So, do I get to call myself a professional now?

[PersistentNomad]

Whoa, this thread blew up while I was soothing a sick baby. It's a great discussion, but I have no idea what ferrets have to do with the price of tea in China.

In other news, according to some people I could have been calling myself a professional photographer for nearly ten years now, since I've been paid for providing photographic services of some kind or another at least once a year for that long.

I personally don't subscribe to the idea that I have to make buku bucks to be professional (or support myself). I set my prices based on my philosophy, situation and what I think are fairly achievable goals with the marketing plan I have in place. I'm lucky enough to have the option of being a stay at home mom if I want.

I don't feel like I'm giving my time or craft away at these prices for this point in my photographic career. I've spent a long time helping artists hone their craft and their business, including the pricing of their work. There is no standard for pricing, all artists' work is priced through a very complicated matrix of factors, though being a service photographer is a slightly less convoluted matrix.

And above all, that's still kind of how I think of myself. I'm an emerging photographer (artist) as I was once an emerging curator. Just because it was part time hours or I wasn't making enough money to live on doesn't mean I wasn't still a professional, I was just an emerging professional.

 

[Vtec44]

There is no standard for pricing, all artists' work is priced through a very complicated matrix of factors, though being a service photographer is a slightly less convoluted matrix.

Pricing can be incredibly simple: supply and demand. However, like with anything artistic and intangible, creating that demand is the hardest.

 

[vintagesnaps]

I think there is an industry standard, a range of pricing. In my area it varies somewhat if it's a gallery or art center in the city or suburbs, or in smaller towns in outlying areas. A more well known photographer or artist usually is pricing higher than average. In high end galleries in major cities I think the pricing is way higher and a different ballgame as far as pricing and being an artist that would be represented there.

Before I started doing submissions to juried exhibits, I'd been going to various art shows and openings, etc. and the neighborhood art centers in my region that are nonprofit retain a percentage of sales towards maintaining the building, hiring staff, etc. to offer programs to the community. But the pricing is usually within the going range for prints, pottery, etc. etc. regardless of if it's being sold at a small gallery or a nonprofit art center. If photographers or other artists just pull a price out of thin air and/or underprice, it seems like that would be something of a detriment to nonprofit centers if they want to continue to operate and serve their community.

Maybe I've misunderstood your situation, and sometimes photographers donate time or services, but to underprice for a customer just because someone doesn't budget for photography for their wedding doesn't make sense to me. That would seem to say you're aspiring to be a photographer who is cheap, not one that's going to be recommended because you're a good photographer.

It's not like photographers ever for the most part have exactly gotten rich, but now good photographers are struggling to stay in business because of all the people with cameras who seem misguided at best (and now are fizzling out as photographers because they weren't set up in business properly and are dealing with all kinds of problems). I just think it could be misleading getting bookings/offers quickly because you might be appealing to the people who just want cheap. I don't think that would be a good indicator of long term success.

 

[Piccell]

You can sell one item a year for 100,000.00 or 20,000 items for 50 dollars, you make the same amount.

 

[Vtec44]

You can sell one item a year for 100,000.00 or 20,000 items for 50 dollars, you make the same amount.

With weddings, you have to account for overhead cost like communication time, editing time, additional labor (assistants/second shooters), transportation, gas, etc. So 10 weddings a year at 10k each may or may not have the same overhead cost as 50 weddings at 2k each.

 

[Piccell]

I was referring to the amount of money you make, obviously that would be the net, not the gross.

 

[PersistentNomad]

That would seem to say you're aspiring to be a photographer who is cheap, not one that's going to be recommended because you're a good photographer.

I actually aspire to be both affordable and well recommended.

As far as pricing artwork for gallery settings, it's a much more complicated process to determine (particularly for non-photographic artists because of materials) and yes there is "a range" but it's a huge range. You have to factor in your particular medium & style's demand; the demand for art in general in the areas you exhibit; are you one of many or singular; the cost of creation; how prolific you are; how recognized you are locally, nationally, internationally and (lastly and leastly) size. For profit galleries will typically let you know what they want to sell your work for, but a lot of non-profit spaces don't because they aren't dealing with a standard stable of artists, it's always changing and so is their buying public.

