Camera for class?

[ksmattfish]

So the Nikon N75 and 80 dont have a remote shutter release?

Whats a reasonably priced one with that option?

The N-80 definately has those features. I don't know enough about the N-75. I just know that Nikon left them off the N-60 and a few other entry level SLRs, and there was a guy on here a few months ago griping that his Sigma SLR didn't have them either.

 

[ksmattfish]

Get a Ricoh KR-5 w/50mm lens off ebay for $30, and spend the rest of the money on film and processing. I know that new, high tech gear is fun, but you'll get a lot more learning out of $400 worth film and processing than $400 worth of high tech gizmos. Just my luddite nature shining through.

 

[Rob]

So the N75 or N80 wont make it through a semester of shooting?

That's a tricky question to answer as it does depend on your care for the camera. It is a modern electronic camera, and as such is much more susceptible to damage especially from shock or moisture. If your school is anything like mine, and if you're trying to do some work in the pub, you're going to have to be very careful. With a fully-manual camera, you have much more chance of surviving a beer, G&T, rain or accidental drop on the floor.

It's more susceptible because it has a lot of features - these are mainly things which you will not need (or want?) for learning photography. Camera manufacturers increasingly push new technology and try to out do each other on numbers. Examples might include the number of auto-focus points or the sophistication of the auto-focus. These are not things you will be tested on.

As a student, I am going to bet that you will require strong control, rather than advanced features. As mentioned above, to demonstrate motion blur or to freeze motion, you will want to out-think the camera's brain and deliberately create an effect which a consumer would percieve as undesirable. This is especially true of pictures which need "abnormal" exposure speed - whether fast or slow; or pictures which need "abnormal" depth-of-field or focus. All three of these photographic factors are probably going to be a part of your assignments and will not be easily created with the camera in Auto or Program mode.

Imagine a theoretical assignment: "Capture the hurried nature of rush-hour at a major railway station". To do this, you might wish to have a scene of people blurred and rushing for their train's departure gate. The way to capture this image is to call the station, ask permission to use a tripod for your assignment. Then load a low-ISO number film e.g. 50 or 100 and set the aperture a high number such as 22 to lengthen the exposure. Use a cable or remote release if you need to, and then capture a few shots. An automatic camera body such as the Nikon F 55/65/75/85 etc. is overkill and may be tricky to set to manual and get the control needed. However, an old camera from the 1950/60/70's will do a good job and you'll probably even be able to use Auto-Exposure and avoid a light-meter.

Hope this is helpful.

It's Friday btw, and the pub is calling.

Rob

 

[walter23]

These things aren't as breakable as people make them out to be. I have a canon elan 7n (the canon equivalent of the nikon F80 or N80) and it's pretty solid. Don't listen to these old codgers with their ancient metal cameras (Hey, I have a couple too - a 1945 rolleiflex, still working!). Granted, an F75 isn't going to last as long as some of the stuff in ksmattfish's collection of 100 year old folding monstrosities, but it'll do for your photography class and a good many years of hobbiest photography afterwards.

I would seriously look at the canon elan 7n though, it's a fantastic camera in my opinion. And currently canon has a better digital SLR lineup which means you can upgrade more happily and keep using your existing lens(es). Of course this could change, but right now canon's got the edge.

My recommendations for automatic cameras: Nikon F80 or Canon Elan 7n (these have cable releases, film ISO selection, and straightforward manual operation with full control).

If you can't afford these, the F75 (N75 in USA) or Rebel T2 are decent options. You can get an infrared remote control that works like the cable-release people are talking about for those models, which is almost an advantage because you don't have to touch anything connected to the camera to trigger the shutter this way.

If you want to go old-school and get a fully manual camera, my votes go for Canon A-1 (or "AE-1 Program"), Pentax K1000, or Nikon FM2n or Nikon FE-2.


To summarize:

Autofocus: Nikon F80 (N80) or canon elan 7n (fully manual, modern).
Manual focus: Canon A-1 or AE-1 Program, Nikon FM2n, Nikon FE-2, Pentax K1000 (may use obsolete lenses, but less expensive and simple).

I would check "www.keh.com" for used camera bodies, these guys are pretty reputable and have a reputation for "underrating" their equpiment (ie, something they call "Excellent minus" is what others would call "Like new").

 

[walter23]

BTW, last summer I was making the same decision you are... and the canon elan 7n was my choice. Here's a photo of the beast with a manual focus lens attached to tempt you:

 

[Ihaveaquestion]

Yes!, that Canon Elan 7N's Sexy..,

I realy wanted to upgrade to a 20D anyway..

Awesome...

Thanks walter.

 

[walter23]

Yes!, that Canon Elan 7N's Sexy..,

I realy wanted to upgrade to a 20D anyway..

Awesome...

Thanks walter.

