Regarding Supposed TPF Bullies and Abuse Towards Newbies

[AgentDrex]

When I say spiritual revolution, I do not imply a Christian rapture or any religious connotation. I mean a spiritual revolution in the sense of a connection between each other being stronger. A sense of duty to provide each other with a good life in whichever way we can and not to think of ourselves first and fore-most.

I do not believe communication is the end-all solution to killing and other evils we do to each other. However I believe more honest and open communication will lead to a world where we recognize mental health issues earlier (even in childhood) and work together to attempt to curb it and not to just hide it under the table. Not just to say and think it'll be someone else's family member that goes off the deep end. I believe communication would have helped to prevent needless killings in the past if people would have admitted to themselves that something was wrong with their loved ones or spent more time with them. This isn't to say the mentally-ill cannot hide their issues. If little to nothing can be done about this through communication, then what it is the alternative? I figure if we choose to talk with our children more, talk with each other more, we'll be more likely to see the signs of illness. If teachers are trained to recognize illness at an earlier age (if they even can be) perhaps we can help stem some of the violence. But if bullying, abuse and mental illness are too hard of subjects for people to honestly talk about without resorting to mockery or denial, then what chance do we have? Is the goal here to work at protecting ourselves from those that progressed in their illness to the point they start to harm? Is it to just not care about it at all? What's the solution then?

 

[AgentDrex]

I hope it is a spiritual revolution. A new chance for us all. But if it's doom...then yea....bring it on and drag it out...and photos or it didn't happen...

It hasn't happened for thousands of years. Why would it start now?

I understand the sentiment. I can still hope. On the other hand, when did it happen last? Why wouldn't it start now? Something has to happen at some time. Is there a specific time that it happens?

 

[rexbobcat]

I understand the sentiment. I can still hope. On the other hand, when did it happen last? Why wouldn't it start now? Something has to happen at some time. Is there a specific time that it happens?

When the USA's economy finally collapses.

And I'm not even being sarcastic with that statement.

 

[AgentDrex]

I understand the sentiment. I can still hope. On the other hand, when did it happen last? Why wouldn't it start now? Something has to happen at some time. Is there a specific time that it happens?

When the USA's economy finally collapses.

And I'm not even being sarcastic with that statement.

I desire a spiritual revolution for the world not just my backyard.

That would be a sad time indeed to wait for until a revolution of the spirit finally happens. It's like discussing the mental health of someone AFTER they shoot up a mall and then kill themselves. Waiting until something bad happens to discuss what could have been done doesn't seem to be the logical time to do so, hence my desire for open communication to happen now. Not just a stifling of discussion because it is too painful to bear.

 

[rexbobcat]

I want a spiritual revolution for the world not just my backyard. That would be a sad time indeed to wait for until a revolution of the spirit finally happens. It's like discussing the mental health of someone AFTER they shoot up a mall and then kill themselves. Waiting until something bad happens to discuss what could have been done doesn't seem to be the logical time to do so, hence my desire for open communication to happen now. Not just a stifling of discussion because it is too painful to bear.

Not trying to get all offensive or anything but...The Middle East...Seriously.

Everyone else seems pretty religiously chill for the most part. But the Middle East is like "hell no we want to fight amongst ourselves as well as the rest of the world...Forever...

That's why I said that about the US. It's like the difference between waiting for the actual Santa Claus to come bring me presents, or settling for my dad half awake in his bath robe. Yes, one is ultimately more fulfilling, but realistically what are the odds of it happening...

 

[AgentDrex]

I'm not religious at all (not a christian, not jewish, not islamic, not buddhist, etc.). I have a few friends (internet buddies anyways, photographers I met on flickr a few years ago) in the Middle East (only four) and from what they tell me about the situation over there is that there a lot of people who are decent folk stuck being around people who don't want to communicate. People who are stuck in their ways and that's that. No one else is right so no discussion is necessary. Kill the infidels. They tell me that our media makes it out to seem like its the whole area that is geared towards hate. For all I know, they are rich and content (they are on the internet after-all. Not something just any poor person has access to except for maybe in the USA where a lot of homeless people have internet-capable "phones") and lying to me about how the people they know feel about what's happening over there.

 

[rexbobcat]

I'm not religious at all (not a christian, not jewish, not islamic, not buddhist, etc.). I have a few friends in the Middle East (only four) and from what they tell me about the situation over there is that there a lot of people who are decent folk stuck being around people who don't want to communicate. People who are stuck in their ways and that's that. No one else is right so no discussion is necessary. Kill the infidels. They tell me that our media makes it out to seem like its the whole area that is geared towards hate. For all I know, they are rich and content (they are on the internet after-all. Not something just any poor person has access to except for maybe in the USA where a lot of homeless people have internet-capable "phones") and lying to me about how the people they know feel about what's happening over there.

