Help Choosing a Computer

Thanks for all your help. I've learned some valuable information from these posts. Now all I have to do is pull the trigger. I got my bonus check today :)
 
Ok, so my computer just bit the dirt. Now I get to conversate with everyone via iPhone. What are some brands you would reccomend? As stated, we currently have gateway but sometimes I hear bad things about gateway. Is HP any better? I know I already provided a compare link but here is another link where I added a couple different computers. I'm going to have to make a purchase next week. Thanks for yalls continuing help.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage...8119486226*1218150609828*1218130488734&catId=
 
Refurb is great to get a good price on disposable type products, but I'd be extremely wary of buying a refurb PC. All except the highest end consumer parts like motherboards and graphics cards use cheap capacitors that aren't known for their longevity in all cases, not to mention the increased odds of hard drive failure. That being said, ASUS is a brand I'd recommend over most others.

Have you thought about some of the smaller boutique brands like CyberPower? It's a gaming PC company, but they make some pretty powerful cheap rigs like this one. The price is a little higher than the ones you posted, but it's a small company that does quality work. It has less RAM but a much better video card, so the trade off is still a bit in your favor, and RAM is easily upgraded.

As far as the configuration options there, just pick a case you like, and if you can swing it, I'd upgrade the CPU to one of the Core i5's, and the RAM to 8GB (the ram upgrade seems too pricey, though)

That ASUS does have a really pretty case, though...
 
Think of a computer being somewhat akin to being a racy automobile or military aircraft. Both are designed around the engine, with an idea of the performance specs needed.

If you really want something that will endure, buy components individually and build your own (or have it built). This is especially true for computers since almost everything off the shelf is made to power your computer with only some basic upgrades. Working with photos, no big deal. Adding Crossfire or SLI dual-video cards means $150-$250 power supply.

My current power supply is rated 485W while I'm running an Asus EN9600GTO with only 384MB of DDR3. Yet it supports my monitor's highest setting of 1600 x 1050 in 32-bit colour. Only using 1Gb of DDR2 RAM on the main board, but I can run multiple tabs of Firefox, Yahoo IM, IRC chat, have media player open, volume control panel open, etc. It runs Gimp fine, but some of the filters you apply will take some time to process because of the sheer amount of computations needed. I have dual core 1.8Ghz CPU, so it's better than it was.

Buy a top-notch PSU and you'll get a decade or two out of it... as long as you have your surge protection in place. :) The PSU can be migratated to bigger and better boards, video cards, drives, devices, etc. You just need to know the standards for the future cases or main-boards/video-cards.
 
RancerDS said:
Think of a computer being somewhat akin to being a racy automobile or military aircraft. Both are designed around the engine, with an idea of the performance specs needed.

If you really want something that will endure, buy components individually and build your own (or have it built). This is especially true for computers since almost everything off the shelf is made to power your computer with only some basic upgrades. Working with photos, no big deal. Adding Crossfire or SLI dual-video cards means $150-$250 power supply.

My current power supply is rated 485W while I'm running an Asus EN9600GTO with only 384MB of DDR3. Yet it supports my monitor's highest setting of 1600 x 1050 in 32-bit colour. Only using 1Gb of DDR2 RAM on the main board, but I can run multiple tabs of Firefox, Yahoo IM, IRC chat, have media player open, volume control panel open, etc. It runs Gimp fine, but some of the filters you apply will take some time to process because of the sheer amount of computations needed. I have dual core 1.8Ghz CPU, so it's better than it was.

Buy a top-notch PSU and you'll get a decade or two out of it... as long as you have your surge protection in place. :) The PSU can be migratated to bigger and better boards, video cards, drives, devices, etc. You just need to know the standards for the future cases or main-boards/video-cards.
Click to expand...

First of all, I don't really understand why you posted this. The OP asked about prebuilt computer systems for ~$600, and you recommend buying a power supply (without a computer) for 1/4 of that budget.

Second, I have an SLI system with an SLI certified power supply from a quality manufacturer. It cost me $50 on sale, $75 every day price.

