I want a LF camera... someday.

[Helen B]

Thanks for the link - I hadn't seen the website. It doesn't really do the cameras justice. There are some much better pictures on LFPhoto.info, taken by Kirk Gittings, if I remember correctly.

I have the maple/black version, and I've been very happy with it. It was worth the wait. It has a remarkable range of movements, and I'm looking forward to getting the bag bellows I have on order.

Good luck,
Helen

 

[Samriel]

Been reading around the LF forum, and it's full with a lot of useful information. I also ordered the suggested book above, as it seems to be have a lot of pictures (which I really need until I get a camera and still messing with the screws myself). Should be here 'till the end of the week.

As for the camera, I'm going to be watching the used market on eBay, LF forum and locally for a Kodak MasterView 8x10, or any other camera in it's range (I've been told that some Tachiharas and Nagaokas can be found cheap locally). If I don't get something by April, I think of investing quite a bit more and getting a Chamonix 8x10.

How much does the camera quality influence the print (negative) quality with 8x10 contact prints? Is it mostly about the lens quality (if the camera is functioning as it should and has no leaks etc.)?

 

[JC1220]

The Masterview is my 8x10, all bias aside, I think you would enjoy it. I know there is one forsale here: http://www.michaelandpaula.com/mp/AzoForum/one.asp?ID=11447&PgNo=&GID=11447&CID=10 I don't know the guy selling it. Not sure if it makes sense to ship overseas if you think you can find one there.

I used a triple extension 8x10 tachi for a while and felt it was a well built camera, if you can find one it would be a fine choice as would a new Chamonix.

If the camera is in good shape you will not have any technical issues... aside from user errors The lens will determine your print quality. Just about any new modern LF lens will provide you good results and in your journey you will find some will command higher prices than others. Mostly these days due to the amount of coverage they provide as those with cameras larger than 8x10 compete heavily for the relatively small number of lenses that will cover their format, and the fact these lenses are of very good quality as well.

Older lenses will give you that classic look of the pre-50's and the modern lenses, IMO, give a more "clean" look. Also be sure to check image circle when buying a lens so you know that it will cover 8x10, here is a handy chart for modern lenses: http://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses/LF8x10in.html

 

[Samriel]

Thank for the link for to the Azo forum. Seems interesting... looking at the pictures do you think the camera is in good shape (I have no ability to judge that　yet...), and with the extras is worth the price? I'd tend to offer less for it judging by the prices of Kodak Master Views I've seen elsewhere.
A new double extension Tachihara is around USD1650 here... A triple extension around USD1800. I'll probably rather get a Tachihara with extras instead of a Chamomix if I go for a new camera.
The chart is very useful. I was already wondering about the proper image circle sizes.

 

[JC1220]

It looks in decent shape, I would want to see more pictures and know where the new bellows came from. I would say he is asking about $600-800 extra for the other bits. The camera alone will go for around $1100, the 5x7 back is worth at least $175 and are rare to come by, Grimes probably charged around $400 for the adapter. Not sure I would have done that unless I had another camera that took that syle of board as you could have bought at least 4 new lensboards for that investment. I would think if you could get the lot for around $1500 it would be a fair price.

 

[Samriel]

I've started reading the resources on large format photography you guys linked me to, and I'm understanding a few thing better now.
However, the problem is that I think I'll really understand most of it only after I start using it. So, as my budget is a bit limited at the moment, I've scheduled the purchase of a 8x10 field camera for April next year. Until them I'm going to practice some film developing and contact printing with smaller formats just to get the basic idea of film processing etc.
Now, while I can't afford a camera at the moment, I was thinking of getting certain accessories upfront, and I was wondering if you guys could tell me what I'll need for a start, and maybe give me some recommendations.

LENS

I'll be shooting mostly nudes and people both indoors and outdoors in B&W, so I was thinking a lens in the range of 210mm~300mm (35mm~50mm in 35 equivalent) might be what I need. I'm not sure how large an image circle I really need for this type of photography, so any advice and specific lens recommendations are welcome.
It would also be quite helpful if somebody could explain lens boards to me, and maybe shutters as well. Read something on it, but couldn't properly understand it.

TRIPOD

What I have now is a poor excuse for a tripod, but it holds my dSLR so I don't complain much. However, for the 8x10 I'll really need something proper. As I plan to shoot outdoors as well, light would be better, but it's not top priority. Stability first, weight second, price third. Tripod head recommendations are also welcome.

