$400-500 Camera Suggestion?

binglemybongle · Dec 8, 2005

If you have questions about what mm lenses and film size etc. Do you need a particulary high spec camera to start with?

Get the cheapest (while keeping in mind any abuse it may have endured) and get used to the basics.

By that time you'll know enough to decide whether you want to get an advanced "whistles and bells" camera and youll also be able to decide whether you want to use film.

I agree with the ebay option. Buy from a member with a long history and a detailed description of the item. And i mean SPECIFIC!
Usually if a feature is missed out or briefly described (almost skipped over) then its an indicator that theres an issue with it.

Theres no point in confusing yourself from the beginning. Start simple. Save money for the next camera. Or lenses if you think youll stay with the same manufacturer.

Walk before you can run.

P.S. Choose film!!!!

I just got a superb condition Elan 7e with standard 28-90mm USM MKII zoom for £130 ($200???).

P.S.S. TPF is here for your every question. Ask any of us before you buy.

GrandMasterK · Dec 8, 2005

IMO, you should just get the cheapest camera available to you and just get out there and take some pictures, its people that take "good" pictures not cameras, by the time you realize you have a great eye and love photgraphy, you'll know what they're all talking about on the forum and if not, at least you'll know where to find the information yourself. Good luck, looking foreward to seeing your pics!:thumbup:

I've already been through that process with this couple year old canon I got. 38-85mm zoom lens, 85 zoom. I know how to take good shots and use lighting but the camera is crap.

its people that take "good" pictures not cameras

Then why do you spend so much money on your camera equipment?

So there's no way to do it while keeping all the pixels your camera is capable of, your photos have a fixed ratio? Ah well, i'll just manually do it in photoshop then.

Rob · Dec 8, 2005

The trouble GrandmasterK is having is one which almost every new to photography person has - making an expensive decision prior to knowing the basics. The expression 35mm refers to the size of film which goes in a normal SLR camera. It distinguishes 35mm film from medium format film and other films and is a shortcut term to refer to those little canisters which come in a pop-top plastic tube. All other mm references are about the measurements of the lens.

Bingle's advice is good in that a film SLR will be a cheap way to initially learn the huge benefits of manually adjusting your aperture, exposure and focus. Most peeps here would agree that small compact cameras whether digi or film are no use for learning the effect of the big three things (focus, aperture & exposure) as they have crappy autofocus with no manual override, poor lens aperture ranges, small annoying viewfinders, shutter lag and if like me you've got bloke hands they are fiddly and flimsy.

So I'd say that if you are to go with photography then you've got two startup options: film or digital.

Film is cheap, especially nowadays with loads of quality 35mm cameras from big brands available dead cheap. However if all your pictures are going to end up on the computer anyway it's a bit inefficient and each photo costs a small amount. There are great one hour labs around who will dev and CD your film for very little cost now, and there's no substitute for commercial prints when you are starting out.

Digital however will give you a greater shot rate, which is a bit of a double-edged sword as you get there perhaps more by luck than judgement.

Normal lenses go from about 20mm to 600mm. Lower than 20mm is generally fish-eye territory giving you distortion which can be good or bad depending on your postion. Higher than 600mm is not hand-holdable and is costly and not "normal" photography. So what do you need to know:

If you're taking pictures of the family, arty shots, scenic shots etc. then you want a standard lens which for film and digital is 50mm (based on a DSLR and a normal film SLR).

Zoom lenses are flexible, but they are trying to do more and you will lose light capturing ability as a result. Some zoom lenses, are not very good and have high f-numbers and cheap glass which result in a less than desirable picture taking ability. There are expensive zooms, but these are WAY out of your budget to start with. So, stick with a prime (fixed) lens, or just learn with the kit one and understand that it may not perform as well.

Avoid long zoom ranges (often seen with poor quality manufacturers) as they tend to be dreadful. There isn't a good 24-600mm lens out there and the day there is, that manufacturer has it made. Stick with small ranges like 24-70mm or 70-200mm or 200-400mm and get the lowest f-number you can afford.

Good luck!

Rob

GrandMasterK · Dec 8, 2005

If you want to shoot images in a different aspect ratio, you'll have to do the same thing you probably do now with your video editing and just change it post process. You can tape over your view finder (what you look through when you shoot) if you would like to have a guide or you can just guess when you're shooting. Digital SLRs shoot at a 3:2 ratio.

