Topic #3, Layers & Post Processing

Felix0890 · Feb 8, 2010

fokker said:
Thanks for that, really useful. Couple of queestions:
- When you said " simply flattened the image resulting in this" can you explain what you meant by flattening?
-What exactly is a .dng and why do you need to save it as that type rather than a .jpg? Can you not place a .jpg into a layer? (I would just try this but I'm at work at the moment so I can't).

Cheers!

When you have multiple layers, you go into the layers menu and select flatten image. It'll flatten all the layers into one single one. Yes, you can save a layered image as a jpg but I believe .dng saves the layers themselves whereas jpg saves it as a flattened image. Not too experienced with dng so I'll let him get more into that.

shmne · Feb 8, 2010

A .dng file saves all of your layers, however it does not usually save layer styles such as difference. Don't quote me on the layer styles however, because I do believe .dng may be capable of it, its just that programs outside of Adobe may not recognize the Adobe specific layer style.

mom2eight · Feb 8, 2010

Dom, Your the best. I'm gonna give this a try later, I'll post it up for you to have a look it.
Thanks

Dominantly · Feb 8, 2010

fokker said:
Thanks for that, really useful. Couple of queestions:
- When you said " simply flattened the image resulting in this" can you explain what you meant by flattening?
-What exactly is a .dng and why do you need to save it as that type rather than a .jpg? Can you not place a .jpg into a layer? (I would just try this but I'm at work at the moment so I can't).

Cheers!

1. When you have all your layers the way you want them, and the image looks acceptable, you need to combine all of your layers into a single image. It is Important you have all your layers stacked correctly, which should be obvious in your preview window. What I mean by this is you don't want a background on top, hiding all the others; for example if I had the sky on top of my edited stone and hill layer, it would hide them.
After your all set up you will right click, then select "flatten image" to take all those layers and create a single file.

So with nikon you'll have a .nef (raw) file type. When you open the file into camera raw, you have the ability to save the file as a digital negative/.dng, which will retain all your raw file data, but will also save your edits you have done. You can do this to create multiple exposure profiles of the same photo (single capture HDR's).
Yes you can import a JPEG into a layer, but when you can, you want to avoid doing any heavy processing on them. The .nef, .dng, .tiff files are all lossless, you'll retain image quality and be able to do more manipulating without degrading your file.
You can also save your work as a .psd file. This will save all your layers exactly how you see it, all separated, so you can go back and tweak it later.

R6_Dude · Feb 11, 2010

Is there a process we have to go by to stack them correctly? Or should it just be flattened and then once its all in one layer we can move them around?

Also, I don't have PSE but I do have PS CS2 and it is somewhat similar (although I don't have the red and blue pen,whats the subsitute?). I do use Canon's EOS software to make my adjustments. What I just figured out is that I can transfer my pictures from the EOS software directly into my PS and work from there! However, once it transfers, it goes into TiFF, is that ok?

fokker · Mar 9, 2010

Ok so sorry for dragging up a slightly old thread, but since it's a useful one I figure no-one will mind :sexywink:

So here is the result of my using this tutorial where I couldn't get a nice exposure for both the interesting sky and the mountain/foreground. Really like the outcome, however the Topaz remask isn't perfect. It's a bit hard to see it in this version (I don't have a higher res version as I'm posting off my flickr while at work) but you can kind of see it doesn't look right around the tree lines. I guess this is just my noob-ness at using Topaz, but even after a few goes I couldn't get much improvement. Maybe it's because I didn't follow the exact steps in your tutorial, just kinda the basic ones and made up the rest in between? I think what I did was create 2 exposures from the RAW file and save them as .tiff. I opened the lightened one with blown out sky in the background layer, then added a second layer with the sky looking good and the foreground dark in it. From there I topaz-ed the dark foreground out of the second layer, just leaving the sky overlaid over the background layer. Any issues doing it this way?

Thanks!

Dominantly · Mar 9, 2010

R6_Dude said:
Is there a process we have to go by to stack them correctly? Or should it just be flattened and then once its all in one layer we can move them around?

Also, I don't have PSE but I do have PS CS2 and it is somewhat similar (although I don't have the red and blue pen,whats the subsitute?). I do use Canon's EOS software to make my adjustments. What I just figured out is that I can transfer my pictures from the EOS software directly into my PS and work from there! However, once it transfers, it goes into TiFF, is that ok?

You stack them based on which layer you want on top. For example, I wouldn't have put the sky layer over the chimney in my above photo, the sky had to be the very last layer, everything else piled on it. Usually the further away the subject, the closer to the bottom. Once you flatten, it's done, no more moving.

The red and blue pens come from Topaz Remask 2, it is a plug in for Photoshop and can be tried for free for 30 days. I linked it in my first post. You can do it without it, it's just more time consuming. Tiff is fine to work with. I do alot of work with tiff files. Either way, you will be doing the major alterations with the initial raw file in your EOS software, everything after will be blending.

Dominantly · Mar 9, 2010

fokker said:
Ok so sorry for dragging up a slightly old thread, but since it's a useful one I figure no-one will mind

So here is the result of my using this tutorial where I couldn't get a nice exposure for both the interesting sky and the mountain/foreground. Really like the outcome, however the Topaz remask isn't perfect. It's a bit hard to see it in this version (I don't have a higher res version as I'm posting off my flickr while at work) but you can kind of see it doesn't look right around the tree lines. I guess this is just my noob-ness at using Topaz, but even after a few goes I couldn't get much improvement. Maybe it's because I didn't follow the exact steps in your tutorial, just kinda the basic ones and made up the rest in between? I think what I did was create 2 exposures from the RAW file and save them as .tiff. I opened the lightened one with blown out sky in the background layer, then added a second layer with the sky looking good and the foreground dark in it. From there I topaz-ed the dark foreground out of the second layer, just leaving the sky overlaid over the background layer. Any issues doing it this way?

Thanks!

Nice photo!
You've discovered the only part of this whole thing that can be a real PIA. That would be getting easy/quick results when masking off a photo with a tree line, or bushes.
The greater the difference between the two areas you are masking, or dragging the blue pen, the better. You can review the mask, and then zoom in to adjust it with the green/red pens, but you might not be able to get it 100% with this kind of tree line.
What I usually do (and did in that first one I posted), is use the clone tool on the tree line. The foreground should be the layer on top, so I would just select it, turn off the others and clone the tree line so it isn't ghosting and is solid. You can also get a different color (lighter) in between the branches the mask will miss, cloning will remove this as well. Just make sure when you clone you are zoomed in pretty good.

fokker · Mar 9, 2010

Okay thanks I'll give that a shot. I'm wondering if it has something to do with the chromatic abberation from my lens making the treeline not a clean line between dark and light, which causes so much ghosting.

Heretotherephoto · Mar 9, 2010

Hikin Mike put something like this up awhile back and it was also very helpful. Thanks for this tutorial. My question is if there is a way to feather this in photoshop. At least I think that is the term. A way to make the area where the two layers meet blend smoothly. I have bben trying this with a photo and am having a difficult time getting the result to look natural.