Car people, solve my dilemma!!!!!

[molested_cow]

I'm looking to get a car. I currently commute 1h15min each way to work everyday, which makes it 2.5hrs on the train. I am not complaining, but I will be moving to another place which will make my train ride more difficult. So I am considering getting a car instead.

There aren't many fun cars available in Taiwan, so I only have figured out two choices so far. Both are at the same price range. My condition is no more FWD, prefer RWD. Manual is a plus.

1. Brand new Toyota GT86 manual.
2. Used 2008 BMW 135i coupe (auto+pedal shift)

1. GT86 Advantages:
- Brand new, warranty.
- Probably more reliable, less expensive to fix.
- Much better at fuel consumption.
- Really awesome handling, very tight steering, reminds me of go-karts.
- A real life PS4.


What I don't like about GT86:
- Toyota quality, cheap, cheap, cheap. It reminds me of PS2 steering wheels and joy sticks. Even the paint sucks!
- Really lousy ride quality. Suspension is hard at all times, in a bad way, not firm or confident.
- Power isn't very stimulating.
- Interior space. Backs seats are useless. Trunk is close to being useless.
- I never really liked the aesthetic of the car. It lacks presence, like any other Toyota.


2. BMW 135i Advantages:
- I love the interior, the material and finish, very natural as opposed to the 3 series.
- Back seats are somewhat useful, which is actually similar to my old 5th Gen Prelude. Trunk is much better than GT86 as well.
- POWER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yes it has tons of it, more than I can handle now.
- Design wise, I love it. It's the only modern BMW that I will want to buy. To me its proportions reminds me of the original 3-series and the likes of 2002.
- Ride quality is very good. Confident and firm at high speed, takes bumps well at low speed.
- Big smile.

Concerns:
- N54 engine's turbos are known to have faulty waste gates.
- It's already a 6-yr old car. It will be 10 years old before I can finish the payments.
- Not very fuel efficient at all.


I spoke to a guy who's my mom's good friend's son, and who is an expert in these cars (he's a custom car parts importer and had done lots of work on the 135i before), and it seems that the 135i turbo issue isn't as big of a deal as what many people make it sound like. In that sense, I feel just a little more comfortable about the potential cost part. However, this guy's family buys and sells lands, so they are extremely wealthy. His "little hassle" can mean a lot for me. So what do you guys think? Suggestions? What else should I think about?

 

[SnappingShark]

I'd go Toyota.

New, newer features, better mileage - thus saving money. Cheaper to repair.

BMW is expensive for parts, and, well, I don't like BMW

 

[limr]

How important to you are these various things?

What I mean is, how would you prioritize the advantages and disadvantages? The Toyota doesn't have useful back seats or trunk, but how important are those things to you? Are they more important than fuel economy, for example? You say the Toyota has good handling and the BMW has a lot of power - which would you rather have? Which is more fun to drive? And how do you drive? To give an example, I have a car that really doesn't have much power in terms of overall engine performance, but it handles well and gets nice and torque-y at around 3500 rpm, so I know where to find the power when I need it, but I don't actually need it very often because I find it more fun to drive at a lower speed on very twisty, windy roads than faster on a straight highway. So for me personally, the power of the BMW would be low on the priority list, but it might be a different story for you.

I would be concerned with the maintenance costs of the 135i if money is a issue (and a higher priority than other things on the pro list.) My boyfriend has a BMW. He bought it used and does most of his own work on it and he still pays a lot in maintenance simply because the costs of the parts is sometimes ridiculously high. And he also pays more in gas, not just because of the fuel economy, but because the car needs the higher grade gasoline, which is more expensive. They're good cars and I think the right model would suit me in terms of aesthetics and performance, but I would still hesitate right now to get one because the costs of maintaining the car (not just repairs, but fuel as well, and possibly insurance rates) can be a bit intimidating. But then again, I'm poor as a church mouse, so all this is hypothetical for me

You should probably crunch some numbers first, and then weigh that against the "smile" factor. As good as the numbers might turn out for the Toyota, if you don't enjoy driving it for 2.5 hours every day, then it might not be worth it. And honestly, I can't say I blame you for not being excited about the Toyota.

 

[Braineack]

buy a commuter car.

why do you need an underpowered sport cars or an overweight cow with turbos in order to commute to work?

 

[tirediron]

I would definitely go for the Toyota. The 135 is a very nice car, and depending on the mileage, at six years old, it's probably got a LOT of life left in it, but... BMW is BMW, and no one knows how to over-price like BMW (except perhaps Mercedes). The turbo is the other fly in the ointment; frag a turbo and you've now got a very expensive paper weight which you will still likely have a year or two left to pay. UNLESS... I would do at least a 2 hour test-drive in the Toyota and see what it feels like; if after 30 minutes you've got numbum and and you're ready to drive off of a cliff, then maybe the Beemer is the right choice.

 

[IByte]

Nissan, Toyota, suburus IMO will give you the most bang for your buck. BMWs..like my computer equipment, will just leave your wallet empty.

 

[Msteelio91]

As a BMW guy, I still say go with the yota. More peace of mind over a soon to be 7 year old BMW.

I've driven both the Subaru BRZ and the GT86. They're fun cars and pretty damn cool on the inside. I see you're looking for RWD, which I'm assuming is because you prefer the feel of it over FWD. The GT86 gets sideways EASY and is fun to throw around. It has enough power that you can drive it as hard as you want and have a blast but not kill yourself.