 

[Piccell]

That would seem to say you're aspiring to be a photographer who is cheap, not one that's going to be recommended because you're a good photographer.

I actually aspire to be both affordable and well recommended.

As far as pricing artwork for gallery settings, it's a much more complicated process to determine (particularly for non-photographic artists because of materials) and yes there is "a range" but it's a huge range. You have to factor in your particular medium & style's demand; the demand for art in general in the areas you exhibit; are you one of many or singular; the cost of creation; how prolific you are; how recognized you are locally, nationally, internationally and (lastly and leastly) size. For profit galleries will typically let you know what they want to sell your work for, but a lot of non-profit spaces don't because they aren't dealing with a standard stable of artists, it's always changing and so is their buying public.

lol I don't think they are mutually exclusive. Heck if someone is doing great work and is charging less they will be more highly recommended than someone doing great work and charging more money.

 

[Vtec44]

I was referring to the amount of money you make, obviously that would be the net, not the gross.

Obviously. However, you're working much harder and spending more time while getting back less in 1 business model vs the other. So, if you believe it's the "same" then you're in for a big surprise.

 

[Vtec44]

lol I don't think they are mutually exclusive. Heck if someone is doing great work and is charging less they will be more highly recommended than someone doing great work and charging more money.

It's great at the beginning, until you come to a cross road where demand is higher than supply. There is always someone who's willing to do it cheaper. Using price to compete is a race to the bottom that nobody wins in the end. It's not a new concept. Remember this post and come back to tell me that I'm wrong in 5 years.

 

[Piccell]

lol I don't think they are mutually exclusive. Heck if someone is doing great work and is charging less they will be more highly recommended than someone doing great work and charging more money.

It's great at the beginning, until you come to a cross road where demand is higher than supply. There is always someone who's willing to do it cheaper. Using price to compete is a race to the bottom that nobody wins in the end. It's not a new concept. Remember this post and come back to tell me that I'm wrong in 5 years.

lol Tell Sam Walton that.

 

[Piccell]

I was referring to the amount of money you make, obviously that would be the net, not the gross.

Obviously. However, you're working much harder and spending more time while getting back less in 1 business model vs the other. So, if you believe it's the "same" then you're in for a big surprise.

Please read the post again, I said nothing about the amount of work, I only was talking about the money. Some people feel that there is honor and dignity in hard work. Some don't. It sounds like the OP is of the former type, whereas you might be of the latter.

 

[Vtec44]

lol Tell Sam Walton that.

Dollar Tree, 99 cent stores, and yes Walmart all have the same business model. It's nothing new. Look at the clients they attract. If that's your demographic and business model then go for it. Theres nothing wrong with it.

 

[vintagesnaps]

I don't know how you take could pride in your work and then devalue it, that doesn't make sense to me. It seems to say you don't think all that well of yourself if you think your work is that worthless. I know my work is good and has value. Getting accepted into juried exhibits if nothing else confirmed to me my photos are good enough to be hanging on the wall of a gallery or art center. I've put my time and talent and effort into my photography, I wouldn't throw that away by selling it cheap.

 

[Vtec44]

Please read the post again, I said nothing about the amount of work, I only was talking about the money. Some people feel that there is honor and dignity in hard work. Some don't. It sounds like the OP is of the former type, whereas you might be of the latter.

Since you don't get it, let me say it straight out. Simple mind set like that, ie making the same money, will get you in trouble without taking other things like over head expenses into consideration. I would rather the OP come straight out and say that she priced her work that way because her portfolio is lacking. I'd love to see her keep her pricing exactly the same in 5 years, shooting 25-30 weddings a year.

I work 18 hours a day and 7 days a week. I absolutely love it. I charge accordingly because I want my business to be sustainable, and for me to continue this many more years to come. My work has been published in numerous magazines and I still hustle just as hard as the first day I started. I also teach people to do the same that I do. I'm not sure why some people think charging so low is hard working and dignity, or charging higher is not. That's just weird LOL If anything, I worked my butt off to get where I am and I'm pretty damn proud.