press passes. . . have one?

[jstuedle]

Something to add to the free lance press pass discussion. Always, and I mean always carry a note pad with you when displaying a camera and press pass. Nothing screams amateur more than a press photographer who is not prepared to take notes. If you are really going to shoot news and attempt to get published, ask questions first. Talk to the officers/fire chief at the scene when they are available. Get details, times, names where appropriate and stay out of there way when life, limb or property are at stake. Nothing will make an official remember you in a negative way more than obstructing them in there duties. And in the heat of an emergency, it's not the time to argue and spout a free press. There is time to discuss that afterwards. You might miss a shot today, but you will build relationships that might get you THE shot next time. If you don't have the legal resources of a major news outlet behind you, you don't have much of a leg to stand on if arguing with the man.

 

[Seefutlung]

I cannot believe that you bluff your way onto an emergency response situation. That is totally messed up.

Getting into a concert or ball game is one thing ... but actually passing over a police line and interrupting an emergency response personal ... asking questions and diverting their attention from the emergency when you are pretending to be a credentialed/working press is wrong.

As a former "real" member of the working press I'd like to add ... that a press pass also lets the police know that not only does the person holding the pass have greater privilege than the general population ... but they also assume all liability when crossing a police line. If you are not prepared to assume the liability of crossing a police line than don't cross. This not fun and games but terribly serious business both from a reporting sense and also from a personal harm sense. I think that if one is reckless enough to pass a police line with false credentials ... if you are reckless enough to be somewhere that you shouldn't ... then I think that you are probably reckless enough to put yourself in a situation where you may endanger yourself and/or those around you.

Emergency response teams have enough problems dealing with the situation at hand ... they do not need wannabe press running around behind police lines as well.

If you want to be a member of the press corps then become a member ... go to school, go work for a paper, get the experience and skills to earn a real credential. Bluffing with a false credential is irresponsible and wrong at all levels .

Gary

PS- Freelance does not mean that you are entitled to a press pass. Being a member of a club does not mean that you are entitled to a press pass. Getting published does not mean you are entitled to a press pass. Having an editor(s) at the newspaper officially elect and sponsor you is the only methodology which entitles you to a press pass.
G

 

[jstuedle]

I cannot believe that you bluff your way onto an emergency response situation. That is totally messed up.

Getting into a concert or ball game is one thing ... but actually passing over a police line and interrupting an emergency response personal ... asking questions and diverting their attention from the emergency when you are pretending to be a credentialed/working press is wrong.

As a former "real" member of the working press I'd like to add ... that a press pass also lets the police know that not only does the person holding the pass have greater privilege than the general population ... but they also assume all liability when crossing a police line. If you are not prepared to assume the liability of crossing a police line than don't cross. This not fun and games but terribly serious business both from a reporting sense and also from a personal harm sense. I think that if one is reckless enough to pass a police line with false credentials ... if you are reckless enough to be somewhere that you shouldn't ... then I think that you are probably reckless enough to put yourself in a situation where you may endanger yourself and/or those around you.

Emergency response teams have enough problems dealing with the situation at hand ... they do not need wannabe press running around behind police lines as well.

If you want to be a member of the press corps then become a member ... go to school, go work for a paper, get the experience and skills to earn a real credential. Bluffing with a false credential is irresponsible and wrong at all levels .

Gary

PS- Freelance does not mean that you are entitled to a press pass. Being a member of a club does not mean that you are entitled to a press pass. Getting published does not mean you are entitled to a press pass. Having an editor(s) at the newspaper officially elect and sponsor you is the only methodology which entitles you to a press pass.
G

Obviously we read into things what we want. So let me digress. I studied PJ in the 60's. Was close to enlisting in 1971 to become an Army photographer, I fully intended on going to Nam when an injury sidelined my desire. I do freelance PJ for local county news rags and am insured. I am a professional freelance photographer and photojournalist. Our papers have no official press photogs, just freelance like myself and thus issue no press passes. Both county papers use the publishers high school kid as a "staff" photographer and have less credentials than I, not even a piece of plastic on a lanyard. I do what I do professionally and am well schooled in the rights and etiquette of photojournalism. I am not sure what the statement "being a member of a club" was intended to prove but I do/have belonged to several professional associations. This is stating not much as anyone who can pay the dues can belong to most of them. I cover my territory with respect of authority, knowledge of standard police practice and restraint where needed. All that said, 99% of what I shoot in the PJ realm is grand openings, ball games, fairs, funerals fires and other typical small town happenings. I should add I have earned the respect of members police and fire first responders in the area. When I encounter a first responder that does not recognize me, I am treated with the same respect I show them. I most likely should have included earlier the environment I work in. I would imagine not totally typical. Therefore a disclaimer: What works for me here and now, may not do the same for you. Small town heartland America is not L.A, N.Y. or anything approaching the big city, things move a little slower here. And with a lot more respect for each other.
Gary, I totally respect you and your work, we just live/work in two different worlds. I envy the access you once held and the celib's you shot, but I am also happy with where I live and work now. I have been retired for a while now and appreciate the slower pace of small town mid-west. I couldn't see myself working in a major media market at this point in my life and frankly that is refreshing.

