Bad Portrait Session

[fjrabon]

Oh, and since you asked, what settings do I use for portraits. Settings aren't as important as setup. For a session like this you want light that will consistently work. I usually just got with the tried and true method of two lights, into reflective umbrellas, about 5 feet in front of the player and centered about 4 feet apart. The lights can be speed lights, battery packed lights or full studio strobes. You should be able to make any of those work.

Next, do you have a big background or not? Here you had them in front of a wall I front of a hanging jersey (which is kind if ugly, but that's a whole different matter). You don't need to blur the background in this case, which makes your life MUCH EASIER. Shoot at f/8 and base ISO and then see what that forces your light power to be and then make finer adjustments with ISO and aperture from there.

The harder case is going to be if you're doing indoors, but with a background too. Then you have to do the balancing ambient and flash, both exposure and temperature wise. Which requires gels and dragging your shutter. And you'll need to figure what f/stop and focal length to get the background blur you want.

 

[brian_f2.8]

I agree, Im going to propose a re-shoot if parents do not like the portrait shots. I would not be happy but Im picky. Any good recommendations for a flash diffuser? Portraits are not my thing, Im more of a natural light n sports shooter. I was asked to do this so I figured why.

 

[fjrabon]

I think I am just going to re-do them. What f stop would you use? I used f5.6 because it was a good setting. These are just two of the images, I would like to share a folder with someone and get some feedback.

For portraits where blurring the background isn't important, you want f/8-11

 

[fjrabon]

I agree, Im going to propose a re-shoot if parents do not like the portrait shots. I would not be happy but Im picky. Any good recommendations for a flash diffuser? Portraits are not my thing, Im more of a natural light n sports shooter. I was asked to do this so I figured why.

I like reflective umbrellas for portraits of athletes in a setting like this.

 

[runnah]

I'd put them on the ice. Shoot 2.8 and lower to get a nice blurred BG of the arena. You could get away with a single hot shoe flash.

Honestly I would frame them just so you can see the team logo on the jersey and nothing more.
(I don't like the pose, but you can see what I am talking about)
http://www.zimbio.com/pictures/v422lcd2VQ1/2007+NHL+Headshots/VOlWqV47ObH/A.J.+Thelen

Also I would have them not wear pads, just a jersey. You have teenage girls with linebacker shoulders and it's not very flattering.

 

[fjrabon]

I'd put them on the ice. Shoot 2.8 and lower to get a nice blurred BG of the arena. You could get away with a single hot shoe flash.

Honestly I would frame them just so you can see the team logo on the jersey and nothing more.
(I don't like the pose, but you can see what I am talking about)
http://www.zimbio.com/pictures/v422lcd2VQ1/2007+NHL+Headshots/VOlWqV47ObH/A.J.+Thelen

Also I would have them not wear pads, just a jersey. You have teenage girls with linebacker shoulders and it's not very flattering.

From what it sounds like though, his lights are either continuous or high powered strobes that can only fire 1/4 power. Shooting a mixed ambient and flash portrait at f/2.8 is going to require strobes that can go very low power wise. F/2.8, even at base ISO, will be completely blown out with high powered strobes at 1/4 power.

Though I suppose its possible OP has more gear than this. OP, what is your current, full gear situation? Lighting wise.

I love the mixed ambient and strobe look for these sorts of photos, but you have to have a lot of control over your lights and you have to be CAREFUL because its super easy to miss focus at f/2.8. ESPECIALLY of you're shooting in a darkly lit arena without modeling lights to help the camera find focus.

You'll also need gels if you do the ambient lit background with flashed subjects look, because its bear certain that the arena lights will be warmer than your flash, meaning you'd get yellow ice or blue hockey players.

 

[tirediron]

OP: I am sorry, but you did not have bad luck, you undertook a commission for which you did not have the skill and/or resources to discharge properly. The "problems" here are very basic ones which could have been overcome with two speedlights. A reshoot is definitely in order, no ifs ands, or buts!

 

[runnah]

I'd put them on the ice. Shoot 2.8 and lower to get a nice blurred BG of the arena. You could get away with a single hot shoe flash.

Honestly I would frame them just so you can see the team logo on the jersey and nothing more.
(I don't like the pose, but you can see what I am talking about)
http://www.zimbio.com/pictures/v422lcd2VQ1/2007+NHL+Headshots/VOlWqV47ObH/A.J.+Thelen

Also I would have them not wear pads, just a jersey. You have teenage girls with linebacker shoulders and it's not very flattering.

From what it sounds like though, his lights are either continuous or high powered strobes that can only fire 1/4 power. Shooting a mixed ambient and flash portrait at f/2.8 is going to require strobes that can go very low power wise. F/2.8, even at base ISO, will be completely blown out with high powered strobes at 1/4 power.

Though I suppose its possible OP has more gear than this. OP, what is your current, full gear situation? Lighting wise.

