"Public photography is not a crime" - PEN Article

[ShooterJ]

LOL.... nice post btw. I have my "dick mode" but as you said... it's there when neccesarry. Sometimes you just have to be that way.

I try to be polite, but there's a line. At some point, there WILL be compliance, one way or another.

 

[ShooterJ]

I think something else of value to add to this thread is what a photographer should do when he/she IS within their rights and gets approached by an officer going too far.

Please don't argue, raise hell or resist. It won't go in your favor and most of the time a judge won't look kindly on it. Cooperation is in your best interest.

This is not to say that you did anything wrong in the first place or that you can't fight it.. you absolutely can and should.

But there's a right way to handle that and getting into it with a police officer isn't it.

 

[DarkShadow]

Like I said until people live it,they have no idea what police face daily and they run into some of the lowest form of human life along the way.A simple traffic stop for a tail light out can be deadly. If I am not breaking they law to take photos of something or someone, I still will do it respectfully.If I am asked by police to stop even if I am legally allowed,I am not going to whip out a i Can do list.I am going to respectfully say yes sir and be on my way.

 

[ShooterJ]

Like I said until people live it,they have no idea what police face daily and they run into some of the lowest form of human life along the way.A simple traffic stop for a tail light out can be deadly. If I am not breaking they law to take photos of something or someone, I still will do it respectfully.If I am asked by police to stop even if I am legally allowed,I am not going to whip out a i Can do list.I am going to respectfully say yes sir and be on my way.

That's the best thing to do. But also remember that if your rights were violated, you can take that to court after the fact. And a judge WILL take into consideration that you were cooperative at the time of the incident.

Politely ask the officer for name and badge number.. they are required to give it. You can contact their division and speak to their patrol supervisor to try and resolve it.. OR if you prefer, you can get an attorney and allow your attorney to handle any communication with the department, assuming you don't just take it to court.

 

[tirediron]

I'm not trying to "call you out" or anything like that, but I am curious as to exactly what you mean by that.

I guess I'm out of the loop, because I honestly don't know which lawsuits you are referring to.

edit
Post a link and I will read it with an open mind.

Didn't think you were! I wasn't referring to any particular group or lawsuit, but rather that some of these larger special interest groups are able to get the political machine to pay attention because their pockets are deep enough to take a case to the supreme court if they choose. 99.9% of the problems that arise with individuals (the ones legitimately doing nothing illegal) are because they don't have the means to adequately defend themselves.

 

[tirediron]

I think something else of value to add to this thread is what a photographer should do when he/she IS within their rights and gets approached by an officer going too far.

Please don't argue, raise hell or resist. It won't go in your favor and most of the time a judge won't look kindly on it. Cooperation is in your best interest.

This is not to say that you did anything wrong in the first place or that you can't fight it.. you absolutely can and should.

But there's a right way to handle that and getting into it with a police officer isn't it.

:shock: Sorry, what????? If I'm doing nothing wrong, why would I stop doing it? Let's assume that I'm a PJ working for a major daily (rumour has it there might be one or two of those left in North America) and I am photographing an event, and doing so completely legally, because I have actually researched and know the aspects of law that effect my job. As part of that, I take (or may have taken) a photo which Constable Bloggins doesn't like and he decides to tell me to stop, go away, etc, etc.... I should just walk away and stop doing my job? :lmao:

 

[DarkShadow]

I think something else of value to add to this thread is what a photographer should do when he/she IS within their rights and gets approached by an officer going too far.

Please don't argue, raise hell or resist. It won't go in your favor and most of the time a judge won't look kindly on it. Cooperation is in your best interest.

This is not to say that you did anything wrong in the first place or that you can't fight it.. you absolutely can and should.

But there's a right way to handle that and getting into it with a police officer isn't it.

