What's new

P mode?

Also, as you gain experience as a photographer, you can look at a scene and know what you want from it in manual. Using P mode and then adjusting can in fact be less efficient, because you are having to get the exposure it's suggesting, then make changes, and then hope that the light didn't change to throw off what it thought. P mode is good because it's instantaneous, but if you have to change it much at all, it's actually more efficient to just use manual (assuming you have dual command wheels).

I'll agree as long as you are then entirely ignoring the camera meter and not basing your exposure on any kind of reading from the built-in light meter. I'm quite comfortable doing that but I doubt too many photographers are, and as soon as you're going to rely on the camera meter then P mode gets the edge in efficiency over a large sampling of photos.

Joe

I don't entirely disregard the light meter, but I don't let it decide how I shoot either. What I often do is have it in spot meter mode, meter out the various zones in the frame point by point, see how many stops apart they are and then pick what I want my exposure to be based on that.

So, say for instance my subject is lit by reflected light, there is some direct lighting and some shadows, I'll point my meter at those three areas, and decide how I need the subject lit. Perhaps for some shots I would want the shadow detail and just let the directly lit portions blow out. In some scenarios I'd want to avoid blown highlights and let the shadows be underexposed. You're still using the meter then, but you're not letting the meter decide how you shoot either. You're simply using the meter to give you light readings.
 
I'm not trolling. I feel like I should make a whole video showing you guys how I do what I do. I'll see if I can rig my GoPro to my DSLR so you can see what I look for in a scene, show the shots taken, then the after shot beside it after editing. I'll probably do this far from now as I currently don't have time to make a new video. If it matters, I keep at least 95% of my candid shots b&w so even if their is noise in the image I don't find it bad at all, some would even say that it adds to it. When I brighten them up, I don't feel like much has been taken away from the quality and I think I sorta threw you guys off...I don't make it super super under exposed, only under exposed to where details aren't too dark to bring back. I'd take a shot like that over a blurry one I can't fix up well enough to keep in post.
 
I'm not trolling. I feel like I should make a whole video showing you guys how I do what I do. I'll see if I can rig my GoPro to my DSLR so you can see what I look for in a scene, show the shots taken, then the after shot beside it after editing. I'll probably do this far from now as I currently don't have time to make a new video. If it matters, I keep at least 95% of my candid shots b&w so even if their is noise in the image I don't find it bad at all, some would even say that it adds to it. When I brighten them up, I don't feel like much has been taken away from the quality and I think I sorta threw you guys off...I don't make it super super under exposed, only under exposed to where details aren't too dark to bring back. I'd take a shot like that over a blurry one I can't fix up well enough to keep in post.


why do you think P mode gives you blurry photos? If P mode is giving you blurry photos, you need to practice not swinging the camera around wildly. P mode is made so that even really shaky hands get pretty sharp pictures. I usually find that the shutter speed P mode gives me is nearly 3/4 a stop faster than what I could probably get away with if I was being careful.
 
fjrabon said:
why do you think P mode gives you blurry photos? If P mode is giving you blurry photos, you need to practice not swinging the camera around wildly. P mode is made so that even really shaky hands get pretty sharp pictures. I usually find that the shutter speed P mode gives me is nearly 3/4 a stop faster than what I could probably get away with if I was being careful.

No, sometimes I have to swing it fast to get a particular shot. Not every moment is going to wait for you so I like under exposed then correcting it in post, my lens doesn't have IS. Works for me and that's how I like to do it. I think it's more of a personal preference thing. I haven't had to do much of this yet though because here in the central valley it's sunny a lot. The times I have, the shutter speed was a tad bit faster so it wasn't super dark or light
 
fjrabon said:
why do you think P mode gives you blurry photos? If P mode is giving you blurry photos, you need to practice not swinging the camera around wildly. P mode is made so that even really shaky hands get pretty sharp pictures. I usually find that the shutter speed P mode gives me is nearly 3/4 a stop faster than what I could probably get away with if I was being careful.