 

[table1349]

I cannot believe that you bluff your way onto an emergency response situation. That is totally messed up.

Getting into a concert or ball game is one thing ... but actually passing over a police line and interrupting an emergency response personal ... asking questions and diverting their attention from the emergency when you are pretending to be a credentialed/working press is wrong.

As a former "real" member of the working press I'd like to add ... that a press pass also lets the police know that not only does the person holding the pass have greater privilege than the general population ... but they also assume all liability when crossing a police line. If you are not prepared to assume the liability of crossing a police line than don't cross. This not fun and games but terribly serious business both from a reporting sense and also from a personal harm sense. I think that if one is reckless enough to pass a police line with false credentials ... if you are reckless enough to be somewhere that you shouldn't ... then I think that you are probably reckless enough to put yourself in a situation where you may endanger yourself and/or those around you.

Emergency response teams have enough problems dealing with the situation at hand ... they do not need wannabe press running around behind police lines as well.

If you want to be a member of the press corps then become a member ... go to school, go work for a paper, get the experience and skills to earn a real credential. Bluffing with a false credential is irresponsible and wrong at all levels .

Gary

PS- Freelance does not mean that you are entitled to a press pass. Being a member of a club does not mean that you are entitled to a press pass. Getting published does not mean you are entitled to a press pass. Having an editor(s) at the newspaper officially elect and sponsor you is the only methodology which entitles you to a press pass.
G

Sorry to burst your bubble, but having a press pass or being a member of the press does not mean you have a greater privilege. I have been a law enforcement officer for over 25 years and being a member of the press never has nor does it currently mean any such thing. Amendment one of The Bill of Rights makes it very plain.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

No where in the first Amendment does it give the press any greater privilege. No court in the land has ruled that the press has a right to know what ever they feel that they want or gives them the right to go where others may not. Freedom of the press means that you have a right to publish any news that you may find or are able to obtain. Not that you have a right to any information you choose to create the news.

In fact in the last few years the press has learned that they are not as privileged as they liked to believe. They absolutely hate being ordered to turn over information to the courts when it is of an [FONT=&quot]evidenturary nature. But it does and will continue to happen. The press is free to report the news. The last reporter here that crossed a police line learned the true meaning of free press. He did a wonderful, first hand article on spending a night in the county jail and all the ammenities he had, or shall I say, didn't have. [/FONT]

 

[Seefutlung]

Obviously we read into things what we want. So let me digress. I studied PJ in the 60's. Was close to enlisting in 1971 to become an Army photographer, I fully intended on going to Nam when an injury sidelined my desire. I do freelance PJ for local county news rags and am insured. I am a professional freelance photographer and photojournalist. Our papers have no official press photogs, just freelance like myself and thus issue no press passes. Both county papers use the publishers high school kid as a "staff" photographer and have less credentials than I, not even a piece of plastic on a lanyard. I do what I do professionally and am well schooled in the rights and etiquette of photojournalism. I am not sure what the statement "being a member of a club" was intended to prove but I do/have belonged to several professional associations. This is stating not much as anyone who can pay the dues can belong to most of them. I cover my territory with respect of authority, knowledge of standard police practice and restraint where needed. All that said, 99% of what I shoot in the PJ realm is grand openings, ball games, fairs, funerals fires and other typical small town happenings. I should add I have earned the respect of members police and fire first responders in the area. When I encounter a first responder that does not recognize me, I am treated with the same respect I show them. I most likely should have included earlier the environment I work in. I would imagine not totally typical. Therefore a disclaimer: What works for me here and now, may not do the same for you. Small town heartland America is not L.A, N.Y. or anything approaching the big city, things move a little slower here. And with a lot more respect for each other.