Yeah but regardless of religion though, their cultural stance on a lot of things is very...unrevolutionary.

There are those who fight against the powers that be but nobody discusses them, and the Western media glorifies the "bad" guys, so it's really a vicious cycle.

I watched a documentary one time about this woman on an Arabian American Idol type show. I think she was in the finals and when she began singing everything was going well, but then she started to dance and omg they almost had to forfeit her from the show.

Not saying it's right or wrong but if there is going to be a worldwide unity one side is going to have to give.

 

[AgentDrex]

Again, open-communication seems to be the answer in that instance as well. Cultural differences are awesome. Makes the world unique and adventurous. People of all sides seem to have this tendency to believe they are somehow above others and can force them to be the way they want. If people would rather not communicate, I'm not going to sit here and force it. I'll just communicate and discuss issues with those that desire to then.

Again I apologize if I offended anyone (I don't believe I have done so however) but I do have my thoughts about the world (limited as my thoughts may seemingly be) and discuss them openly and unsolicited. They're not political in nature (or I don't think they are) and they're not religious I believe. So I'm sure this was as good of a spot as any to try to bring up the discussion of honesty, open-communication and caring towards one another. If anything I said during this thread is wrong, please point it out. It may be a ruse on my part to bring about further discussion though. Why do I even care to when it seems others wish not to? Should I even care? Perhaps I should just shut my mouth and take my meaningless, barely-better-than-a-snapshot photos and post them here for critique. Instead I end up "whining" about what "cannot" be changed or should not be changed because its evolution to be the way we are. Maybe it's because I'm screwed in the head enough to think we still have a chance for peace regardless of the killing going on world-wide.

 

[pic_chick]

I have only been here a short while and I came here know how VERY much I had to learn and you guys have always gave very good cc and pointers I have never felt abused by anyone on here. I tend to post a photo when I feel my skill has improved (one skill at a time) and have always been helped and left with more ideas to try. I think the " I was born great now love" crowd tend to get the hammer but when you stand on dreams and pride you tend to be easy to knock over. I say let them go and keep on keeping on as we are now. Truthful helpful and way more blunt and to the point then most of the real word is now a days.

 

[AgentDrex]

I will keep that in mind, thank you!

 

[Derrel]

Spiritual, soda-pop-powered revolution!!!!!!!!

 

[ziggy84]

Again, open-communication seems to be the answer in that instance as well. Cultural differences are awesome. Makes the world unique and adventurous. People of all sides seem to have this tendency to believe they are somehow above others and can force them to be the way they want. If people would rather not communicate, I'm not going to sit here and force it. I'll just communicate and discuss issues with those that desire to then.

Again I apologize if I offended anyone (I don't believe I have done so however) but I do have my thoughts about the world (limited as my thoughts may seemingly be) and discuss them openly and unsolicited. They're not political in nature (or I don't think they are) and they're not religious I believe. So I'm sure this was as good of a spot as any to try to bring up the discussion of honesty, open-communication and caring towards one another. If anything I said during this thread is wrong, please point it out. It may be a ruse on my part to bring about further discussion though. Why do I even care to when it seems others wish not to? Should I even care? Perhaps I should just shut my mouth and take my meaningless, barely-better-than-a-snapshot photos and post them here for critique. Instead I end up "whining" about what "cannot" be changed or should not be changed because its evolution to be the way we are. Maybe it's because I'm screwed in the head enough to think we still have a chance for peace regardless of the killing going on world-wide.

From my years of being around I have concluded that communication is great, so long as it is with someone who is open-minded, if not, your just wasting your time.

Agent Drex: What your friend says about the Middle East is correct. Take Afghanistan for example. Downtown Kabul. People there are just like us, trying to make it another day. Although, they do live in a hostile country, not everyone there is bad. Ahmad Shah Massoud is prime example. I know that many American's have no idea who he is, or what he stood for, but he was against the Taliban and actually warned the US on the impending 9/11 attack among other things. A lot of people here in the states look down upon the religion of Islam and think everyone who follows is a terrorist. I just don't understand how people are that close minded to generalize an entire population as bad people.

I think the idea of peace is nice, but will never happen. Too much human greed and pride for that to ever happen. Even the Bible has for told the problems happening in the Middle East today. IE The four housemen and the apocalypse and Zech 14:2.