Some points on the GT86:

-Not that powerful, you'll want more especially if you're used to torque.
-The gearbox feels a little cheap and has some play but nothing too bad.
-Quite balanced, fun in corners and getting sideways is great.
-Interior is awesome and futuristic. Also, plenty of room for me at 6'2".
-Decent on gas.
-Parts are plentiful and cheap.

 

[lambertpix]

Between the two of those, I'd pick the Toyota, I guess, but if it were me looking at a commute like that, I'd want a comfortable cabin and fuel efficiency. Something like a Golf TDI, perhaps (yeah, I know it's FWD).

 

[runnah]

Toyota all day. Cheap to run and super fun. The BMW is nice, but it's no M3.

 

[webestang64]

Toyota .......But buy the Cosworth version....:hail:.....Cosworth readies 380bhp Toyota GT86 - BBC Top Gear

 

[SpikeyJohnson]

You could always go the Subaru version of the GT86. I don't think it would feel as cheap!

Edit: also is the same car mechanically and exterior (minus the badges).

 

[runnah]

Plus with a BMW you have to become an *******.

 

[BananaRepublic]

You said your commuting, your worried about the costs of maintaining the BMW, one cost that will smack in the face whilst sitting in traffic, commuting to me means gas break honk going nowhere, is that the BMW has a 3.0 engine, just watch that fuel gauge drop, all beamers do this whilst sitting in traffic. You would probably get more fuel efficiency from a Hilux or landcruiser and they would be RWD too

The GT86 strikes me as a bag of hot air but very reliable, knowing Toyata.
Jeremy reviews the Toyota GT86 (Series 19, episode 3) - BBC Top Gear

 

[molested_cow]

But.... but..... how can I not want this??? Yes I know this is the new 235i, not the old 135i, but still the closest thing I can get to.



That said, all of you mentioned very valid points which I think about a lot too.
I don't need high powered cars as I am not a fan of pure speed. If I were to describe how I drive, it will be "I don't speed, but I don't like to brake either". Basically I don't go 10 above the speed limit because I don't want the unnecessary risk and speeding ticket. However when I approach a corner, I would prefer to use the least amount of brake to handle it. It's just much more satisfying.

I know what you will say. GT86 is what I need. In that sense, absolutely!

However, the 135i is a car I like more, much more. The high power is really a pleasant perk. I will still like it if it only has 250hp as opposed to 306hp. What I like about the BMW is the quality of ride. It's premium not because of all the leather. It's actually a very simple interior, no bling what so ever, not even a LCD screen for crazy navigation or iDrive. It feels solid, firm and confident. It feels like it's designed for you(me). As a designer, I am very picky on what I like. There's nothing I can pick on the handling. The car balance is perfect too. So in a way, the 306hp sounds like the only bad thing about it making it cost more to run and fix. If money isn't a concern at all, 135i will be my hands down preference.

The GT86 could use a little more power. The reason why I say this is, I used to drive a 97 Prelude. 2.2 liter vtec. It was old by the time I sold it (14 years), and while it drove absolutely fine on the regular roads and highway, it became apparent that I wish it has more power when I finally took it to the mountains. I couldn't even keep up with a first gen Scion TC going up hills. Where I live there are many mountain roads. I have never taken a 86 to the mountains before since I can't get access to one, but I wish it has just that bit more to make a mountain trip more fun.

Still a big dilemma. I wish there are either more to choose from, or none to consider.

BTW my friend has a GTI and his brother has a Golf R. Both are super excellent cars, except that GTI is FWD and the Golf R is totally out of my league price wise.

That aside, what really bothers me about the GT86 is the over all quality of the car. I don't like it, and while many of you said why drive such a high powered and gas drinking monster on long daily commutes, I will also ask, why spend so much time in a car that I don't like that much, let alone spending the money on it. Yes it will be more hassle free, more efficient and cost less to run, I am afraid that it will eventually become something I have to put up with as opposed to something that makes me wanna drive in it more.

 

[molested_cow]

You could always go the Subaru version of the GT86. I don't think it would feel as cheap!

Edit: also is the same car mechanically and exterior (minus the badges).

The BRZ costs a lot more here for some stupid deal between Subaru and Toyota. So that's out of the question. I like the BRZ more. I know it's just minor details, but devil's in the details!

Plus with a BMW you have to become an *******.

Hey I can help set the good example!

Toyota .......But buy the Cosworth version....:hail:.....Cosworth readies 380bhp Toyota GT86 - BBC Top Gear

After market modification isn't something I want to get into... I am just not that kind of petro head. However a super or turbo charger in the GT86 will sound like a thing that needs to be done!

I've driven both the Subaru BRZ and the GT86.

I hear that they are set up differently, like the BRZ has softer suspension setting or something like that. What's the real difference though, can you even feel it?

I'd go Toyota.

New, newer features, better mileage -

There's hardly any feature on the Toyota. Everything that the Toyota has, the Bimmer has more. The GT86 is actually as bare as modern car can get. I don't mind that though.


Also I just want to mention, when I went to see the GT86 (used), there's that side badge on the front quarter panel of the car and a piece of plastic that is supposed to look like a side vent. I touched it with my finger and could easily push it in like as if it's a thin RC car body. This is why we can never have nice things. I want a piece of machine that important to be built like my D700!