Exposing to the right

[manaheim]

Hi everyone,

I need some expert advice. I want to shoot in manual as much as possible but zero'ing out the meter often gives unexpected exposures.

As a newbie shooting Raw and post processing should I be checking the histogram and adjusting until I am at the edge of clipping the hightlights?

I read somewhere on the "internets" that this is a good idea, but I simply don't know enough to know if this will be a good practice to adopt.

The "right" way is to learn the advantages of each exposure mode and then pick the appropriate mode as required for whatever you are doing.

That said, the most common configuration that I use is Manual Exposure, with AutoISO, and then fine tuned with whatever amount of Exposure Compensation is required. Generally I use a center weighted light meter setting.

None of that is ever cast in concrete and for any given shot or for an entire job I may well switch to something else. (I don't think I've ever really used a "Programmed Mode" for other than testing. I also never use Matrix Metering or Active D Lighting, which are Nikon specific light metering variations.)

So what's that all mean??? I set Aperture and Shutter Speed for artistic effects. I let the camera adjust ISO to get an appropriate image, though I might "recalibrate" the light meter a little up or down using Exposure Compensation. This absolutely invovles monitoring the camera's Blinking Highlight display and the RGB histograms. Maybe not for every shot, but absolutely for the first few shots until I've got it "right", and every now and then or anytime the light changes to make sure things stay "right".

I'm curious how auto ISO and exposure compensation fine tunes for you. I'm not knocking your method, I legitimately want to here about it. My way of thinking is, if you mess with exposure comp, you just make your camera choose a different ISO. I NEVER shoot in auto ISO. It's just not a variable I want my camera to choose for me.

Essentially, you've created an "ISO priority" auto mode.

Yes. Those were my thoughts exactly.

And while I use automated features on my camera, Auto ISO is almost never one of them. I have used it exactly twice.

 

[apaflo]

So what's that all mean??? I set Aperture and Shutter Speed for artistic effects. I let the camera adjust ISO to get an appropriate image, though I might "recalibrate" the light meter a little up or down using Exposure Compensation. This absolutely invovles monitoring the camera's Blinking Highlight display and the RGB histograms. Maybe not for every shot, but absolutely for the first few shots until I've got it "right", and every now and then or anytime the light changes to make sure things stay "right".

I'm curious how auto ISO and exposure compensation fine tunes for you. I'm not knocking your method, I legitimately want to here about it. My way of thinking is, if you mess with exposure comp, you just make your camera choose a different ISO. I NEVER shoot in auto ISO. It's just not a variable I want my camera to choose for me.

Essentially, you've created an "ISO priority" auto mode.

It is an "ISO Priority" mode! Aperture and Shutter are set manually (technically that sets "exposure"), and the camera adjusts the brightness of the digital data by adjusting ISO according to the light meter reading. The light meter reading can be calibrated for this specific scene by changing Exposure Compensation, and yes the precise effect is to change ISO (not exposure, but data brightness).

Hence I might decide that for some given shot I want the DOF that comes from an f/4 aperture, and I may want the motion blur associated with a 1/125 shutter speed. That defines exactly how much light falls on the sensor (exposure). The light meter might see the scene as middle grey and set ISO 400. Of course the scene might actually be mostly a snow bank, and I'll know it needs more exposure, so I might set Exposure Compensation at +1 EV.

At that point taking a shot will provide an historgram, and checking it may reveal that the snow is brighter than I thought, and there's a lot of room on the right side of the histogram, so I'd want to increase compensation to maybe +1.7 EV. It also could be the snow is a lot darker than I thought, and maybe +0.3 EV is better. Any of these changes will adjust the data brightness by changing the ISO. The exposure (light falling on the sensor) stays exactly the same.

That is a simplified description, and there are many little details about usage. Setting up AutoISO and then monitoring the range boundaries, and for that matter the effects of ISO changes, is no more or less complex than what has to be done with Aperture Priority or Shutter Priority. With any of these modes the camera sets one of the three and the other two are manually set. Choosing the mode to use is a matter of deciding which artistic effects are most important and which are least.

Let the camera adjust the least important to provide operational speed, while the photographer sets parameters that affect the most important. The point of using an Auto mode vs a fully Manual mode is operational speed. If the scene or the light changes rapoidly, an Auto mode us useful. For more static subjects, for example studio work or typical landscapes, Auto modes have little if any value.

Choose the method that provides the best photography, not the one that sounds the most elitist when discussed on the Internet.

 

[Gavjenks]

It is an "ISO Priority" mode!

"___ Priority mode" is a term used to refer to a mode where ____ is not automatically changed by the camera, but instead only by the photographer.
So auto ISO is the opposite of ISO priority mode.
An ISO priority mode would be one where your main wheel changes ISO directly, and the camera automatically chooses aperture and shutter speed. Which would be weird.

 

[apaflo]

It is an "ISO Priority" mode!

"___ Priority mode" is a term used to refer to a mode where ____ is not automatically changed by the camera, but instead only by the photographer.
So auto ISO is the opposite of ISO priority mode.
An ISO priority mode would be one where your main wheel changes ISO directly, and the camera automatically chooses aperture and shutter speed. Which would be weird.

