Developer A vs Developer B

[Grandpa Ron]

I have finally reached to point where my Large Format and black and white home development errors have been reduced to tolerable numbers.

Quite frankly, I am surprised how once the negative is digitized, even with a simple light table and digital camera, how easy it is to post process really nice prints. I know the master of the photographic art might cringe at what I call an excellent photograph; but after reading Ansel Adam's book trilogy, I realized why I have always enjoyed turn of the last century photos. Yes those old photos often lack the exposer, tonality and sharpness of modern film prints. They simple simply look natural, "as shot" is the common term: even tough a lot of photographic processing knowhow was used to deliver what the old photographers wanted.

Naturally I have been working with the less expensive Arista EDU and Mummy brands of 4x5 films. so my question is, does the brand of film and/or developer make much difference when not using the traditional dark room techniques?

 

[RAZKY]

I have finally reached to point where my Large Format and black and white home development errors have been reduced to tolerable numbers.

Quite frankly, I am surprised how once the negative is digitized, even with a simple light table and digital camera, how easy it is to post process really nice prints. I know the master of the photographic art might cringe at what I call an excellent photograph; but after reading Ansel Adam's book trilogy, I realized why I have always enjoyed turn of the last century photos. Yes those old photos often lack the exposer, tonality and sharpness of modern film prints. They simple simply look natural, "as shot" is the common term: even tough a lot of photographic processing knowhow was used to deliver what the old photographers wanted.

Naturally I have been working with the less expensive Arista EDU and Mummy brands of 4x5 films. so my question is, does the brand of film and/or developer make much difference when not using the traditional dark room techniques?

Normally the film and developer makes all the difference, but with all the digital fakery nowadays I doubt it matters that much. As for back-illumination when copying negatives, a light box is better suited than a light table, but whatever works is good.

 

[MartinCrabtree]

If the information isn't on the negative no amount of post production can do anything. You still need to expose for what you want to see and develop to bring it out. If there's no shadow detail or highs are blown out that is what it is.

 

[480sparky]

Agreed. I think it's a false belief that scanning and digital editing renders a developer non-relevant. If you don't expose correctly, and don't develop properly, you'll run the risk of losing details in either (or both) the shadows and highlights.

 

[Grandpa Ron]

I agree you cannot restore what is not there, but you sure can digitize and make a usable print out of some really poor negative goofs.

I have done a little dark room work with some very old equipment. It is enjoyable but very time consuming for the beginner, with no feel for negative density, and the approximate enlarger exposure and development times. Plus the only room in my home with no window is the bathroom.

 

[MartinCrabtree]

An experienced printer can do the same with negative and paper. Take a good look at Adams' Moonrise,Hernandez,New Mexico and what he did to make that print happen. You'll use a lot of chemicals and paper finding that image but IMHO worth the effort. Personally I do my best to make it happen in the camera but cannot rely on that working all the time.

 

[480sparky]

When shooting analog, you need to be intimately familiar with the camera, the film stock and the darkroom.

Ansel wrote several books (The Camera, The Negative and The Print) about this.

 

[MartinCrabtree]

Yep. I have just begun re-reading the series...again.

 

[webestang64]

From someone who is a lab rat and scans about 95% of all the film (35mm,120) that comes into the lab it does make a differance, BW or color. From my experience the brand name BW's do better with a high end scanner.
T-max, Delta, Hp5, Tri-x, Neopan all scan better than say Arista, Kentmere, most of the Lomo line. There is a new host of "off" brands I get at the lab and it makes for some interesting adjustments as some do not offer a temp/time for the stardard D-76 I use.
BTW, speaking of Dev A vs B the Arista 76 is very close to K's 76. I did a film speed test useing both and they came out very close with the Arista brand being a tad more contrasty.

 

[MartinCrabtree]

From someone who is a lab rat and scans about 95% of all the film (35mm,120) that comes into the lab it does make a differance, BW or color. From my experience the brand name BW's do better with a high end scanner.
T-max, Delta, Hp5, Tri-x, Neopan all scan better than say Arista, Kentmere, most of the Lomo line. There is a new host of "off" brands I get at the lab and it makes for some interesting adjustments as some do not offer a temp/time for the stardard D-76 I use.
BTW, speaking of Dev A vs B the Arista 76 is very close to K's 76. I did a film speed test useing both and they came out very close with the Arista brand being a tad more contrasty.

Any experience scanning Eastman 5222?

 

[Grandpa Ron]

I have often used Ansel Adams as my gold standard.

While I had dabbled in B&W photography for decades, like many folks raising a family in the 1970's and 80's, Ektachrome slides in 127 format were my go-to film.

But Black and White was always special. Even before I knew who Adams was, I could spot his work vs. other B&W artist at the time.

After reading his book triligy, I realized that before Ansel ever pressed the shutter, he instinctively knew; what developer he would use, how he would push or pull the development time, what paper grade, chemicals and toners he would need for his prints.

The gift of an old view camera thew me head long into large format. Processing the film at home was not much of a problem, but digital conversion of the negatives was far faster and less expensive the wet processing. It also helped sort the "keeper" shots.

I think there is a certain "feel" to a print you can hold in your hand, that is lost in the digital conversion. Unfortunately, if you want to share it with friends and family, I will be digitized.

 

[webestang64]

Any experience scanning Eastman 5222?

Scans well. Only thing about this film.....it requires your exposure be as close to spot on as possible.

 

[MartinCrabtree]

Interesting. I shot it (my F5 so...) @500ISO. Think I may pay someone to soup this one. Thank you.

 

[dxqcanada]

Ansel did not use instinct ... he methodically tested his films, developers, and paper and then was able to correctly predict the final image through his equations.

 

[480sparky]

.... I realized that before Ansel ever pressed the shutter, he instinctively knew; what developer he would use, how he would push or pull the development time, what paper grade, chemicals and toners he would need for his prints.....

The same process can apply to digital. I've 'seen' lots of my images before I touch the camera. I know exactly what camera settings to use, what lens to use, what post process I'll use at home....