No, sometimes I have to swing it fast to get a particular shot. Not every moment is going to wait for you so I like under exposed then correcting it in post, my lens doesn't have IS. Works for me and that's how I like to do it. I think it's more of a personal preference thing. I haven't had to do much of this yet though because here in the central valley it's sunny a lot. The times I have, the shutter speed was a tad bit faster so it wasn't super dark or light

So, you don't have time to stop and hold your camera steady for a split second, but you do have time to bump the shutter speed up to where you're underexposed?

I'm so confused here.
 
Also, as you gain experience as a photographer, you can look at a scene and know what you want from it in manual. Using P mode and then adjusting can in fact be less efficient, because you are having to get the exposure it's suggesting, then make changes, and then hope that the light didn't change to throw off what it thought. P mode is good because it's instantaneous, but if you have to change it much at all, it's actually more efficient to just use manual (assuming you have dual command wheels).

I'll agree as long as you are then entirely ignoring the camera meter and not basing your exposure on any kind of reading from the built-in light meter. I'm quite comfortable doing that but I doubt too many photographers are, and as soon as you're going to rely on the camera meter then P mode gets the edge in efficiency over a large sampling of photos.

Joe

I don't entirely disregard the light meter, but I don't let it decide how I shoot either. What I often do is have it in spot meter mode, meter out the various zones in the frame point by point, see how many stops apart they are and then pick what I want my exposure to be based on that.

So, say for instance my subject is lit by reflected light, there is some direct lighting and some shadows, I'll point my meter at those three areas, and decide how I need the subject lit. Perhaps for some shots I would want the shadow detail and just let the directly lit portions blow out. In some scenarios I'd want to avoid blown highlights and let the shadows be underexposed. You're still using the meter then, but you're not letting the meter decide how you shoot either. You're simply using the meter to give you light readings.

And in P mode I'm doing precisely the same thing; I use the meter but I decide on the exposure and the shutter/aperture selection. I'm just doing a smidge less physical knob turning by using P mode.

Joe
 
fjrabon said:
why do you think P mode gives you blurry photos? If P mode is giving you blurry photos, you need to practice not swinging the camera around wildly. P mode is made so that even really shaky hands get pretty sharp pictures. I usually find that the shutter speed P mode gives me is nearly 3/4 a stop faster than what I could probably get away with if I was being careful.

No, sometimes I have to swing it fast to get a particular shot. Not every moment is going to wait for you so I like under exposed then correcting it in post, my lens doesn't have IS. Works for me and that's how I like to do it. I think it's more of a personal preference thing. I haven't had to do much of this yet though because here in the central valley it's sunny a lot. The times I have, the shutter speed was a tad bit faster so it wasn't super dark or light

So, you don't have time to stop and hold your camera steady for a split second, but you do have time to bump the shutter speed up to where you're underexposed?

I'm so confused here.

Or spot meter off the grass, the sky opposite the sun or +1 off the sidewalk?

Is finding a reference really that hard for people???
 
fjrabon said:
So, you don't have time to stop and hold your camera steady for a split second, but you do have time to bump the shutter speed up to where you're underexposed?

I'm so confused here.

Exactly, I can switch it with one hand with the camera down at my side whilst walking. I am much more steady when I want them to have eye contact with the camera because I allow some time to elapse. My style for that is much harder to explain and hardly anyone gets it. Here's an example of one of those
 

Attachments

  • $image-3221556648.webp
    $image-3221556648.webp
    61.8 KB · Views: 122
I'll agree as long as you are then entirely ignoring the camera meter and not basing your exposure on any kind of reading from the built-in light meter. I'm quite comfortable doing that but I doubt too many photographers are, and as soon as you're going to rely on the camera meter then P mode gets the edge in efficiency over a large sampling of photos.

Joe

I don't entirely disregard the light meter, but I don't let it decide how I shoot either. What I often do is have it in spot meter mode, meter out the various zones in the frame point by point, see how many stops apart they are and then pick what I want my exposure to be based on that.