FILM

As I'm new to this, I have no idea about the differences in film, except for the light sensitivity (ISO). I've found some Kodak and Fuji film in a big electronics store here, and was quite surprised that 10 sheets come at around USD80~120. I think I'll be thinking a lot before making the shot. Any specific film recommendations?

PAPER

And I know even less about paper than I know about film. Any recommendations and examples would be highly appreciated. I plan to do only contact printing, in case that has any effect on film and paper choice.

FILM HOLDERS

I'd like to get 4~5 8x10 film holders, and I'm not sure if there is a difference in the brands I see on Ebay and similar sites. I'll maybe get a few 4x5 holders as well if I decide to get a reducing back as well.

OTHER STUFF

Does a 8x10 reducing back fit all 8x10 cameras or are they made separately for several types? Also, can a 8x10 be turned vertically on the tripod (not the back, the whole camera per tripod head movement), and still be stable? What kind of light meter do you use, and where do you measure usually? Can my dSLR be used as a light meter when shooting LF? Any affordable light meters you'd recommend?

One last question, although a demanding one: Could you explain me step-by-step the WHOLE process from setup until the shot is complete (no processing)? For example:

1. Setup the tripod.
2. Setup the camera on tripod.
3. Position the model / Ajdust the scene.
4. Adjust the focus.
5. Adjust the focal plane (camera movement).
6.
...
20. Press the shutter
21. Wait.
22. Take out the holder.

etc.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[Steph]

This is a step by step guide to taking a picture with a LF camera, copied from here (this link also provides a more detailed description for each step).

1-Choose the camera position, approximate orientation, focal length.
2-Set up and level the tripod and camera.
3-Attach the lens and open it to full aperture.
4-Focus roughly using the focussing knob.
5-Adjust precisely the composition while looking at the ground glass.
6-Focus precisely with tilts/swings.
7-Determine the optimal aperture.
8-Re-adjust slightly the composition (optional but recommended).
9-Adjust filters and compendium shade (optional but recommended).
10-Check for vignetting (optional but recommended).
11-Close the lens, cock the shutter, rap and insert the film holder.
12-Determine the shutter speed.
13-Set the aperture and shutter speed.
14-Remove the dark slide.
15-Look at the subject.
16-Fire the shutter with a cable release.
17-Put the darkslide back in.
18-Remove the filmholder.
19-Make a second identical exposure (optional but recommended).
20-Pack and move to the next spot.

In your case (nude and portraiture) I think the use of movements will be limited as they are used to control depth of field and/or perspective (unless you want to use those movements for special effects in your portraits such as very shallow DOF). Therefore your lens does not need a huge image circle. If it covers 8x10 with a few millimetres to spare to adjust composition without moving the camera, you should be fine.

 

[epatsellis]

If it were me, just starting out, I'd start with 4x5, use Arista film (about $30 a box of 50), make all my mistakes first, then start shooting the 8x10. There are about 10 million ways to screw up, and everybody does starting out, minimize the cost of those mistakes makes the most sense to me.

 

[JC1220]

Lens
Image circle for 8x10 with some movements should be around 390mm or about 15 inches. Lenses that will cover from 210mm/8 1/4" and up: Goerz Dagors, Artars, Schneider symmar, Symmar S, G-Claron, Nikkor M, Nikor W, Rodenstock Sironar-N, Caltar, Wide Field Ektars, cost with shutter will be anywhere from $200 to $800 and more once you get beyond 19" lenses, mostly due to demand and coverage. If you have questions about a specific lens PM me or post.

Space your lens choices between 4 and 8 inches apart, for me this has given the best selection with out having too many lenses.

Modern shutter choice is a Copal, this houses the lens and has your controls for f stop and shutter speed. But you will also see Ilex and often Compound, the later being unreliable.

The lens board is made to go with your type of camera, and what the shutter/lens get mounted on.

TRIPOD
Here you don't want to skimp and my only suggestion to you is a Ries tripod with their simple pan/tilt head. All other movements of leveling can be done with the tripod legs as they articulate and you can place them in just about any situation. You could get away with a J series for 8x10 as it will hold up to 16 pounds.

FILM
Bergger, Ilford, Efke, Adox, Kodak all make fine films. This is something you will need to experiment with to find what you like. Perhaps others (Helen) can suggest color options. And, yes they are all expensive some less so than others.

