best camera to buy?". You will try to satisfy everyone and end up making no one happy, because you don't have the experience, or connections, or equipment or knowledge. Best to concentrate on one thing first, master it, and then spread out.

With a business plan, you would know what market you are concentrating on, what the planned return would be for that market, and what equipment you should purchase to meet the needs and return for that market. ie., for portraits, you don't need an $8000 1dsMk3.

See?

 

[Tbini87]

"Not sure how this is a plan for failure. Blanket statements like that without anything to back them up are useless on forums like this. I also don't understand how the first part of your post has anything to do with the approach professionals take towards purchasing gear. The first part has to do with what type of photography we will be doing. The second part has to do with pros think it is better to start with smaller, cheaper gear and build up, or spend a lot more money right off the bat to get the best gear available."

Well, ok. "Newborn to wedding to sports". How do you plan to be an instant expert in every variety of photography genre to be able to fully satisfy your clients? By "newborn", I assume you mean in studio portraits. Do you have plans to purchase posing tables, fabric, backgrounds and setup an online proofing gallery for parents to look at? Simple shots of a newborn in a studio does not require a camera with a high frame rate shooting ability.

Weddings - Are you instantly well versed in producing trendy albums, you know all the shots that clients expect, do you have a camera that can shoot in low light due to venue restrictions? Do you have proper attire for events, as well as the extended hours to shoot? Small flashes and modifiers that allow you to move about the reception, getting good exposure while keeping the ambient high, or are you going to look like Uncle Joe with his P&S?

Sports? Do you have a camera with a high FPS, like a 1dsMk3? A wide range of autofocus points to be able to lock on to the action? An account at a printer offering all those keychain and calendar things? Or are you planning portraits, and you have 4 shooters, with duplicate cameras, lighting setups, and a system for tracking what team and individual you are shooting?

See? You can't really just walk into Photography, and say "I'm going to shoot everything. What's the best camera to buy?". You will try to satisfy everyone and end up making no one happy, because you don't have the experience, or connections, or equipment or knowledge. Best to concentrate on one thing first, master it, and then spread out.

With a business plan, you would know what market you are concentrating on, what the planned return would be for that market, and what equipment you should purchase to meet the needs and return for that market. ie., for portraits, you don't need an $8000 1dsMk3.

See?

We don't plan on being experts in ANY of these fields instantly. Is anyone instantly an expert in anything? I don't think so. We plan on starting small, and working our way up.

Newborns- we plan on traveling to the home of the client, working in their place, and making a make shift studio. Couldn't be that hard to do for newborn shots. We won't need a studio, and the same gear can be used with all other portait and wedding shots.

Weddings- we have talked about different ways of doing things. Offering prints vs. a CD and giving them the printing rights. Offering albums is another option. Not experts yet... but working out the details. That is why I am on these forums trying to learn.

Sports- I would do this on the occasion of being asked to do so by family, friends, or coaches that I know. Not an expert, but have plenty of knowledge in the area. This would require the biggest change in gear, but like I said, I don't think it would be impossible to get some decent shots with a D300 and 50-200 2.8. Could be totally wrong, but again, no I am not an expert.

I don't understand where you come off thinking that someone has to be a "master" of something before doing it. How does someone become a "master"? By getting out there and doing it! I am not going to act like we are experienced professionals, but that doesn't mean that we couldn't go from shooting portraits, to newborns, to weddings. Will it take a lot of work and research? Sure. Luckily there is a wealth of knowledge around this forum and people that are willing to help us out and reduce the learning curve. Thanks for your input.

 

[Overread]

I don't understand where you come off thinking that someone has to be a "master" of something before doing it. How does someone become a "master"? By getting out there and doing it! I am not going to act like we are experienced professionals, but that doesn't mean that we couldn't go from shooting portraits, to newborns, to weddings. Will it take a lot of work and research? Sure. Luckily there is a wealth of knowledge around this forum and people that are willing to help us out and reduce the learning curve. Thanks for your input.

Careful with bold statements like that

Also I think the argument is more that before you take up professional work (that is being paid for your product) you first ensure that you are able to create the product and within the area of photography ensure that you have the gear and experience to get the product in a variety of lighting and situational conditions likely to arise.