Not to be argumentative, but when you respond to a question by instructing strangers on how to make a press pass and how to act at an emergency response situation so you won't get tossed/arrested ... I find that a bit irresponsible. That being said ... had you prefaced all of this with the above ... I would have taken it all differently.

I've only worked for a wire service and two papers both of which are in the second largest marketplace in America and I have no personal experience working for a news organization in "small town heartland America". I have covered stories on four different continents and never have I encountered such a lax system as the one you stated. I am amazed that the State you work doesn't have a uniform credentialing system which is recognized statewide. Truly amazed.

That being said ... I am sorry if I offended you. Based upon your story you are providing a real service in a professional manner.

Gary

 

[jstuedle]

Not to be argumentative, but when you respond to a question by instructing strangers on how to make a press pass and how to act at an emergency response situation so you won't get tossed/arrested ... I find that a bit irresponsible. That being said ... had you prefaced all of this with the above ... I would have taken it all differently.

I've only worked for a wire service and two papers both of which are in the second largest marketplace in America and I have no personal experience working for a news organization in "small town heartland America". I have covered stories on four different continents and never have I encountered such a lax system as the one you stated. I am amazed that the State you work doesn't have a uniform credentialing system which is recognized statewide. Truly amazed.

That being said ... I am sorry if I offended you. Based upon your story you are providing a real service in a professional manner.

Gary

Thanks Gary,
Our State does have credentialing standards, they are lax and aren't enforced well around here as everyone knows everyone. If not by name, then by sight and past history. And yes, I should have advised in a more elaborate and professional manner when making my earlier post. I am afraid as our neighboring big city's population expands across the state line, our rules, laws and guidelines will become more stringent. By then I should be in the studio again and resume being a hermit. I think we could share a lot of old war stories, so to speak. I'm sure yours are much more impressive than mine.

 

[newrmdmike]

gryphonslair, as idealistic as it would be for the first ammendment to ring true its simply not. police to cater more to credential toting journalists more than blow joe taking pictures and getting in the way. secondly, EVEN in the us there are places requiring permits to shoot . . . and many more pieces of such legislation are in the works. they are mainly geared towards portrait photos, but can affect the average citizen taking photographs on the side of the road. i know plenty of people who have been wrongly arrested by the cops for photographing things the cops felt threatened by. Sorry, but as far as i can tell cops are responsible for violating tons of peoples first amendment rights.

----------

as for knowing people and having more access based on who you know i'll agree strongly. I've done ride alongs with fire depts and had access to crime scenes i didn't want access to. jumping in and saying heres my press pass is never as good as people skills(as far as i can see). BUT, when you show your credentials there is definite pressure placed on the officials to accommodate you for fear of negative publicity aimed towards them. . . but i can only see pulling that as a total last resort, if it doesn't work you've burned your bridge with that person.

 

[table1349]

gryphonslair, as idealistic as it would be for the first ammendment to ring true its simply not. police to cater more to credential toting journalists more than blow joe taking pictures and getting in the way. secondly, EVEN in the us there are places requiring permits to shoot . . . and many more pieces of such legislation are in the works. they are mainly geared towards portrait photos, but can affect the average citizen taking photographs on the side of the road. i know plenty of people who have been wrongly arrested by the cops for photographing things the cops felt threatened by. Sorry, but as far as i can tell cops are responsible for violating tons of peoples first amendment rights.

Maybe in your part of the world, but here all press credentials will get you is into the daily news briefing by the Chief's assistant. (Anyone can show up if they want to, but why? We tell the press what we want to release an no more.) At a crime scene it will not get you squat. We choose to talk to reports, releasing only the basic information we want to. We are not required by any law to do so, it is a courtesy that we provide. We understand that they have a job to do. But their job in no way provides them special privileges.

Ever wonder why shows like "Cops" no longer goes inside houses and buildings when law enforcement serves a search warrant or an arrest warrent like they did in the beginning. That is because the courts ruled that the people living or working there had an expectation to privacy. Several court cases were lost or severely damaged due to those actions and now It does not happen.

As for legislation, I have yet to see one that stops you from shooting on public land of a public area. Military bases are not public property. National parks are not public property. Government owned land does not make it public property. These are lands held in trust by the government for the protection of the land, use by the government or the protection of the people. As such they can and do make laws that restrict what you can and can not do on these lands.

While I can not disagree that officers do on occasion violate the rights of others, I can also state with a good degree of knowledge that most people truly do not know or understand what their constitutional rights are. That has become evident from teaching things like the Forth Amendment, Search and Seizure to public groups over the last few years.