PAPER
Well, if you are going to contact print I have only one suggestion here and that is the new Lodima Silver Chloride paper due to be delivered late this year or early next. With out going overboard on this I will just say silver chloride papers produce results that give a 3D effect, great tonal range and appear to just "glow." Of course the best developer for this type of paper is Amidol based, again expensive on its own. But, others make very good contact prints with other developers and papers for that matter, Kentmere and Bergger are both fine papers. Finding a developer(s)/paper/film combination you like can take some time.

I had heard that Fuji (IIRC), still makes a silver chloride contact paper, but it is only available in Japan. This was a few years ago, so it may no longer be available or it may be an RC version, which really is not the same.

FILM HOLDERS
Fidelity and Lisco for plastic 8x10's are most common. New 8x10 Fidelitys run about $80-90 each, 4x5 $30-40 each. Good used 8x10's run $40-60 each. There are also older wood holders, Kodak, Ansco and others. These are a good alternative as long as everything is in order. They run $25-50 each. If you can, get a few new ones first to reduce the possibility of light leaks with used holders, and decrease frustration.

OTHER STUFF

The reducing back is made for your specific cameras, although others may fit, like a B&J does fit the Masterview, but this is rare.

You could roll the camera vertically, but why would you want to do this when you can just pop out and rotate the back? How stable it will be depends on the quality of the camera, the tripod and how well it is mounted to the tripod. Also, doing this the bellows may sag into the image circle and focusing and adjusting will be a royal pain in the ass.

You can get away with using a camera as a light meter, or an ambient one, but for LF a 1 degree spot meter is the way to go. Unlike roll film you can expose and process each sheet separately, and being able to meter your highlights and shadows more precisely is a big advantage.
The Pentax Digital Spot has been the most popular for LF users; you can pick them up used on eBay $200-300.

__

If you need more info on something let me know.
JC

 

[djacobox372]

I'm a big fan of speed graphic cameras:

Cheap: About $200-300

Well built: these were EXPENSIVE, pro press cameras back in the day

Versitle: Can be used as a hand-held 4x5, or as field camera on a tripod. Has the movements that are most commonly called for.

Plus, they look cool:

 

[monkeykoder]

There are severe limits on movements on some speed graphics you would have to do extensive research on graflex.org

 

[djacobox372]

There are severe limits on movements on some speed graphics you would have to do extensive research on graflex.org

"Severe" is subjective.... I rarely see photos that I couldn't take with a speed graphics "limited" movements. With a speed graphic you have about 30 degrees of front/back tilt, and about two inches of lens rise/fall. You may lose forward tilt with lenses <90 degrees, and there is no rotating back.

But seriously, that covers about 98% of all situations I encounter; hardly "severe" to me. I've found that most of the graflex detractors don't even realize that the bed drops to allow front tilt.....

 

[epatsellis]

or that the B&J press allows shift as well as rise and fall....

 

[monkeykoder]

That is if you buy an anniversary or later speed graphic. The pre-anniversary and earlier speed graphics do not have the bed drop therefore do not have the front tilt. While I'm not arguing with the idea of buying a speed graphic you can have problems if you don't research. Also many times at least on e-bay what is listed as a 4x5 speed graphic is actually a 2x3 or a 3x4 both of these have a very limited selection of emulsions available. Again it is relatively easy to tell if you look at enough photos of speed graphics which one is which (or read a thread on it on the forums of the site previously mentioned) but being prepared is key when searching for one.

 

[djacobox372]

That is if you buy an anniversary or later speed graphic. The pre-anniversary and earlier speed graphics do not have the bed drop therefore do not have the front tilt. While I'm not arguing with the idea of buying a speed graphic you can have problems if you don't research. Also many times at least on e-bay what is listed as a 4x5 speed graphic is actually a 2x3 or a 3x4 both of these have a very limited selection of emulsions available. Again it is relatively easy to tell if you look at enough photos of speed graphics which one is which (or read a thread on it on the forums of the site previously mentioned) but being prepared is key when searching for one.

I'll echo your warning about the 2x3 and 3x4 speed graphics been sold as 4x5--I've been looking for another one and it seems that 2 out of 3 for sale are listed incorrectly. :-0

They are great cameras, but they do have limitations that any prospective buyer needs to be aware of. They also have options, like a rangefinder for hand held shooting, that are missing from most other field cameras.