So there's no way to do it while keeping all the pixels your camera is capable of, your photos have a fixed ratio? Ah well, i'll just manually do it in photoshop then.

they will not let me edit my original post....

Rob · Dec 8, 2005

The word "crop" springs to mind!

Rob

GrandMasterK · Dec 8, 2005

Great post Rob!

Avoid long zoom ranges (often seen with poor quality manufacturers) as they tend to be dreadful. There isn't a good 24-600mm lens out there and the day there is, that manufacturer has it made. Stick with small ranges like 24-70mm or 70-200mm or 200-400mm and get the lowest f-number you can afford.

You started talking about fixed lenses, then zoom lenses. Just to be clear, the lens my camera comes with wont be able to zoom, i'll have to move closer or further away for desired image size? I noticed on that Canon link they have a accessories below it. Including battery pack and memory cards. Can I get some insight into that. I want to get enough memory and enough power to last me a whole day at disney land if not longer. Please tell me camera batteries arent like camcorder batteries where they only last 1-2 hours and your switchin them out everytime you turn around?

I've decided to stick with that DSLR Canon suggested earlier by the way. Now im trying to make sure I get what I need with it.

Rob · Dec 8, 2005

Not quite, the kit lens is a 18-55mm zoom, which costs you approximately $90 more than a "body only" from my quick calculations. It's only about $140 on it's own:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=351554&is=USA&addedTroughType=search

f3.5 to f5.6 is not very bright at all. I would recommend getting a 50mm f1.8 fixed (prime) instead as it's about four times brighter and also a fair bit sharper. This is a wide lens (low mm), so if you want to zoom in the future, you'll probably want something longer (i.e. more mm).

This is the one I recommend: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/con...ls&Q=&sku=12142&is=USA&addedTroughType=search

Does that help?

Rob

Rob · Dec 8, 2005

Oh and the batteries are supposed to be good for about four hundred pictures I believe (the folks here will know much better than me!). Obviously battery life is variable as flash will eat in and editing and viewing the pictures will shorten it as well.

The batteries aren't monster rip-off prices like say Sony's rechargeables for camcorders, I think they're about $50.

DocFrankenstein · Dec 8, 2005

GrandMasterK said:
I've already been through that process with this couple year old canon I got. 38-85mm zoom lens, 85 zoom. I know how to take good shots and use lighting but the camera is crap.

What camera is it?

hobbes28 · Dec 8, 2005

Rob said:
The word "crop" springs to mind!

Rob

You know...I thought that the second I left. It was too early for my mind to switch between video and photography that quickly. :lol:

GrandMasterK · Dec 8, 2005

I don't know DOC, can't find a model name on it.Ok...so, what two lenses should I get. That 50mm one and what else? How do I choose to have the body fo the camera only on that site?

GrandMasterK · Dec 8, 2005

well never mind, I missed that "lens not included thing". The Canon EOS Digital Rebel XT comes with a charger and a battery and a neck strap and a usb cable and video cable. Ok so here's what I was thinking of getting with that:

1 x Sandisk 1GB Ultra II CompactFlash
1 x Canon NB-2LH Lithium-Ion Battery
1 x Lowepro Holster Bag (unless someone suggests something better)
1 x Canon Normal EF 50mm f/1.8 II Autofocus Lens

So, what other lens should I get besides that 50mm?

DocFrankenstein · Dec 8, 2005

50mm is too long for general shooting. It's good if you wanna do a lot of portraits.

28/2.8 is a better general use lens

I'd be pretty happy if I only had the 28 and 50 as my lenses

GrandMasterK · Dec 9, 2005

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=12096&is=USA&addedTroughType=search

Alright, so this guy and this guy:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=12142&is=USA&addedTroughType=search

What am I gonna do during next tornado season when I need to zoom in like 10-20 times?

Also, are there any night time solutions with cameras? This thing doesn't come with a night vision ability right?

DocFrankenstein · Dec 9, 2005

GrandMasterK said:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=12096&is=USA&addedTroughType=search

Alright, so this guy and this guy:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=12142&is=USA&addedTroughType=search

Oh yeah! Very good choice.