DX and FX Lenses

[480sparky]

... ah, this topic reminds me of The Circle of Confusion.
Something you needed to know when using Large Format film.
You had to know what lenses were able to provide the coverage of the film size you were using.

I've always called it the Image Circle.

Circle of Confusion has to do with focus and DOF.

Hmm, I have these faint memories that our Prof's use the CoC term ... you are probably right (after reading some stuff online) that Image Circle is the correct one ... after 30yrs my brain's circle of confusion gets bigger.

Welcome to the old foggies club.

Old fogies.

Or old farts.

Funny, I remember my uncle joking to my father like that.
And now I'm there.

Speak up, sonny! I can't hear you!

And get off my lawn!

 

[Designer]

But will the image they produce be as good as a DX Lens on a DX Camera, or will the same lens on the FX Body produce an image inferior to the DX Lens on the DX body?

The image quality of any particular lens is not dictated by only the DX/FX designation.

In studying about lenses, you will find that most of the really good ones do happen to be FX, but that by itself does not make it good. It mostly has to with the individual design, and manufacturing expertise. Learn to discriminate on the basis of other attributes rather than whether a lens is DX or FX.

 

[EJA64]

But will the image they produce be as good as a DX Lens on a DX Camera, or will the same lens on the FX Body produce an image inferior to the DX Lens on the DX body?

To some degree, most DX lenses, and the images they produce anywhere / on any camera will be somewhat inferior to the images from an FX lens. Nikon sees DX lenses as Amateur / Hobbyist fare, and FX lenses as being more Serious Amateur / Enthusiast / Professional fare. So, FX lenses tend to have better lens elements, better coatings, etc, and so produce better images. DX lenses can produce some very good images, but FX lenses are apt to produce better images. On an FX sensor, the DX lens will produce a smaller than sensor sized image. What image is there will be as good as the DX image on a DX sensor, but there will be what amounts to a lot of vignetting, in effect. When possible, try to get FX lenses, for use on both DX, and FX, cameras. Buy Used / Factory Refurbished, to cut cost. If you are more than a snapshooter-enough to care about how your images look-use Full Frame lenses...even if you can now only afford a Crop Frame camera. I have one FF lens which cost me $29.00, and another which cost me $79.00. Next month I will buy one which costs $399.00. You don't need to spend $800.00+ to get good FF lenses....if you shop around, buy Used / Factory Refurbished, or buy from an Enthusiast, or Professional, who is getting rid of some older items to clear storage space, or get money to buy something newer.

 

[480sparky]

........ Nikon sees DX lenses as Amateur / Hobbyist fare, and FX lenses as being more Serious Amateur / Enthusiast / Professional fare...........

So when did you work in Nikons' marketing department?

 

[EJA64]

But will the image they produce be as good as a DX Lens on a DX Camera, or will the same lens on the FX Body produce an image inferior to the DX Lens on the DX body?

To some degree, most DX lenses, and the images they produce anywhere / on any camera will be somewhat inferior to the images from an FX lens. Nikon sees DX lenses as Amateur / Hobbyist fare, and FX lenses as being more Serious Amateur / Enthusiast / Professional fare. So, FX lenses tend to have better lens elements, better coatings, etc, and so produce better images. DX lenses can produce some very good images, but FX lenses are apt to produce better images. On an FX sensor, the DX lens will produce a smaller than sensor sized image. What image is there will be as good as the DX image on a DX sensor, but there will be what amounts to a lot of vignetting, in effect. When possible, try to get FX lenses, for use on both DX, and FX, cameras. Buy Used / Factory Refurbished, to cut cost. If you are more than a snapshooter-enough to care about how your images look-use Full Frame lenses...even if you can now only afford a Crop Frame camera. I have one FF lens which cost me $29.00, and another which cost me $79.00. Next month I will buy one which costs $399.00. You don't need to spend $800.00+ to get good FF lenses....if you shop around, buy Used / Factory Refurbished, or buy from an Enthusiast, or Professional, who is getting rid of some older items to clear storage space, or get money to buy something newer.

 

[EJA64]

Aspherical lenses, Nano Crystal Coating, more aperture blades (7 rather than 6, 9 instead of 7, etc), wider apertures (smaller f numbers), Extra Low Dispersion Glass, Internal Focusing, Rear Focusing, Super Integrated Coating, and other factors give some idea of whether a lens is suitable. Once those are taken into account, research online, etc., and see what else you can learn. Watch Youtube videos to see how sharp the images from a particular lens are, how much distortion they produce, etc. Check posts on photo forums, to see how owners like, or dislike, a particular item. If possible, borrow a lens from a friend, or rent it from a shop, and try it out. Find out what the Pro photographers are using. Realize that Pro lenses will cost more than, and usually be somehow better than, amateur lenses. Shop around. A dead Pro's family may sell off his gear at bargain prices. Canon users may sell their Canon gear, to get Nikon gear, Nikon users may dump their gear to get into Sony, etc. You can find great gear at good prices, if you try.

 

[ac12]

There are a few GOOD DX lenses, and they are priced accordingly, about $1,000 and up: 17-50/2.8 and 16-85/2-4.
I have held off getting any of them, because buying a lens that expensive would anchor me into the- DX system.
Right now I still have the option of going FF/FX.
My last 2 lenses were FX lenses 70-200/4 and 50/1.8.

 

[floridafan]

But will the image they produce be as good as a DX Lens on a DX Camera, or will the same lens on the FX Body produce an image inferior to the DX Lens on the DX body?

yes and no.
There are 2 things when you use a DX lens on a FX body.