 

[ziggy84]

I'm not religious at all (not a christian, not jewish, not islamic, not buddhist, etc.). I have a few friends in the Middle East (only four) and from what they tell me about the situation over there is that there a lot of people who are decent folk stuck being around people who don't want to communicate. People who are stuck in their ways and that's that. No one else is right so no discussion is necessary. Kill the infidels. They tell me that our media makes it out to seem like its the whole area that is geared towards hate. For all I know, they are rich and content (they are on the internet after-all. Not something just any poor person has access to except for maybe in the USA where a lot of homeless people have internet-capable "phones") and lying to me about how the people they know feel about what's happening over there.

Yeah but regardless of religion though, their cultural stance on a lot of things is very...unrevolutionary.

There are those who fight against the powers that be but nobody discusses them, and the Western media glorifies the "bad" guys, so it's really a vicious cycle.

I watched a documentary one time about this woman on an Arabian American Idol type show. I think she was in the finals and when she began singing everything was going well, but then she started to dance and omg they almost had to forfeit her from the show.

Not saying it's right or wrong but if there is going to be a worldwide unity one side is going to have to give.

Rexobocat is correct. They are very unrevolutionary. But why should they change? Why do they need to change? I say, let them be what they want to be. These people think in a very close minded way. If something happens, it is because that is the way Allah wanted it. If something happens to them, it's Allah's wish, if it rains it's because Allah wanted it that way.

 

[pic_chick]

if you want to change the world all you really need to do is open very very good schools that are affordable. the more knowledgeable people tend to be more open to change, has less fear/faith/whatever in god and are less likely to want to fight. Also you would need to lessen the gap between the haves and the have nots and then maybe in 100 years from (when this ball starts to really get rolling) you will have a group of people that will unit as one world....

Or you could start ww3 kill off a lot of people and wipe out whole nations and boarders set yourself up as the lord king of earth (somehow not get shot) and with a fist of iron unit the world in about 2 gen or 100 years or

the best option we get invade from space and then you have the emey of my emey is my friend and lots of **** gets tossed out in the name of survival and one globe gov risse from the ash if we win and it takes a good hard toll on the whole of the earth

 

[John27]

TPF has only made me better. Not good yet, but better. I am appreciative of the time and talent that has been offered to me.

As I said in the other thread, I DO know where they are coming from. It's the useless posts. They are rarely 'bullyish', just useless. Just a quick sarcastic one liner with nothing to add or contribute. But, those are more annoying, than anything.

A thick skin is necessary. You are posting your work that you are proud of for people who are much better than you to pick apart. Compliments, pats on the back, and praise are as useless as sarcastic comments. They contribute nothing and do not improve you at all (except perhaps affirm what you are ACTUALLY doing right, but saying nice things just to be nice, while lying through your teeth? That's a disservice). I think that anyone posting C&C should realize that they are asking for CRITICISM, they are asking for someone to pick apart their image and tell them how to make it better.

When I and others post, we intend to learn what we can improve. I have been let down before. NOT bullied, nobody was mean, it's just that I've posted pictures that I really really liked and thought were really good and found out that they had a myriad of technical issues. THOSE are the most helpful threads, but they are a let down when you think you did well. Some people cannot handle that let down and think they are being personally attacked.

There is a rude or snarky comment here or there, but oh well. Happens everywhere. I think we can go beyond it. I wish people wouldn't, but, what are ya gonna do. My suggestion to those who feel singled out? Do these things;

1) Ignore the rude comments. Don't argue, it's pointless.

2) Don't argue technique or facts with experienced photographers. Whether you think it's right or wrong, saying 'That's how I wanted it to look' or 'rules are meant to be broken' or 'it's fine the way it is' in response to someone giving you a technical critique will be met with criticism. If you are willing to engage in that discussion, then by all means. But don't post that response, and then be unable to handle the rebuttle.

3) Understand that professional photography is competitive and there isn't much motivation for folks to help you. They are not required to help you and you are not entitled to their advice. If they give it to you anyway, listen to it, take notes, appreciate it. Also, read through some of the other threads. If you think your question sounds like a question that someone else asked and got a negative response, then chances are yours will also. Be prepared for it. (In regards to the 'How do I become a pro photographer' type threads)
No excuse for rude or hateful behavior, but, I don't think it happens as often as people think. I could be wrong, but, technical critique or even telling someone you don't like their photo is NOT bullying. You didn't post "Compliment this photo for me please" you posted "C&C" or "What do you think". It would be a disservice to you to get a pat on the back from everyone.

I joined this forum because of the C&C. It's harsh, it's technical, it's informative. That's what I want. My pictures suck. I don't want them to suck forever. They improve every time I post one that I think is good, and TPF systematically tears it apart. Guess what? The next one is even better.