60D O m g ...

[robbins.photo]

John, even if they do I'm even more confident at this point, like 99.9999999999999999% confident that any "liquid" damage will be from condensation and from what I can see Canon doesn't take responsibility for that so what leg do I have to stand on then?

What I meant was, if they did, then you can say to Henry's, "Prove it, show me the detector paper" but I don't know if they do or not.

The problem is, if they have them in there the condensation issue will trigger them and show liquid damage regardless of whether I did it or not so it is one for the bad guys if they are in there and are showing moisture

I'm thinking of making a thread asking people to take off their eye cups and open their screens and see what's under them, I'm positive that people that use them a lot will have junk unless they regularly clean their gear, perhaps some images of other people's cameras with the same configuration of junk in these areas would be a good thing....

Like I said, best bet is call the manager and simply ask him how anyone could possibly claim that circuits were damaged by moisture if the never even opened up the camera and have by their own admission never seen the circuits in question. Let him know you do plan on filling formal complaints with the proper agencies and that if they refuse to honor their warranty you will also be actively working online to make certain that people know that they should never do business with Henry's and on the off chance that they do they should never purchase a warranty because it will not be honored.

Basically this is time to be a squeaky wheel - because they do indeed get greased. The trick is to convince this guy that you are quite serious and that you will continue to harrass them and make their lives miserable until they fix your camera under warranty, but not to go so over the top that they dig their heels in and think they need to resist on principle. So polite, but firm - no name calling, keep saying things like "I realize this isn't your fault, however" - and ask lots and lots of uncomfortable questions. Stay on the phone with them as long as humanly possible, and if they still haven't resolved this before you need to hang up make sure to ask for his name at the end of the call and ask when he will be in tomorrow, so you can call him back and you can continue until a resolution can be reached.

Trust me, you make this his problem and it will get fixed.. lol.

 

[bribrius]

the thing is people do a lot of stupid things with their cameras, and the guy on the other end up the phone hears people try to pass of damage all the time and not admit stupid or down right reckless or damaging behavior.
so they assume from the beginning, like all the other calls, another person who damaged their camera being a idiot and is trying to pass it off. They deal with this kind of thing constantly.
Being earnest, and believable, straight forward and CALM (maybe even nice, reasonable) is usually the best way to handle some things. The people on the other end of the phones hear this all the time, threats, hangups. You are just another call.

 

[PixelRabbit]

Thanks Robbins, I'm trying to keep all communication in emails, I'm MUCH better when I have time to think about what to say and not be on the spot, I'm a TOTAL pushover in person, I know it and it's just better in email for my own communication.
As an added bonus I have all emails etc... to document what's going on.

I did email the manager at Henry's again specifically about this and how I don't agree with the assessment, I'll give him a chance to respond before I start squeaking louder, I am NOT going to let this slide but I have to stack the deck in my favour and keep it in writing at this point.

 

[robbins.photo]

Thanks Robbins, I'm trying to keep all communication in emails, I'm MUCH better when I have time to think about what to say and not be on the spot, I'm a TOTAL pushover in person, I know it and it's just better in email for my own communication.
As an added bonus I have all emails etc... to document what's going on.

I did email the manager at Henry's again specifically about this and how I don't agree with the assessment, I'll give him a chance to respond before I start squeaking louder, I am NOT going to let this slide but I have to stack the deck in my favour and keep it in writing at this point.

Well curious that you should mention it - I happen to have a lot of experience on both sides of this fence, both sending emails of this nature and responding to them - lol. Email is not quite as effective in many cases and takes longer, because a phone call is more time consuming and more difficult to deal with from there side, however it can still be accomplished via email, just takes a little more patience and perserverance.

So if I can be of any assistance let me know. Best place to start is to insist that it would be impossible for them to determine anything was damaged by moisture without opening the camera. Such a diagnosis is impossible, and that they are relying on an assumption based on the fact that a screw has developed some surface rust. That provides proof of nothing as far as the internal condition of the circuit boards which at this time have not been properly inspected or checked for damage. For al lthey know they might open up the camera and find it is nothing more than a solder joint between the battery housing and the circuit board that failed, and yet you know if that is what they find they will still charge you for this supposed "moisture damage" regardless.

So you will not accept a diagnosis of moisture damage, and that if they refuse to honor their warranty you will be filing formal complaints as well as making certain that this will be broadcast as widely and loudly as possible all over the interwebs. Not sure if Canada has something like the BBB but if so let them know that is something else you'll be doing, more or less find a list of any organization you can possibly file a complaint with and let them know a complaint will be filed unless they honor their warranty.

Your advantage here is that they jumped the gun - big time. They very stupidly insisted it was moisture damage and then admitted they hadn't even opened the camera so at this stage the will never be able to verify that to your satisfaction. Even if there are moisture markers inside the camera, so what - too much incentive for them to put a couple of drops of water on them now and claim they were right. That' s your advantage - press it. They will try everything not to answer this question, keep asking it. Every email. Every chance you get. Hammer them with it. Ask them over and over and over again, "How can you possibly say that circuits were damaged by liquid when you've told me yourselves you've never actually looked at the circuits themselves because you never opened the camera. I'm sorry but that simply makes no sense."