 

[newrmdmike]

wow, thats a pretty idillic town . . . i didn't know cops shows were no longer allowed . . . so on a ride along i shouldn't be allowed to go onto private property?


public land . . . your right, one of the permits i was thinking of was for in national and state parks. (i still think its a jip though)

 

[Seefutlung]

gryphonslair, I will not argue with you as it would probably be pointless.

But to others reading this thread, gryphonslairis absolutely and totally wrong on most of his points. Just because his police department can get away with acting as if they are a gang of secert police unanswerable to anyone ... does not mean that such activity is appropriate in our society or right by law. Just be thanlfull you do not live in a community whose police department is administrated by those who share the same mentality as gryphonslair.

To paraphrase Thomas Jefferson ... I'd rather live in a country where there is a free press and no government, then in a country where there is a government and no free press.

Gary

 

[DeepSpring]

Let me just chime and say I had no intention of trying to make fake press passes to get me in to crime scenes and stuff like that. I would never interfere with the actions of the police of fire departments because I know how hard there job is and wouldn't want to try and get in the way of them.


I'm just a curious kid and like to know everything I can


I would think in some cases tho saying you are a freelance photographer, which wouldn't be a lie if you send the pictures off to people, would help gain access to certain community events or just be able to get closer to the out door stage or not be hassled about having a big camera or something like that.

 

[table1349]

wow, thats a pretty idillic town . . . i didn't know cops shows were no longer allowed . . . so on a ride along i shouldn't be allowed to go onto private property?

public land . . . your right, one of the permits i was thinking of was for in national and state parks. (i still think its a jip though)

Cop shows are allowed, COPS has done ride-a-longs on our department many a time. What they are not allowed to do is go un-invited onto private property, ie. into buildings, homes etc right along with the cops. Think about it, if there was a disturbance occurring in your residence would you expect or be happy if the media were to enter whether you wanted them to or not? Your do not give up your rights to privacy as a home owner or business just because the media is there.

As a ride-a-long citizen that can be a different matter as there is a lot of gray area that the court has not ruled upon. What some of the ride-a-long citizens do learn however is that they can go from becoming a ride-a-long citizen observer to being a witness. They can end up having to go to court and testify to what they saw and heard.

Here, we do not take ride-a-long citizen inside of private residences on most calls. Not until the situation is under control at least and then with the permission of the resident or business. Usually burglary, larceny scenes, that sort of thing. Never on disturbance, robberies, rapes, homicides etc. They wait at the vehicle. Again, the property owner/business has a right to privacy.

 

[Seefutlung]

Let me just chime and say I had no intention of trying to make fake press passes to get me in to crime scenes and stuff like that. I would never interfere with the actions of the police of fire departments because I know how hard there job is and wouldn't want to try and get in the way of them.


I'm just a curious kid and like to know everything I can


I would think in some cases tho saying you are a freelance photographer, which wouldn't be a lie if you send the pictures off to people, would help gain access to certain community events or just be able to get closer to the out door stage or not be hassled about having a big camera or something like that.

For community events, a simple phone call to the organizers saying you would like to photograph the event and afterwards share your photos with them would probably work more often than not.

 

[DeepSpring]

Here, we do not take ride-a-long citizen inside of private residences on most calls. Not until the situation is under control at least and then with the permission of the resident or business. Usually burglary, larceny scenes, that sort of thing. Never on disturbance, robberies, rapes, homicides etc. They wait at the vehicle. Again, the property owner/business has a right to privacy.

Sorry to stray off topic a bit but that is really interesting and sounds like it could be a great learning experience and just interesting to see how they work and everything. Can anyone do this? Would you just have to call the department and ask what their policies for ride-a-longs are? Is it the same process to get one with a fire department?

 

[table1349]

gryphonslair, I will not argue with you as it would probably be pointless.

But to others reading this thread, gryphonslairis absolutely and totally wrong on most of his points. Just because his police department can get away with acting as if they are a gang of secert police unanswerable to anyone ... does not mean that such activity is appropriate in our society or right by law. Just be thanlfull you do not live in a community whose police department is administrated by those who share the same mentality as gryphonslair.

To paraphrase Thomas Jefferson ... I'd rather live in a country where there is a free press and no government, then in a country where there is a government and no free press.

Gary

Oh please post your concerns - disagreements. I am interested in what you see as the rights of the press.