:shock: Sorry, what????? If I'm doing nothing wrong, why would I stop doing it? Let's assume that I'm a PJ working for a major daily (rumour has it there might be one or two of those left in North America) and I am photographing an event, and doing so completely legally, because I have actually researched and know the aspects of law that effect my job. As part of that, I take (or may have taken) a photo which Constable Bloggins doesn't like and he decides to tell me to stop, go away, etc, etc.... I should just walk away and stop doing my job? :lmao:

I think thats a little different. if polite and have identified your self and who you work for and why your there doing a job, I would think the officer would understand and give you the green light. Unless he/she turns in to dick mode then your not going to win, then as shooter said name and page number please. You can use the law against them for violating your rights.

 

[ShooterJ]

If you're a Photojournalist, then you have press identification to present ... however, in the United States, even if ID is presented a police officer CAN ask you to leave if he/she deems it neccesarry. The press pass wouldn't grant you the power to challenge an officer on the street.

I'm sure Canadian laws differ in some regards, but if you look at the ACLU, even they will tell you.. don't challenge police misconduct on the street.

If your rights get violated, legal action is the way to go.

I'm not defending police misconduct .. I'm offering realistic advice to photographers on how to handle it without causing themselves more grief.

 

[ShooterJ]

Think of it like this ... here in the forum the moderators are the "police". It's clearly stated in forum rules that a moderators decision cannot be contested or argued with at the time a decision is made.. however, if a member feels the moderator was wrong, there are resources available to the member to report that.

It's much the same on the street.

Police officers have to handle every situation objectively.. they're human and sometimes they're wrong in what they do. But if we "backed off" because a citizen said so, we wouldn't be doing our jobs.

If I see a guy with a camera lurking on a public street and taking pictures of kids coming out of school, it's my job to find out what he's doing. Technically, he's not breaking a law because he's on a public street... but does that mean it's harmless?

 

[vintagesnaps]

If you're working media you should have an ID or credentials to verify your purpose. And as we've all probably seen on the news during breaking coverage, the authorities may move the TV reporters and camera operators to a further location for safety reasons, so even they may be asked to move as appropriate, to keep an area clear.

I've worked doing home visits in neighborhoods that are on the local news with shootings, drug busts, etc. - the police have enough to do without babysitting photographers. As mentioned you have legal recourse if needed. What is anyone taking pictures of that they need the pictures so bad that they'll stand there and argue with an officer?? There's an appropriate course of action to follow if you feel an officer was overzealous and that you have a legitimate complaint.

 

[ShooterJ]

If you're working media you should have an ID or credentials to verify your purpose. And as we've all probably seen on the news during breaking coverage, the authorities may move the TV reporters and camera operators to a further location for safety reasons, so even they may be asked to move as appropriate, to keep an area clear.

I've worked doing home visits in neighborhoods that are on the local news with shootings, drug busts, etc. - the police have enough to do without babysitting photographers. As mentioned you have legal recourse if needed. What is anyone taking pictures of that they need the pictures so bad that they'll stand there and argue with an officer?? There's an appropriate course of action to follow if you feel an officer was overzealous and that you have a legitimate complaint.

Exactly ... and arguing with the officer will probably get you arrested. If that happens, there will be no consequences for the arrest. A judge could rule in your favor regarding your right to be there .. but they will still uphold the legitimacy of the arrest itself because you resisted.

 

[ShooterJ]

Best course of action .. get the officers name, badge and/or cruiser number .. walk away .. call your attorney and sue the living chit out of them.

 

[ShooterJ]

Me personally, as a cop... I won't have a photographer leave unless..

A) His/her presence interferes with my job

Or

B) His/her presence puts them in danger

If they aren't in danger or interfering .. happy shooting.

 

[Steve5D]

But there's a right way to handle that and getting into it with a police officer isn't it.

Quoted for truth...

 

[tirediron]

...What is anyone taking pictures of that they need the pictures so bad that they'll stand there and argue with an officer?? There's an appropriate course of action to follow if you feel an officer was overzealous and that you have a legitimate complaint.

What difference does it make why someone wants the images? If they're somewhere they're not restricted from being, why is it reasonable that they should leave and then have to debate the issue after the fact?