Third, so you have an aging computer that can run a browser and the GIMP. Congrats, I have a netbook that can do the same, but it doesn't mean that that's what you should go out and buy for your shiny new desktop. (For the record, I've never had a dedicated video card since the 90's that couldn't push 1600x1200 for typical word processor/OS usage)

A dual core 1.8GHz processor doesn't tell us much. I had a 3.0GHz Pentium D Dual-core that was significantly slower than the 2.3GHz Core 2 Duo I picked up to replace it. Clock speed only matters when comparing apples to apples, not mystery meat to umbrellas. A pentium D was just 2 pentium 4 processor die's slapped atop one another, while the Core line and then the Core 2 line, and then the i line used completely new manufacturing processes and new architectures to allow for faster real world performance with less power usage.

Lastly, and really the only reason I replied: 1 or 2 decades from a power supply? Just 1 decade ago, the average computer was an AMD K6/2 or a Pentium III. Since then, the Pentium 4 came out, adding a 4 pin ATX12V connector to the power supply. Then the Core line came out, changing the 20-Pin ATX connector to a 24-Pin connector. SATA started gaining ground in the early/mid 2000's, and used a new type of power connector from the old molex ones on IDE drives. Then, nVIDIA announced SLI in the mid 2000's, which required the 4-pin connector to now be an 8-pin connector. Then came PCI-e based video cards, which required a special 6-pin power connector for the card. (Some newer cards require more than 1 of these connectors, or an 8-pin.) All the while, a system's power requirements went from ~300W for a beefy PC to ~700W+.

I don't care if you bought the best PSU on the market in 2000, it is in no way viable today. The main power connector has changed once, a second connector has been added, and then changed, hard drive power has changed, video card power has changed, and computers are using power at levels much higher than in 2000. (As for 2 decades ago, in 1990, you weren't even likely using Windows yet, as the first truly commercially successful version 3.1 wouldn't be released until 1992.)

"You just need to know the standards for the future cases or main-boards/video-cards." Advice for those who can see the future.

I don't mean to offend you here, but some things you said are misinformed, some are just plain not true. I agree whole-heartedly that when building a PC from scratch, you should pick up a quality PSU (I like OCZ or Corsair), but there's no reason to spend more than $75 unless you're building an extremely high end computer, and plan on over-clocking. That's hardly relevant to this topic. I went back and forth all morning on whether or not I should post this, because I don't like looking like I'm picking on someone, or that I'm arrogant or a know-it-all, I've just been building computers for many years, and have picked up some good information on the matter.
 
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Asus isn't an off brand, but it was relatively recently (Compared to the likes of HP, Toshiba, Gateway, etc) that they started selling their own computers. They were a component manufacturer before, and all the major brands sold PCs using at least some of their components. They figured, why not skip the middle man. As far as brands go, though, I say it's more about the components inside then whoever put it together. Personally, at that budget, I'd rather not pay for a brand name, and get something a bit better inside. That's one reason I mentioned CyberPower earlier, and I'm also seeing some ZT Systems PCs that look like really good value.

As far as all these pre-configured computers, they all have an achilles heel of some sort. That ASUS's is its integrated graphics card.

The CyberPower one I put together costs $747, and is a good deal. Here're the specs/choices I made (I will only list major components and/or things I changed from default):
1. Xion AXP 600 Mid-Tower Gaming Case (Case is unimportant, but this is the cheapest reasonably decent looking one, imo)
2. Power supply upgrade - 600W XtremeGear SLI/CrossFireX Ready Power Supply
3. CPU - Intel® Core™ i5-750 2.66 GHz 8M L2 Cache LGA1156
4. Cooling - Downgrade to Intel LGA1156 Certified CPU Fan & Heatsink
5. Motherboard - Default EVGA P55 TR Intel P55V Chipset DDR3 Socket 1156 mATX Mainboard
6. Memory - 4GB (2GBx2) DDR3/1600MHz Dual Channel Memory Module
7. Video Card - ATI Radeon HD 5450 1GB DDR3 16X PCIe Video Card (No 2nd or 3rd)
8. Hard Drive: Single Hard Drive (750GB SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 16MB Cache 7200RPM HDD)
9. Optical Drive: LG 22X DVD±/±RW + CD-R/RW Dual Layer Drive (BLACK COLOR)
That's page 1, there are no changes on page 2. Everything is built-in, or None
For page 3:
1. Operating System: Microsoft® Windows® 7 Home Premium (64-bit Edition)

The ZT System I found is made up of very good last gen components, and is a solid system for just over $700, and requires no configuring online.