• You use the center of the FX sensor, so a D850 with a 46MP FX sensor will produce a 19MP image in DX mode. Thus you will have less resolution than a 24MP DX camera (D7200).
• However, the FX pixel size is larger than the DX pixel size, giving it the ability to capture more photons of light, and giving more dynamic range (DR). So even with less MP, you have more DR to the image.

So which of the two gives you a better image, resolution or dynamic range?
It depends on the scene and lighting conditions.

The other things is, there are some FX lenses for which there is NO DX equivalent lens.

• The one that I think of is the FX 70-200/2.8. NO ONE makes a DX equivalent lens. The closest is the discontinued Sigma 50-150/2.8.
• DX lenses are mostly slow zooms. You have to go to Sigma for fast DX zooms.
  
• Nikon does not make a wide DX prime lens equivalent to the FX 35mm. You would have to use a FX 24mm lens on the DX camera.

IMHO, if you are going to get a FX camera, use FX lenses on it, to take full advantage of the larger sensor.
If you are going to use DX lenses on a FX camers, why bother going to FX?
The D850 has a 46MP sensor, but in DX mode it is only a 19MP sensor (per Nikon D850 web page). That is throwing away a LOT of resolution.

And switching between lens types could/will lead to confusion. Example the 18-140 will give you the angle of view of a 28-210 on a FX camera in DX mode. But the FX 80-200 will be an 80-200.

The other thing is, if you are going to get a D850, you will probably want to upgrade your glass to match the resolution of the camera anyway. A DX super zoom is not of an optical quality that makes good use of the 46MP sensor on the D850.

 

[floridafan]

But will the image they produce be as good as a DX Lens on a DX Camera, or will the same lens on the FX Body produce an image inferior to the DX Lens on the DX body?

yes and no.
There are 2 things when you use a DX lens on a FX body.

• You use the center of the FX sensor, so a D850 with a 46MP FX sensor will produce a 19MP image in DX mode. Thus you will have less resolution than a 24MP DX camera (D7200).
• However, the FX pixel size is larger than the DX pixel size, giving it the ability to capture more photons of light, and giving more dynamic range (DR). So even with less MP, you have more DR to the image.

So which of the two gives you a better image, resolution or dynamic range?
It depends on the scene and lighting conditions.

The other things is, there are some FX lenses for which there is NO DX equivalent lens.

• The one that I think of is the FX 70-200/2.8. NO ONE makes a DX equivalent lens. The closest is the discontinued Sigma 50-150/2.8.
• DX lenses are mostly slow zooms. You have to go to Sigma for fast DX zooms.
  
• Nikon does not make a wide DX prime lens equivalent to the FX 35mm. You would have to use a FX 24mm lens on the DX camera.

IMHO, if you are going to get a FX camera, use FX lenses on it, to take full advantage of the larger sensor.
If you are going to use DX lenses on a FX camers, why bother going to FX?
The D850 has a 46MP sensor, but in DX mode it is only a 19MP sensor (per Nikon D850 web page). That is throwing away a LOT of resolution.

And switching between lens types could/will lead to confusion. Example the 18-140 will give you the angle of view of a 28-210 on a FX camera in DX mode. But the FX 80-200 will be an 80-200.

The other thing is, if you are going to get a D850, you will probably want to upgrade your glass to match the resolution of the camera anyway. A DX super zoom is not of an optical quality that makes good use of the 46MP sensor on the D850.

The plan is not to purchase additional DX Lenses if we go with an FX Body (D850), but will the existing lenses we own work with the new body. All newly purchased Lenses will be FX. I put a list of my current Lenses in the original post. I have added the FX 135mm with Bokah control since I first posted. We are leaning toward the D850.

 

[Designer]

.. will the existing lenses we own work with the new body.

Yes. The camera will adjust for the DX lenses.

 

[CraigW0LV]

But will the image they produce be as good as a DX Lens on a DX Camera, or will the same lens on the FX Body produce an image inferior to the DX Lens on the DX body?

Typically FX lenses are built better than DX lenses, so you should get a better image with the FX/Pro lens than the DX lens no matter the camera.

 

[ac12]

But will the image they produce be as good as a DX Lens on a DX Camera, or will the same lens on the FX Body produce an image inferior to the DX Lens on the DX body?

Typically FX lenses are built better than DX lenses, so you should get a better image with the FX/Pro lens than the DX lens no matter the camera.

Not all FX lenses are pro grade lenses.
There are consumer grade FX lenses, which are similar to many of the DX lenses.

 

[EJA64]

........ Nikon sees DX lenses as Amateur / Hobbyist fare, and FX lenses as being more Serious Amateur / Enthusiast / Professional fare...........

So when did you work in Nikons' marketing department?

Never. I observe what they do, and how they do it, and talk to insiders

 

[astroNikon]

Don't most DX Lenses work on a FX Camera?
This is what we own now:
AF-S 18-200
AF-S 80-400
AF Micro 105
AF 35-70
AF 80-200
AF 18-140
Sigma 170-500
AF 50

I plan to purchase:
AF 135 f2.0
AF 14-24 f2.8

I am either getting a D850 or D500

Is it me or are all of your lenses mostly older FX anyways?
The AF ones, 35-70 (is this the 35-70/2.8 or variable aperture version AF/AF-D), 80-200 (is this the 80-200/2.8 AF/AF-D) are screw drive FX lenses as are others.

Can you elaborate on the make and model of each lens you have?

 

[480sparky]

........ Nikon sees DX lenses as Amateur / Hobbyist fare, and FX lenses as being more Serious Amateur / Enthusiast / Professional fare...........

So when did you work in Nikons' marketing department?

Never. I observe what they do, and how they do it, and talk to insiders

So what do your insiders say about Nikon producing pro-grade DX bodies, but not pro-grade DX glass? Are they expecting pros to buy DX bodies and pop FX glass on 'em?