So, say for instance my subject is lit by reflected light, there is some direct lighting and some shadows, I'll point my meter at those three areas, and decide how I need the subject lit. Perhaps for some shots I would want the shadow detail and just let the directly lit portions blow out. In some scenarios I'd want to avoid blown highlights and let the shadows be underexposed. You're still using the meter then, but you're not letting the meter decide how you shoot either. You're simply using the meter to give you light readings.

And in P mode I'm doing precisely the same thing; I use the meter but I decide on the exposure and the shutter/aperture selection. I'm just doing a smidge less physical knob turning by using P mode.

Joe

Sure, but the issue becomes with a series of pictures. In P mode you'd have to adjust every single one. In manual you can get your basic setting, and then unless the lighting changes you just snap the next one. In P mode, if the camera's light meter reads some minor change in the lighting, it's going to attempt to 'fix it'. So, for instance say you're shooting a wedding reception indoors. The DJ lights might flash jsut a bit differently, and all of the sudden your camera decided to make a completely different exposure.

And I'm not sure you're doing less physical knob turning in P mode to begin with. Because you're fiddling with one knob to get the aperture/SS balance right, and the other knob to get the total exposure right. TO the extent it works like manual, it's just as much button turning as manual.

Going back to what I was saying, manual is better when you want your exposure settings to be consistent and not jump around with every little change in light in the field of view. P works when you're shooting quick one off shots, and you have no worry about consistency, you just want the camera to get you in the ballpark fast enough.

Again, all the non-scene modes have their strengths and weaknesses, the key is knowing when which each is the most efficient tool for the job.

My basic guide:

1) Manual: when you have time to set the shot up, when you're using manual flash, when you need consistency from exposure to exposure, when the shooting conditions are really going to give the camera's computer a hard time in picking the right exposure.
2) Aperture priority: When you need precise control of depth of field, but otherwise just need a relatively standard exposure. You can use exposure compensation a bit here and there, but if you're using it all the time, it's probably more efficient to just shoot in manual
3) Shutter priority: Your shutter has to be above a certain speed, depth of field isn't a concern, and you need as low of an ISO as possible.
4) programmed auto: you need a fairly standard exposure and shot to shot consistency isn't a concern. If you're changing the settings it gives you drastically, then you're effectively shooting in manual, but without the consistency of manual. Things can jump around without you really having any idea that they were going to, until it was 'too late'.

The problem I have with using P mode unless it's really by far the most efficient way is that it can surprise you too much. With manual, after you've taken one shot, you basically know what the following exposures are going to look like. With P, it can just decide to drastically change things out of nowhere. You take one shot and it looks great, you take the next shot and all of the sudden it's exposing it with drastically more DoF or another half stop of light. With manual, nothing changes unless I change it. That's both the good and bad of both modes. With manual, you have to change it, which is sometimes an inconvenience, but with P, the camera changes it, which is sometimes annoying. It remains my opinion that if you only use 1-2 of your modes, you're not using your camera to the full extent of its abilities, and you're making your life as a photographer harder than it needs to be.
 
I don't entirely disregard the light meter, but I don't let it decide how I shoot either. What I often do is have it in spot meter mode, meter out the various zones in the frame point by point, see how many stops apart they are and then pick what I want my exposure to be based on that.

So, say for instance my subject is lit by reflected light, there is some direct lighting and some shadows, I'll point my meter at those three areas, and decide how I need the subject lit. Perhaps for some shots I would want the shadow detail and just let the directly lit portions blow out. In some scenarios I'd want to avoid blown highlights and let the shadows be underexposed. You're still using the meter then, but you're not letting the meter decide how you shoot either. You're simply using the meter to give you light readings.

And in P mode I'm doing precisely the same thing; I use the meter but I decide on the exposure and the shutter/aperture selection. I'm just doing a smidge less physical knob turning by using P mode.