This is done in many ways depending on your area, conditions, finances and the type of photography you are going into. For example in weddings you can mentor/ghost/second shoot for an existing photographer - thus letting you get experience in the field without putting the clients at risk of a poor product (because the "pro" is there to do that for the day). It also lets you have total freedom to experiment again without risks and further for something like a wedding it gets you used to the time and organisational factors of the day.

For something like portraits friends, family and (if you go into modeling) trade for prints and the like are again all ways to practice before putting yourself up for hire.



The key to this approach is ensuring that you know you CAN deliver the product and deliver it at a high quality before you charge for your work. It also has the great benefits that you have a working portfolio to attract clients and can start with a good quality product to attract good clients (and charge accordingly).
Of course we say this all without knowing your current talent level so in some part it might be a moot point - but its not about being the master - just about being competent and experienced

 

[Tbini87]

I don't understand where you come off thinking that someone has to be a "master" of something before doing it. How does someone become a "master"? By getting out there and doing it! I am not going to act like we are experienced professionals, but that doesn't mean that we couldn't go from shooting portraits, to newborns, to weddings. Will it take a lot of work and research? Sure. Luckily there is a wealth of knowledge around this forum and people that are willing to help us out and reduce the learning curve. Thanks for your input.

Careful with bold statements like that

Also I think the argument is more that before you take up professional work (that is being paid for your product) you first ensure that you are able to create the product and within the area of photography ensure that you have the gear and experience to get the product in a variety of lighting and situational conditions likely to arise.

This is done in many ways depending on your area, conditions, finances and the type of photography you are going into. For example in weddings you can mentor/ghost/second shoot for an existing photographer - thus letting you get experience in the field without putting the clients at risk of a poor product (because the "pro" is there to do that for the day). It also lets you have total freedom to experiment again without risks and further for something like a wedding it gets you used to the time and organisational factors of the day.

For something like portraits friends, family and (if you go into modeling) trade for prints and the like are again all ways to practice before putting yourself up for hire.



The key to this approach is ensuring that you know you CAN deliver the product and deliver it at a high quality before you charge for your work. It also has the great benefits that you have a working portfolio to attract clients and can start with a good quality product to attract good clients (and charge accordingly).
Of course we say this all without knowing your current talent level so in some part it might be a moot point - but its not about being the master - just about being competent and experienced

We have been doing a lot of free shoots to gain experience, and have recently had people contacting us and "paying" us for some shoots. We charge next to nothing, but have been really pleased with the results so far. We are just in the beginning stages of starting up, and we will not be charging any ridiculous amounts for portrait sessions or weddings until we have had success and feel confident in ourselves. With that being said, I think we are definitely capable of getting some very good results, and have been for a while, just using a D40 and 35mm prime.

I am glad these extra discussions have been brought up. An entire different discussion could be on the topic of "is it better to specialize or to be more well rounded"? Can a photographer make more money or be more successful shooting ONLY weddings, portraits, or newborns... or can they be more successful shooting weddings, portraits, maternity, AND newborns.

I understand that sports is an entirely different topic, but the basics of photography apply to all different types of photography still, right? I mean you need to get some good light, properly expose your image, look through the hole and push the button. I understand that each of those little tasks can take a lifetime to perfect, but in general the basics apply to shooting a pregnant mom, her newborn baby, or her oldest daughter's wedding.

 

[Tbini87]

Oh and Overread, just noticed on your flickr you do a lot of animal and landscape stuff. Don't have a flickr (yet?) but got a ton of cool shots from our road trip this summer where we hit up almost all the national parks on the western half of the US. Also, most of our portrait work is on our blog Capturing One Moment at a Time if you have any interest in commenting on our "talent level". The road trip pics are from june-september on the blog.

 

[Overread]

Be careful with starting out with low prices - if you market yourself (through advertisments and through word of mouth and your customers) as low budget photographers when you come to try and up your prices to a more healthy level you'll have to rebuild your whole client base all over again since many before will be disinclined to pay more for what they've had similar of in the past.
Also be careful if you are working in the lower boundaries - make sure you have clear and concise contracts for each client and shoot and make sure you stick to your guns as you'll meet a lot of the penny pinchers.