You won't regret it, I promise. It does everything you could possibly want in a film camera and is perfectly suitable for a photography course. (I know a girl who took photojournalism and bought the elan 7, the model just before it). It's only a matter of being able to afford it ($250 or so from keh.com, a bit more new).

For lenses, the 50mm f/1.8 II (or the older version I) is cheap and fantastic. $100 will get you some of the best opticaly quality Canon makes. Also for a more versatile zoom the 28-105mm f/3.5-4.5 USM II is very nice.

 

[photogoddess]

So the N75 or N80 wont make it through a semester of shooting?

No idea about the N75 but the N80 is a really nice camera. My 16 year old son has one that he bought used from MDowdey and my boyfriend Malachite (here on this site) also has one. If you have larger hands and can afford it, I recommend getting the battery grip. It improves the balance of the camera (although it was good already) and makes it so that you can use standard AA batteries in it. I like camera so much that I've actually contemplated switching to Nikon so everyone in the house can use the same lenses. I'm just not ready to give up my Canon stuff yet though. Just my 2 cents...

 

[usayit]

All camera's listed will work just fine. Just don't forget cost, comfort, and personal preference! Go to a camera shop that has old and new, hold them, and see which you like.

Of all listed, I'm in the camp that says get a good manual classic. Simple in design, no complexities to get in the way, bomb proof, and very very affordable. I absolutely love the simplicity of the meter on K1000 and Spotmatics. Adjust aperature/shutter until the needle is the middle.... need a little +/- exposure.. just match the needle a little above or below center. that simple. Both bodies are compact in design which is a plus for those on the go.

Cost... now thats the beauty... just try and find a 50mm f1.4 lens in Canon or Nikon's current autofocus line for under 70 bucks? Just search ebay for used K-mount leses ( K1000 ) or used M42 screw muunts ( Spotmatics ).. you'll find all that you need or ever want.

 

[Mad_Gnome]

I've got a classic old film SLR to begin with, myself. I'm using a Minolta X700. It's got some plastic in the body, but it's a tough old brick, for sure, and takes fabulous pictures (when used properly). I've also basically got the pick of the litter for lenses, because any kind of lens I want is available for pennies on the dollar on eBay. I've currently got two 50mm f/2 lenses (the best learning tool is a good, fast 50mm standard lens) one Star-D 28mm f/2.8 lens, one TeleSor 28-70mm f/3.5-4.5 lens (kind of crappy, but a good all-around beater) one Vivitar Series 1 28-90mm f/2.8-3.5 lens (FABULOUS piece of glass...it's bright, fast, light and quick focusing. EXTREMELY high-quality optics) and one Tamron Adaptall 70-350mm f/4.5 telephoto zoom (heavy, but very sturdy and also EXTREMELY high-quality optics). For the first two months that I had it, I left one of the 50mm lenses on it continuously. Just keep in mind, a fancy camera won't help you take better pictures, and a good photographer with a crappy camera will outshoot a hack with a multi-thousand dollar rig any day. That's my opinion, I welcome yours! :mrgreen:

~Adam

 

[Ihaveaquestion]

Whats the difference between the Canon elan 7N and the 7NE?

 

[santino]

classic manual film SLR would be perfect, IMO.

 

[Rob]

These things aren't as breakable as people make them out to be. I have a canon elan 7n (the canon equivalent of the nikon F80 or N80) and it's pretty solid. Don't listen to these old codgers with their ancient metal cameras

Oh yes they are. Pah - I could break an Elan 7n with my little finger.

All you need is a light-proof box with reliable shutter action, a good bit of glass and a light meter of some kind. Why use something made of plastic with loads of electronics in it just for the sake of your fashion image?

When you're learning fundamentals, you will be best placed to achieve success with something fundamental, not something complicated.

The purists will win. There is no digital revolution. Bah.

R

 

[mrsid99]

Oh yes they are. Pah - I could break an Elan 7n with my little finger.

Just remember it's a camera and not a brick!

All you need is a light-proof box with reliable shutter action, a good bit of glass and a light meter of some kind. Why use something made of plastic with loads of electronics in it just for the sake of your fashion image?

Because you may get to like photography and want a camera that has the features you'd have to buy later.

When you're learning fundamentals, you will be best placed to achieve success with something fundamental, not something complicated.

Agreed, but there's nothing wrong with having the features available.

The purists will win. There is no digital revolution. Bah.

R

The difference between the "N" and the "NE" is that the NE has an eye tracking feature for the auto-focus.
It looks at your eyeball in the viewfinder and focuses on where you look.

 

[Ihaveaquestion]

The difference between the "N" and the "NE" is that the NE has an eye tracking feature for the auto-focus.
It looks at your eyeball in the viewfinder and focuses on where you look.

Thats crazy!

Is that a function you can switch on and off?