Don't be afraid of off-brands! Do a few searches on them. ZT looks like it's a good company to do business, and I've had friends who are very satisfied with CyberPower (CP has also been around for quite a while now.)
 
I noticed you chose an intel core processor as opposed to an AMD. Is intel a better processor?
 
On those 2 computers I just put up, that i5 is definitely better than the AMD Phenom II X4 I put up.

Tom's Hardware - Benchmark Performance Index

THat's not to say all Intel processors are better than all AMD processors, but that Intel one is better. On the chart, if the score is in 'Time', lower is better, otherwise, higher is better. (And both are significantly better than my Core 2 Duo E8500... That thing was the **** just last year!)
 
I'm sorry for all the, seemingly redundant, questions but I have one more. Is wireless LAN the same as having a wireless router or wifi? Whatever computer I get I plan to have wireless in the house for my iphone. If this would work the same it would only be an added benefit.
 
eric-holmes said:
I'm sorry for all the, seemingly redundant, questions but I have one more. Is wireless LAN the same as having a wireless router or wifi? Whatever computer I get I plan to have wireless in the house for my iphone. If this would work the same it would only be an added benefit.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, no. The wireless on the computer is exactly like the wireless on the iPhone. Both require a wireless router connected to your modem to broadcast WiFi. Fortunately, wireless routers are damn cheap these days, with a Wireless G router (pretty fast, the de facto standard) costing $20-40, and a wireless n router (Very fast, most things including the iPhone can't take full advantage) stating at ~$60
 
clarinetJWD said:
<snip>
I don't mean to offend you here, but some things you said are misinformed, some are just plain not true.<snip>
Click to expand...

You don't offend by offering your viewpoint. And yes, I mentioned how much a person could spend on various components versus an off-the-shelf retail box. But I don't say things that aren't relatively true. And if you do find an "untruth", please substantiate it with documentation. When I said a PSU can work with future boards, that WASN'T a lie. A 20-pin main board connectors on older PSU's can power a main board with a 24-pin. There are adapters that convert connectors for newer standards. I never said it will work with all motherboards, in every single situation. If you thought you saw an error, thank you for correcting it and trying to help inform.

When I advise someone to spend money on something, it isn't to empty their pockets. Most everything I had mentioned was for more computing power than what a person needs to edit photos.

I'm trying to point out that while many computers have improved in offering a decent system, I've known many people that have bought HP/Compaq/E-Machines/Gateway computers who replace a power supply within a year or two. Or a hard drive went bad in that same period of time. If it is a proprietary PSU you have to spend the same amount or more on to replace it than buying very good components!! Yes, the main stream brands are better, but you can't crack open a retail system and find out if it has the standard ATX-24pin +4-pin P4 + 6pin/8pin video power plus SATA and molex power connectors and has the basic dimensions to fit micro- or mini-ATX cases.

Make sure that if you buy retail, you find out what the support is like. With e-Machines/Gateway, it's a nightmare. HP/Compaq is better. Dell support is the biggest reason they continue to have such a large market, once someone compares it to other companies, they overlook the other shortcomings.

And yes, I could build a system for $350-$400 (or have a friend do it) which will do multimedia, handle most modern games and come with dual-core technology (at least), SLI/Crossfire support and outputs for HDMI, DVI, D-sub (15-pin) with a minimal PSU for "just" what it is intended to be used for and nothing else. Or to get a quad-core & mobo combo for $250 and let someone decide on their drives/cards/RAM. Sure, it's almost impossible to compare true CPU speed & performance based upon Ghz rating due to L1/L2 cache, new core software enhancements, bus-speeds and other factors. But I don't tell someone just to look at off-the-shelf.

If the person that started this thread doesn't want to dig into the details, that is fine... and they'll probably be quite satisfied with a retail purchase from a big-box store.
 
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