Also as to marketing yourself have a watch of the crits here:
http://www.zarias.com/category/critique/

they go not only into photography but there is also advice on marketing, website design and a host of other things as well as (somewhere) Zacks opinions and ideas on marketing toward either a do everything or a selective company.


As for the basics - sure the basics can be very similar with regard to techinical exposures - but the environments are very different - its a whole different skill in posing a mother and child for the camera than it is to capture a great shot of someone playing in football - don't be too quick to underestimate the differences

 

[Tbini87]

Be careful with starting out with low prices - if you market yourself (through advertisments and through word of mouth and your customers) as low budget photographers when you come to try and up your prices to a more healthy level you'll have to rebuild your whole client base all over again since many before will be disinclined to pay more for what they've had similar of in the past.
Also be careful if you are working in the lower boundaries - make sure you have clear and concise contracts for each client and shoot and make sure you stick to your guns as you'll meet a lot of the penny pinchers.


Also as to marketing yourself have a watch of the crits here:
zarias.com :: The blog of editorial photographer Zack Arias Critique

they go not only into photography but there is also advice on marketing, website design and a host of other things as well as (somewhere) Zacks opinions and ideas on marketing toward either a do everything or a selective company.


As for the basics - sure the basics can be very similar with regard to techinical exposures - but the environments are very different - its a whole different skill in posing a mother and child for the camera than it is to capture a great shot of someone playing in football - don't be too quick to underestimate the differences

Thanks for the link and input. We have only really been working with friends and acquaintences through our church and university. We have not been charging much, but probably never will charge these type people much unless we were just swamped in work and didn't have free time to shoot (which I can't see happening for a while... or probably ever due to where we live).

We are working on a website, and will have competitive prices, but definitely not incredibly low. Probably a little bit lower than the competition in the area (some of which is not very good, and some we would aspire to be like).

 

[Overread]

Be a little cautious of undercutting the market - for one (esp in current times) the market is often working close to the limit and undercutting from there might harm your long term considerations (eg not leaving enough budget over for expansion/upgrades).

Secondly (esp if you get into the wedding market) having a good working relationship with other local pros can be a great benefit. If you get overbooked you can direct clients there way and vis veras, but also if you happen to have an emergancy or illness that prevents you attending a wedding/other major booked one time event you can contact other pros to have them cover for you.

Those are generalist points to consider and individual relationships will detail out how such setups work (ie who pays who and what not), but its a good healthy thing to have in the bag as a backup

 

[orljustin]

"We don't plan on being experts in ANY of these fields instantly. Is anyone instantly an expert in anything? I don't think so. We plan on starting small, and working our way up."

Good, so you should start small, in one genre and work your way up. Trying to play to all categories means you are sub-par at all.

"Newborns- we plan on traveling to the home of the client, working in their place, and making a make shift studio. Couldn't be that hard to do for newborn shots. We won't need a studio, and the same gear can be used with all other portait and wedding shots. "

Wow, a make shift studio. I'm sure the client will be thrilled at a bed sheet and a lamp. "Couldn't be that hard to do". I'm telling you it is not that easy. But you'll find that out. "The same gear" - did you even read what I wrote before?

Weddings- we have talked about different ways of doing things. Offering prints vs. a CD and giving them the printing rights. Offering albums is another option. Not experts yet... but working out the details. That is why I am on these forums trying to learn.

"Sports- I would do this on the occasion of being asked to do so by family, friends, or coaches that I know. Not an expert, but have plenty of knowledge in the area. This would require the biggest change in gear, but like I said, I don't think it would be impossible to get some decent shots with a D300 and 50-200 2.8. Could be totally wrong, but again, no I am not an expert."

I'm sure the clients will understand "you're not an expert".

"I don't understand where you come off thinking that someone has to be a "master" of something before doing it. How does someone become a "master"? By getting out there and doing it! I am not going to act like we are experienced professionals"

If you're charging money, you are a "professional", and you should be able to competently deliver. More and more, you're sounding like someone who got some good snaps with their birthday DSLR, and fancy themselves a photography company. Sorry, but it just ain't that simple.