Giving and Receiving C&C

[c.cloudwalker]

Be that as it may, if you do not know how to take a technically correct photo, how can you even possibly begin to get creative

Very true.

And I'll give you my take on the dreaded rules here as this is my last post for quite a while probably.

First, there are no rules in photography. Rules are for society, games, etc but not for art. Artistic endeavors have guidelines. Some of those came about by people observing what pleases the eyes best. Others came about to trick the eye into being pleased such as the fact that on very large sculptures of standing people the head is larger than it should be. It is a way to trick the eye into thinking it is normal size.

And, btw, this is one of the reasons I tell people to study design rather than photo composition. Some tricks like that are never mentioned in photo composition books and they can be quite useful

In most cases, we create art to please the senses in one way or another so, using the guidelines makes it easier. Why re-invent the wheel? Just use what is available. In some cases, using the guidelines doesn't work because we want to trick the viewer into another sort of reaction and that is when we get away from the darn things.

But you can only get away from the guidelines in a way that makes sense and works if you know the guidelines in the first place. So, that means that you have to learn them in the early stages of you development as an artist. Then, do whatever.

But, once you've learned the guidelines, you'll most probably never think much about them. They will become second nature and so will knowing when to get away from them.

Hope this helps someone.

 

[KyleeLL]

As a newbie I appreciate all "real" comments, postitive or negative. When it comes to my camera I can honestly say that I am only an expert at turning it on and off. Without the comments of others how else does one expect to increase in skill?

 

[bigtwinky]

I often accidently turn my off when moving my finger from the shutter to the trash button.

 

[Dominantly]

I often accidently turn my off when moving my finger from the shutter to the trash button.

Then you clearly shoot with a Canon

 

[SoonerBJJ]

Bump for anyone who might've missed it.

 

[Big]

I vote making this a sticky!

 

[onetolearn]

So, I think I may be the "newest" member here and I wanted to say that I totally agree with you. I am also probably the "newest" to photography and really don't know crap. I want to learn from everyone who knows more than I do, and the only way to learn is by your mistakes. I don't want to hear my pictures are perfect. (That's for my family to tell me haha) I want to hear what I need to improve, and furthermore HOW to go about doing it. I want to learn from others and train my eye to what makes a decent photo and what makes an AMAZING photo! And, like said before....I'm not going to learn that by someone telling me my photo is nice!!!

 

[melrose09]

What about making two separate forums...one for just posting (hey, here's some photos, see!) and one for C&C (here's some photos that I want help with)?

 

[Big]

So, I think I may be the "newest" member here and I wanted to say that I totally agree with you. I am also probably the "newest" to photography and really don't know crap. I want to learn from everyone who knows more than I do, and the only way to learn is by your mistakes. I don't want to hear my pictures are perfect. (That's for my family to tell me haha) I want to hear what I need to improve, and furthermore HOW to go about doing it. I want to learn from others and train my eye to what makes a decent photo and what makes an AMAZING photo! And, like said before....I'm not going to learn that by someone telling me my photo is nice!!!

You picked a good place to learn, the people here are awesome and so smart!

 

[Gaerek]

What about making two separate forums...one for just posting (hey, here's some photos, see!) and one for C&C (here's some photos that I want help with)?

So people who don't want to get better and hear nothing but praise can have their own place to post pictures? Kinda seems counter-productive to me.

The problem still boils down to people not wanting to hear negative comments about their work. You will have to hear negativity if you want to get better.

Besides, the galleries (scroll down from main forum page) usually offer a lot less in the way of C&C than the beginners forum, if you want to have a lesser chance of hearing negative comments.

 

[Overread]

We do have a section for no critical commenting - the "Just for fun" section. All the rest of the subjections critical comments are allowed. Infact in the past the beginners area was not an area where images were posted and the galleries were all there was.

As for people not "developing" one must always understand that not everyone takes photography in the same "serious" light. Some are quite happy to keep taking and sharing snaps and nothing more. You see less of these people on a forum because forum people tend to be hobbyists which means things get taken more seriously by most (but not all).

In addition after bad vibes and overall horrible results the C&C section of TPF was taken down a long time ago (Before my time here) and with the current user base and the new site owners I do not see that section making a return.

 

[The_Traveler]

In addition after bad vibes and overall horrible results the C&C section of TPF was taken down a long time ago (Before my time here) and with the current user base and the new site owners I do not see that section making a return.

Actually I was an active member here when the C&C section was pretty active. There were a lot more good photographers posting here then and TPF was much less of a beginners' forum - which is clearly is today as you can see from the volume of posting in the beginners' forum compared to the others.

At that time, there was even a strong movement to allow the mods to remove non-substantive posts (I love this, I don't like this, etc) just because they swelled the posting totals but didn't contribute at all.

I am one of the people who give C&C in a rather straightforward manner. I say exactly what I think about the picture but try always to say things in a way that respects the photographer and assumes that he/she wants honest opinions so they can improve.

Many people here are new enough to taking pictures so that the technical issues about a picture are the only things they can grasp; i.e. they haven't yet learned how to view a picture as successful or not. They know intuitively and express it as "I like your picture' but they can't go beyond that. And that is the most important thing a new photographer can get from looking at others' pictures and reading C&C. Why do they like something? Do technical
issues mean the picture is less successful than it should be?

My attitude always is that any picture should be counted as successful if it has an emotional, intellectual or artistic impact and that technical issues are only important as they detract from that impact.

I'm a 1st grade teacher and when I was in college, my profs told us that when talking to parents about their child, you should always "sandwich" negative comments or news with positive comments.

I'm not much of a believer in always saying something positive. That might be useful, even necessary, with first graders but I would hope that at least some of the people here are more mature than that and want to be treated as adults. And there is little as obvious and as patronizing as a positive comment that is tortured out of a total mess of an effort. I believe in always saying the truth as I see it.

One of the major failings of TPF in the last couple of years has been the gradual decrease in the number of competent people who actually say the truth. Not too long ago, after seeing quite a competent portraitist make a big deal out of a minor positive point in a posted picture while totally ignoring the blatant failings. I asked why that comment when I knew the commenter knew better; the response was that they didn't want the OP to feel bad.

This can either be a ego support system for mediocre photographers or a place where people who want it can actually depend on hearing the truth and learn to be a better photographer.

The fact that this kind of thread reappears so often is evidence that it is failing as a center of learning.

Lew

 

[SoonerBJJ]

^^^^^
Great post.

 

[Gaerek]

The_Traveler's post makes me wish I could thank someone multiple times.

 

[SoonerBJJ]

And what is it with the proliferation of "hey what do you think of my random snapshot" threads?

Thoughtful critique seems moot when the effort was completely random.