Joe

Sure, but the issue becomes with a series of pictures. In P mode you'd have to adjust every single one. In manual you can get your basic setting, and then unless the lighting changes you just snap the next one. In P mode, if the camera's light meter reads some minor change in the lighting, it's going to attempt to 'fix it'. So, for instance say you're shooting a wedding reception indoors. The DJ lights might flash jsut a bit differently, and all of the sudden your camera decided to make a completely different exposure.

In P mode you don't have to adjust every single shot -- only the first one, just like manual. Assume the camera in P mode calculates a shutter of 1/250 at f/11 and I'd rather be at f/5.6. Index finger turn of the wheel and the camera is now set at 1/1000 at f/5.6 and I take the photo. Take another photo and the camera doesn't jump back to 1/250 at f/11 it stays at 1/1000 at f/5.6. If a minor lighting change occurs those settings will not change to a completely different exposure, especially since I also keep my meter set for center or spot.

And I'm not sure you're doing less physical knob turning in P mode to begin with. Because you're fiddling with one knob to get the aperture/SS balance right, and the other knob to get the total exposure right. TO the extent it works like manual, it's just as much button turning as manual.

When I decide to intervene with the meter's calculated exposure our knob turning is equal -- it's a tie. I do that pretty often but not 100% of the time. In more than 1/2 of my photos I'm very happy to accept the meter's calculated exposure and so I'm just a simple one wheel nudge away from ready or if I'm shooting a series of photos we're again tied as my exposure setting won't change unless the lighting changes. A few thousand photos later I've turned a few less knobs. This isn't a big deal at all and I wouldn't bother with these threads except for the __________ who start that, "I'm a real photographer and I only shoot manual" cr*p. They're not helping people who ask and want to learn. For the record you're not one of them.

....The problem I have with using P mode unless it's really by far the most efficient way is that it can surprise you too much. With manual, after you've taken one shot, you basically know what the following exposures are going to look like. With P, it can just decide to drastically change things out of nowhere. You take one shot and it looks great, you take the next shot and all of the sudden it's exposing it with drastically more DoF or another half stop of light. With manual, nothing changes unless I change it. That's both the good and bad of both modes. With manual, you have to change it, which is sometimes an inconvenience, but with P, the camera changes it, which is sometimes annoying. It remains my opinion that if you only use 1-2 of your modes, you're not using your camera to the full extent of its abilities, and you're making your life as a photographer harder than it needs to be.

P mode never surprises me. Machines and computer programs are designed to behave in predictable ways and they do. Cameras set to P mode do not decide to drastically change things out of nowhere -- that's nonsense. Today's camera's in fact behave with fantastic predictable consistency. In the OP's original post she said, "I've got to assume Nikon wouldn't include if there wasn't a decent use for it." That's a fair assumption. Nikon's camera engineers have a pretty good idea of how to design a really usable camera. My camera was designed by Canon engineers and it works the same way.

Joe
 
fjrabon said:
So, you don't have time to stop and hold your camera steady for a split second, but you do have time to bump the shutter speed up to where you're underexposed?

I'm so confused here.

Exactly, I can switch it with one hand with the camera down at my side whilst walking. I am much more steady when I want them to have eye contact with the camera because I allow some time to elapse. My style for that is much harder to explain and hardly anyone gets it. Here's an example of one of those

So that's a really bad exposure. I assume this is an example of your capture before editing. Have you encountered the exposure practice in digital of ETTR which produces superior results? You're going in the opposite direction here.

Joe
 
And in P mode I'm doing precisely the same thing; I use the meter but I decide on the exposure and the shutter/aperture selection. I'm just doing a smidge less physical knob turning by using P mode.

Joe

Sure, but the issue becomes with a series of pictures. In P mode you'd have to adjust every single one. In manual you can get your basic setting, and then unless the lighting changes you just snap the next one. In P mode, if the camera's light meter reads some minor change in the lighting, it's going to attempt to 'fix it'. So, for instance say you're shooting a wedding reception indoors. The DJ lights might flash jsut a bit differently, and all of the sudden your camera decided to make a completely different exposure.