I love the mixed ambient and strobe look for these sorts of photos, but you have to have a lot of control over your lights and you have to be CAREFUL because its super easy to miss focus at f/2.8. ESPECIALLY of you're shooting in a darkly lit arena without modeling lights to help the camera find focus.

You'll also need gels if you do the ambient lit background with flashed subjects look, because its bear certain that the arena lights will be warmer than your flash, meaning you'd get yellow ice or blue hockey players.

Honestly I would turn off the ice light (bright ass halogens) and leave the seating lights on. You'd have very low ambient lighting and could really have dramatic lighting with a single flash and maybe a single light source for fill.

http://blog.zjbphotography.com/2009/10/brebeuf-jesuit-hockey-portraits-2009.html

Good example of what I am talking about.

Even better because the photographer posted his flash setup.

http://rickdenham.com/blog/brock-womens-hockey-portraits/


Again not sure if the OP has the gear for these.

 

[Designer]

brian_f2.8; Not commenting on the lighting, but the poses are to kill for. You, that is.

Who chose the poses and background? Does not work.

When you are able to reschedule:

1. Send reminders to everybody.
2. Make no assumptions regarding existing lighting.
3. Find a better background.
4. Have the players pose standing, not sitting.
5. Watch for shadows on people's faces.

 

[Xavieous]

Runnah, that is an awesome link! I enjoyed that, thank you. I always love when people post exactly how they do something. Never fail to learn something new.

 

[brian_f2.8]

Well I love being attacked and educated at the same time.

My gear is
Nikon D7000, 50mm , sb-900 and a vivitar 383. The continous lights were quartz smith vector lights. They are very bright and warm. I turned down the power on the strobes because everything was blown out.

I admit this is not my style of work so I was lost and also on a time crunch. I could have done on ice. Looking at the posing is fine for me. Don't argue because Im happy with it, its what I wanted.

I agree that the blur can't be fixed and this will require a re-shoot.

 

[fjrabon]

one more thing, DO NOT SHOW THESE PHOTOS TO THE PARENTS. I think you said something about 'reschedule if they don't like them'. No, just no. Reschedule, no matter what it takes, unless you just don't care about ever being hired professionally again, reschedule. If you send these to parents, you will be receiving threatening emails and calls from parents. Those parents will tell every person they've ever known that you are highly unprofessional, unreliable, and they may make up rumors about you being convicted of minor felonies.

Looking at my phone this morning, they looked bad. Pulling them up on my calibrated laptop full res screen. Eeeek. They're awful. Wish I could be nicer about it, but yeah, this is what awful looks like when it comes to paid team portraits. Most parents could take better shots with a popup flash on a beginner dSLR with a kit lens on full program mode. In fact I can near guarantee that you'd have been better off with a popup flash in full green auto than what came out here.

The poses are terrible, the background is terrible, the lighting is terrible, the shadows are terrible, the sharpness is terrible, the color is terrible, I can't even tell if they're out of focus, because they're too blurred from camera shake.

Even if the other photos are twice as good as these, they're still not something that a client SHOULD EVER see.

I know all that sounded really harsh, but you've been making comments like 'maybe these aren't really that bad, and I'm just really picky.' I can tell you that if one of our shooters came back from a shoot with these images, they'd never be put back on the schedule. You have to know that these aren't photos that you can charge people for, or if you value your reputation as a photographer, even give them for free.

The team shot is bad, but it's only bad and not awful like the portraits, and could MAYBE work if you absolutely can't agree to get all the girls back for another shot if you print it out at a low printing resolution on a forgiving paper.

edit: and YOU aren't being attacked. We are just pointing out the objective fact that these are really, really, really bad. It's just about the pictures man. Don't take it personal and learn from it.

 

[tirediron]

one more thing, DO NOT SHOW THESE PHOTOS TO THE PARENTS. I think you said something about 'reschedule if they don't like them'. No, just no. Reschedule, no matter what it takes, ...

Okay, while I think fjarbon was more than a bit over-zealous in his condemnation, he brings up an excellent point. Simply tell the people that there was an issue with some of the photographs and to ensure that everyone gets the best possible product, you would like to reshoot the entire job. I would also suggest perhaps a sweetener; an extra print, file, or future credit. I would also suggest consulting some of our more skilled sports photographers for assistance.

 

[tirediron]

OP: In addition to everything else that has been posted here, I would like to say 'Well done' to you for posting these here and seeking assistance. Yes, the commentary has been harsh, but there's also been a lot of excellent information provided. Everyone's had at least one shoot go south on them, so take this as a learning experience, develop a plan to improve and for take two, knock 'em dead!

 

[runnah]

Okay, while I think fjarbon was more than a bit over-zealous in his condemnation

I don't, truth hurts. These photos should be in the beginner's forum, not the professional gallery. It makes my soul weep to think that the OP would even CONSIDER charging for these.

We are saving him for a throng of angry hockey moms.