ND Grads

[Colin67]

I want to improve my landscape photography and I'm off to Iceland for 10 days soon so I thought I should look at getting a filter system. The major players in the UK seem to be Lee, Hitech and Cokin.

I have a 7DII and Canon EF-S10-18, EF-S 15-85 and 70-300L. I guess I'm going to need a 100m system so I can use the wide angle.

I understand that both Cokin and Hitech can impart a colour cast under some circumstances but Lee is very expensive.

So I have several questions:

1) Under normal circumstances am I going to notice the colour cast? For an amatuer like myself do I really need to spend lee filter prices.

2) I already have polarsing filters. How practical is it to mount the filter adapter when the lens has a polarising filter on it as well - I appreciate how awkward this could be having to roate the polariser then reset the position of the grads but polarising filters for 100mm systems seem to be in the order of £200+ which seems a bit excessive.

3) What grads should I go for. I read that hard is better when working with a crop sensor should I get just hard or both hard and soft. I was thinking that a two stop and a three stop would suffice. I guess that the effect of a one stop could be easily recreated in LR.

I know some poeple will suggest braketing and combining in LR or PS. That is what I have done up until now but the other guys I am going with get great results with filters and it's one less procesing step, not to mention a whole heap of less card/disk space.

I would very much appreicate any input.

NB when I refer to Hitech I am talking about the standard range not the Firecrest which are even more expensive than Lee.

Thanks.

 

[TCampbell]

I own the Lee system, and yes... it is expensive. Ultimately I felt like I had many more options in their system. For example, you can get 1, 2, & 3 stop ND grads in either "hard" or "soft" edge versions, and you can also get circular polarizers in the slide-in form factor -- which is nice because it allows me to both polarize *and* use the ND grad at the same time.

I do have a Cokin ND grad and it was cheaper. But it's a 3-stop grad and it's basically "the" 3-stop grad. If I compare it to my Lee system, it's a hard-edge grad (the transition from light to dark happens very quickly). I wanted soft-edge grads and I couldn't find them from Cokin.

As I check the Cokin website today, I see that they now make their "Nuances" series which claim to be 'neutral' (all of their 'Creative' series grads are colored) and they claim these Nuances ND Grads are "soft" - but again, there's no option to whether you want the soft vs. hard edge... it is whatever it is.

In the Lee system, if you find yourself shooting a subject with a rather well-defined horizon line, then it's often best to use the hard-edge grad to tone down the exposure on the sky. But if you find yourself shooting a subject where the "horizon" isn't really a line (or a lot of foreground subjects protrude into the sky) then using a hard-edge grad would show a very obvious tint transition point -- probably not what you want. But a soft-edge grad makes the transition happen in a much more subtle way so that it wont be obvious to a viewer that you used a filter. It's just nice to have the choice.

The Cokin "L" size filters are 101mm (basically 4") and the Lee 100mm filters are basically the same size. There's enough play in the slot width that you can interchange the filters IF you happen to buy that particular size. In other words you could put a Cokin filter into a Lee filter holder (the Lee filter holders are much better. They're easier to attach/detatch, you can change the number of slots, you can get them with a hood, you can put an adapter on that lets you put a rotatable circular polarizer on the system, etc. Basically the system just has a lot more options.

 

[table1349]

One thing to consider is the future. The SW 150 system will cover everything you have now and if you plan to move up to a FF in the future with larger ultra wide lenses with larger front elements.

I too am a lee user and have been for a long time. You might want to check out the Formatt-Hitech system. They receive rave reviews for quality and cost.

 

[weepete]

If you are in the UK and want some decent filters on a budget check out Kood. They don't get much press but for the money they are excellent, quality wise above Hitech and Cokin IMO but not quite as good as Lee. I bought 3 sets (ND, GND soft snd GND hard) of Koods and I'm delighted with them, been using them for 2 years now. I think the only vendor I could find was crookedimaging.com. they are slightly smaller than the 100x150, i think 100x125 but it doesn't affect their usefulness. IQ wise mine are top notch so I'm happy to use and reccomend them. Short of the Lees then I'd say it's probably the best filters you can buy.

They are a 100mm system though, so you will need a filter holder too. I got mine from thefilterdude.com, great value and good secure holders. Plus they do international shipping (last time I ordered from him it was free if your purchace was over $50)

Bear in mind though that GNDs won't just bring the sky down, but anything that is above the line so may darken mountains (or icebergs) more that you'd like and you end up in a position where you need to bring the irregular shaped thing sticking up into the sky up to match the forground so HDR is sometimes a better option.

In answer to your questions
1. It depends. Often filters are not totally neutral, but the Koods I reccomended are close. It's one of the things that put me off the Cokins. So I'll assume if I see it you can too.

2. It's fine if you pay attention to lining them up, though a polarising filter before the GNDs can create some vingetting at wide angles. The ideal solution is a 105mm cpl polarising filter on the outside of the 100mm filter. Both Lee and the filter dude have these mounts as options. 105mm cpl filters are still expensive (but better than square ones)

3. Personally I'd pick a 2 stop soft, then a 3 stop soft. The hards are nice to have but I find them noticeable on a cropped sensor, and to my eye the softs are better and the ones I use most.

PS some CPLs don't have threads on the front. Worth bearing in mind if you plan to attach anything to them!

 

[Dave Colangelo]

I have the Cokin Grad ND and I cant complain about it at the price point. It has performed admirably and has been all over the world with me. Unfortunately I have yet to play with any expensive ND's so I cant really compare that well. I usually don't use a polarizer when I have the filter holder on but with some finicking it could be done fairly easily. I cant say I have ever noticed any serious color issues with the cokin but I was unaware of this so I have never tried a true test to see.

Here is a shot I grabbed (unedited) with the cokin grad ND on my D3300 35mm, f1.8, 1/160, ISO 400,

Regards
Dave

 

[weepete]

Here is s good comparison Edan Davey: Landscape Photography: Filters on a budget

 

[petrochemist]

If you are in the UK and want some decent filters on a budget check out Kood. They don't get much press but for the money they are excellent, quality wise above Hitech and Cokin IMO but not quite as good as Lee. I bought 3 sets (ND, GND soft snd GND hard) of Koods and I'm delighted with them, been using them for 2 years now. I think the only vendor I could find was crookedimaging.com. they are slightly smaller than the 100x150, i think 100x125 but it doesn't affect their usefulness. IQ wise mine are top notch so I'm happy to use and reccomend them. Short of the Lees then I'd say it's probably the best filters you can buy.

They are a 100mm system though, so you will need a filter holder too.

Just to add Kood do Cokin P size filters too. My soft grad is a Kood, but I don't think I've used it yet so can't give any idea on how neutral it really is.