In P mode you don't have to adjust every single shot -- only the first one, just like manual. Assume the camera in P mode calculates a shutter of 1/250 at f/11 and I'd rather be at f/5.6. Index finger turn of the wheel and the camera is now set at 1/1000 at f/5.6 and I take the photo. Take another photo and the camera doesn't jump back to 1/250 at f/11 it stays at 1/1000 at f/5.6. If a minor lighting change occurs those settings will not change to a completely different exposure, especially since I also keep my meter set for center or spot.

And I'm not sure you're doing less physical knob turning in P mode to begin with. Because you're fiddling with one knob to get the aperture/SS balance right, and the other knob to get the total exposure right. TO the extent it works like manual, it's just as much button turning as manual.

When I decide to intervene with the meter's calculated exposure our knob turning is equal -- it's a tie. I do that pretty often but not 100% of the time. In more than 1/2 of my photos I'm very happy to accept the meter's calculated exposure and so I'm just a simple one wheel nudge away from ready or if I'm shooting a series of photos we're again tied as my exposure setting won't change unless the lighting changes. A few thousand photos later I've turned a few less knobs. This isn't a big deal at all and I wouldn't bother with these threads except for the __________ who start that, "I'm a real photographer and I only shoot manual" cr*p. They're not helping people who ask and want to learn. For the record you're not one of them.

....The problem I have with using P mode unless it's really by far the most efficient way is that it can surprise you too much. With manual, after you've taken one shot, you basically know what the following exposures are going to look like. With P, it can just decide to drastically change things out of nowhere. You take one shot and it looks great, you take the next shot and all of the sudden it's exposing it with drastically more DoF or another half stop of light. With manual, nothing changes unless I change it. That's both the good and bad of both modes. With manual, you have to change it, which is sometimes an inconvenience, but with P, the camera changes it, which is sometimes annoying. It remains my opinion that if you only use 1-2 of your modes, you're not using your camera to the full extent of its abilities, and you're making your life as a photographer harder than it needs to be.

P mode never surprises me. Machines and computer programs are designed to behave in predictable ways and they do. Cameras set to P mode do not decide to drastically change things out of nowhere -- that's nonsense. Today's camera's in fact behave with fantastic predictable consistency. In the OP's original post she said, "I've got to assume Nikon wouldn't include if there wasn't a decent use for it." That's a fair assumption. Nikon's camera engineers have a pretty good idea of how to design a really usable camera. My camera was designed by Canon engineers and it works the same way.

Joe

If you've ever shot under cycling power lights, you will see how crazy auto modes can get, what tends to happen is they meter one split second, then the cycle changes, and they basically hit the exposure on the exact opposite part of the pwoer cycle, causing the exposures to go CRAZY. Same thing with concerts. The stage lights drive the camera's meter crazy, in P mode one second you'll have the singer wildly overexposed, and in the next drastically underexposed.

Sure, for about 70% of most people's shots, it just really doesn't matter which mode they use, as long as they know how to use whatever mode they're in. 25% of the time it doesn't matter very much. But about 5% of the time what mode you are in can make or break how efficiently you can get the shot. I guess you're saying that 70% of the time that it really doesn't matter, and most of that 15% it only matters a little bit, you're in P mode. Sure, I really don't think that matters one way or the other in that case, so I guess we agree there.
 
Thanks for starting this thread and all of the responses. I've been shooting in Av mode with a T4i for a few months. The focusing is off in the Auto mode is why I was primarily in Av mode. Since this thread I tried shooting in Priority mode. With Auto I can't change any settings and not even the on cam flash. I have that set at -2/3 flash when Av mode. (Yes I need a speed light.) My daughter has used my T4i in Auto and she noticed a focusing problem compared to our older Nikon D40. Is this because the D40 has one focus area (small square) in Auto vs. the T4i chooses the closes object point in Auto? At least in Priority I can set to spot focus & partial metering and have the lower flash with the T4i and is fairly easy to change in the Quick touch screen. As a beginner, I have been checking what the camera chose if I changed one of the other settings and checking the histogram. Any other tips?
 

Most reactions

Back
Top Bottom