Like I said, still want to stay professional, and don't get personal - too much incentive for whoever your dealing with to get their back up and say no just to say no because you got personal. Instead still use phrases like, "I know this isn't your fault" or "I appreciate that your trying to help me" and then go right back into stating and restating your complaints.

 

[PixelRabbit]

Thanks Robbins, I sent you a PM.

 

[PixelRabbit]

SOME good news!!
I vented my frustrations a bit on FB last night, Peter from our local photo store Foto Art Camera & Frame Shop messaged me and offered me a loaner camera until mine comes back. He made me cry! Such a hard way to learn the value in dealing with local businesses, especially when you live away from city centers, they obviously go the extra mile. Huge kudos to Peter!!

 

[Steve5D]

SOME good news!!
I vented my frustrations a bit on FB last night, Peter from our local photo store Foto Art Camera & Frame Shop messaged me and offered me a loaner camera until mine comes back. He made me cry! Such a hard way to learn the value in dealing with local businesses, especially when you live away from city centers, they obviously go the extra mile. Huge kudos to Peter!!

Looks like you found your new camera shop!

 

[Steve5D]

At this point, I would no longer deal with the individual store. I would get my camera back, make sure I had the name of everyone I dealt with at the store, and then I would contact their corporate office.

The store has shown that they're inept at both customer and camera service...

 

[TCampbell]

Incidentally, the Canon 60D does have some degree of weather resist seals.

See: Canon EOS 60D Review

You'll need to scroll down a bit (about half-way down the long page) or just search for the words "weather sealing". You'll find a diagram that shows the location of all the seals, gaskets, o-rings, etc. This is one of the benefits of a mid-range camera over a Rebel series body is that they DO have a degree of weather-sealing in them.

As for moisture sensors... many companies have given up on them. Apple has them in their phones but employees are now instructed NOT to deny service based on evidence of water damage BECAUSE they know the sensors naturally turn red under normal use. Specific tests have been conducted (especially for those who live 4-season climates) where merely taking the gear (in this case, phones) from the cold and into the warmth a few times will cause enough condensation to trip the sensors but not enough condensation to actually result in damage to the product -- so they were getting a lot of false-positives and irate customers.

And one last thing... for your entertainment, I offer you the following:



This video isn't a 60D... it's a 7D. The 7D has just a bit more weather-sealing than the 60D, but check out what they do to this 7D. This camera is dropped, tumbled, soaked, frozen, shot at, melted, and burned... and it STILL WORKS!

I rather suspect your 60D did not fail due to water damage.

 

[casper_zip]

I too, am having problems with my Canon 60D. It will work in auto, but it will not focus in "P" and other modes. The batteries won't last till the water gets hot, either. I just put in two new ones and they won't last long either with a full charge. I am about ready to chunk it, I have some fine Nikons, and also my like new Canon 30D which is a much better camera so far. I am really about ready to set this baby aside. l have read, reread, and read some more and I can't take it any more. Got some books ordered, they should have already arrived, but no. Pixel Rabbit, sure hope you get your problems solved. Wish I could help. Thanks everyone for letting me vent.

Best,
casper_zip

 

[Braineack]

I think the problem is actually water damage in your case...

 

[W.Fovall]

looks like it was dropped in a swamp from the pictures.

 

[PixelRabbit]

I too, am having problems with my Canon 60D. It will work in auto, but it will not focus in "P" and other modes. The batteries won't last till the water gets hot, either. I just put in two new ones and they won't last long either with a full charge. I am about ready to chunk it, I have some fine Nikons, and also my like new Canon 30D which is a much better camera so far. I am really about ready to set this baby aside. l have read, reread, and read some more and I can't take it any more. Got some books ordered, they should have already arrived, but no. Pixel Rabbit, sure hope you get your problems solved. Wish I could help. Thanks everyone for letting me vent.

Best,
casper_zip

Casper, I'm sorry to hear about your camera I truly feel your pain! I'm also playing the waiting game on the mailman. Good luck with yours!

looks like it was dropped in a swamp from the pictures.

Wow, this makes me want to make that thread I mentioned asking people who use their gear daily to look under the eye cup and if they have it the screen, I'm willing to bet anyone who has had their gear for a good while and have shot that much with it, especially outside will have junk under those places unless they aren't the average consumer and cleans their gear religiously.

 

[PixelRabbit]

I want to take a minute today to thank each and every one of you that has posted and shared their thoughts, I truly appreciate your time. I would love to go back and address each of you individually but that's a LOT! (because you are awesome ) Rest assured that I read each and every word more than once, you guys have given me perspective and kept me from going TOTALLY bunny nuts.

 

[PixelRabbit]

Update:

Just got an email from Henry's, Sun opened my camera today and there is NO LIQUID DAMAGE INSIDE !!!!!
They don't know the source of the failure but as this point it has been approved under the warranty.