Parents To Be Afraid Of!

daneNcrystal · Aug 10, 2008

Hello,

I am helping a friend out and doing cheerleading and football pictures for the team she coaches. I have never in my life seen parents like this. I still have two days of these parents to deal with and just need some advice.

I asked each of them to sign a release form. Not a big deal you would think. It is the standard model/talent release form. They are blowing up about it. I told them if they don't sign it the kids will not be allowed to get their pictures taken.

How do the bigger places get away without having parents sign these release forms? I noticed on one order form real small it states purchases acknowledges images are the property of this company and may be used for display purposes.

I am so confused - I thought I needed to release sign. Can someone help me please?

Thanks!
Crystal

Phranquey · Aug 10, 2008

As far as I understand, you are working with a coach. I am assuming this is for a school and you have their permission. Under this assumption, you have every right to take pictures of whomever you wish associated with this (these) function(s).

I noticed on one order form real small it states purchases acknowledges images are the property of this company and may be used for display purposes.

You will need to keep track of who purchases pictures, and who does not. If, by purchasing these pictures, they are signing the release, these can be used for self-advertising purposes, as stated in the release.

Technically, if you have the permission of the property owner to be there, you need no release whatsoever, as long as you do not attempt to use the photo in an advertisement or in a slanderous / misleading purpose.

tirediron · Aug 10, 2008

What is your intended use for the pictures? If they're for the school/organization as well as your own portfolio, play that aspect up. Perhaps offer the parents the opportunity to purchase images at a discounted rate?

daneNcrystal · Aug 11, 2008

These are just individual sports pictures and a team picture. I would like to put them in my portfolio maybe but maybe not. I could care less at this point. I just want to take the pictures and be legal about it - that's why I was attempting to have the release forms signed.

tirediron · Aug 11, 2008

daneNcrystal said:
These are just individual sports pictures and a team picture. I would like to put them in my portfolio maybe but maybe not. I could care less at this point. I just want to take the pictures and be legal about it - that's why I was attempting to have the release forms signed.

Check with an expert to make sure, but I believe US law is very similar to Canadian, in that if you are photographing a group, in a public location, and you have the right to photograph there (ie the property owner, parks board, school board etc allows it) then no release is req'd unless the images will be used for commercial work.

Big Mike · Aug 11, 2008

Yes, it would be best to check with your local jurisdiction as to the exact rules.

I don't think you need a model release just to take the photos, or even to use them for certain purposes. If you want to used them for commercial purposes (ad campaign etc) then you would need a release...but if you are just selling them back to the parents, I don't think you would need anything.

daneNcrystal · Aug 11, 2008

Ok - next question then...

What exactly is local jurisdiction? Where can I find this information at.

Big Mike · Aug 11, 2008

Probably best to talk to a lawyer...but that might cost you. You might be able to ask a photographer working in your area what they do.

tirediron · Aug 11, 2008

I'd contact a large photo club in the area; they will likely know or guide you in the right direction. You can also try the local library and/or Google 'photographic law'. You actually have two jurisdictions; one deals with the owners of the property and whether you're allowed to photograph on it, the other deals with the individuals right to privacy, which I'm fairly sure is a federal statute.

flipsidestudio · Aug 12, 2008

I'm pretty sure schools don't fall under normal privacy rights guys. Ask a teacher, they'll tell you that you'll probably have to get the parents permission somehow. Some schools will have media release forms on file which would mean that you can photograph anyone who's parent signed that. Maybe it differs from place to place but the school I was working with last year wouldn't let me come in and photograph without the parents' permission and they also wouldn't give me contact information for the parents.

Christie Photo · Aug 13, 2008

I know things are "different" these days. But.... I've NEVER had any portrait/memory mate/wedding customer sign a release. (Of course if I'm shooting an ad and the image will be used for financial gain, we get a signed release.)

If I ever wanted to use an image for display or advertising, I simply tell the customer that we've selected their image. Usually, they're delighted and flattered. If they should happen to protest, I'd just choose a different image.

I still do it this way. It's simple and everyone is happy. I think because there are no surprises.

-Pete

Easy_Target · Aug 13, 2008

Don't forget about this.

http://www.sacbee.com/101/story/820599.html

Remember, cops don't care about whether it's a camera or a video camera. If you're a photographer, you're always in the wrong. If you're male, you're always in the wrong. Even if you broke no laws and are right...you're always in the wrong. Only after your lawyer gets you off the hook and are vindicated by the courts are you in the right.

Christie Photo · Aug 14, 2008

Easy_Target said:
Don't forget about this.

http://www.sacbee.com/101/story/820599.html

This story is TOTALLY dissimilar to daneNcrystal's situation. Secretly "...trying to conceal a camera he was using to videotape a youth cheerleading competition" is nothing like making images of children who present themselves for photography with an order from a parent.

Further.... I bet this guy had no intentions of asking permission before distributing his video.

-Pete

skieur · Aug 14, 2008

flipsidestudio said:
I'm pretty sure schools don't fall under normal privacy rights guys. Ask a teacher, they'll tell you that you'll probably have to get the parents permission somehow. Some schools will have media release forms on file which would mean that you can photograph anyone who's parent signed that. Maybe it differs from place to place but the school I was working with last year wouldn't let me come in and photograph without the parents' permission and they also wouldn't give me contact information for the parents.

That is in the US, NOT in Canada. Legally if the students are involved in an activity related to education then photographs and video are permitted. I have even shot footage for television in a variety of schools as well as taken photos for a large widely available newspaper without any releases of any kind.

skieur

kalee · Aug 14, 2008

why is it that you think you need to procure the signed release just to take the photo?
you don't have to use it for your portfolio. you only need the model release if you plan on using the photo to promote your business. some parents aren't comfortable with their child's picture being published.