Semantics. Both EIngerson and I put it in quotes for a reason. His point was precisely well taken, and I expounded on his questions without wasting time on his semantics. You probably should have followed suit, because given the quoted phrase, he was right and your point is meaningless.

 

[Gavjenks]

There's no need to be all defensive. I was simply pointing out a semantic (as you say) mistake for clarity of anybody following along who doesn't know what priority modes are. It's a beginner's forum. Beginners need consistent semantics.

Priority means "this is important, so the photographer has control of it as a priority."
Aperture priority = you control the aperture and let other things vary.
Shutter priority = you control the shutter speed and let other things vary
etc.

Saying the opposite is potentially confusing to any beginners who are passively learning how their camera modes work as they read any of these threads.

 

[unpopular]

I agree with others, in order to understand ETTR you have to understand reflective metering, understand that zero does not mean 'correct', and a good understanding of the zone system, preferably both the pre- and post-exposure ends of it, at least in theory if not in practice.

a lot of times people will just expose some arbitrary amount over what they arbitrarily decide is 'accurate', and then correct the exposure in post in some arbitrary way. I've even seen this in otherwise respectable books and columns. IMO ETTR is about good old fashion exposure analysis, using data provided by the meter to capture the widest possible range of tones and then processing the gamma according to intent.

So yeah, you kind of have to know the meter pretty well. When I'm not mobile, I'll provide a link to a thread on spit metering.

 

[unpopular]

Oh, and what I am not sure had been mentioned yet, you don't need to be in manual mode to shoot ETTR, it's just a preference by some who do.

and furthermore unless you're into the generic look of evaluative exposure (which in some cases is the best option) I don't really think any AE mode, be it program, aperture or time priority would save you from learning about metering anyway. This whole argument is kind of ridiculous.

 

[sk66]

ETTR... I don't. Most of the time I don't have the chance to check the histogram and adjust/try again; and I would much rather protect highlights than clip them.

Manual Mode... IMO, you have to understand and be able to use it in order to "purposefully" use the other modes and remain in control. But it's not "better."

Auto ISO... ISO is often the FIRST thing I'm willing to give on. The minor losses in DR/Color depth/etc for a few stops from base are usually much less significant to an image than aperture/SS. If I'm shooting a landscape using a tripod etc, then maybe I can afford to trade in favor of ISO.

My normal mode of operation is A(Av) with spot/cw metering, and auto ISO (limits set). If I also care about SS as much as aperture I'll switch to manual mode. If I have the luxury of caring about ISO as well, I'll turn auto ISO off. If I shot Canon my methodology would be somewhat different as they don't "prioritize"/function in the same manner.

 

[EIngerson]

So what's that all mean??? I set Aperture and Shutter Speed for artistic effects. I let the camera adjust ISO to get an appropriate image, though I might "recalibrate" the light meter a little up or down using Exposure Compensation. This absolutely invovles monitoring the camera's Blinking Highlight display and the RGB histograms. Maybe not for every shot, but absolutely for the first few shots until I've got it "right", and every now and then or anytime the light changes to make sure things stay "right".

I'm curious how auto ISO and exposure compensation fine tunes for you. I'm not knocking your method, I legitimately want to here about it. My way of thinking is, if you mess with exposure comp, you just make your camera choose a different ISO. I NEVER shoot in auto ISO. It's just not a variable I want my camera to choose for me.

Essentially, you've created an "ISO priority" auto mode.

It is an "ISO Priority" mode! Aperture and Shutter are set manually (technically that sets "exposure"), and the camera adjusts the brightness of the digital data by adjusting ISO according to the light meter reading. The light meter reading can be calibrated for this specific scene by changing Exposure Compensation, and yes the precise effect is to change ISO (not exposure, but data brightness).

Hence I might decide that for some given shot I want the DOF that comes from an f/4 aperture, and I may want the motion blur associated with a 1/125 shutter speed. That defines exactly how much light falls on the sensor (exposure). The light meter might see the scene as middle grey and set ISO 400. Of course the scene might actually be mostly a snow bank, and I'll know it needs more exposure, so I might set Exposure Compensation at +1 EV.

At that point taking a shot will provide an historgram, and checking it may reveal that the snow is brighter than I thought, and there's a lot of room on the right side of the histogram, so I'd want to increase compensation to maybe +1.7 EV. It also could be the snow is a lot darker than I thought, and maybe +0.3 EV is better. Any of these changes will adjust the data brightness by changing the ISO. The exposure (light falling on the sensor) stays exactly the same.

That is a simplified description, and there are many little details about usage. Setting up AutoISO and then monitoring the range boundaries, and for that matter the effects of ISO changes, is no more or less complex than what has to be done with Aperture Priority or Shutter Priority. With any of these modes the camera sets one of the three and the other two are manually set. Choosing the mode to use is a matter of deciding which artistic effects are most important and which are least.

Let the camera adjust the least important to provide operational speed, while the photographer sets parameters that affect the most important. The point of using an Auto mode vs a fully Manual mode is operational speed. If the scene or the light changes rapoidly, an Auto mode us useful. For more static subjects, for example studio work or typical landscapes, Auto modes have little if any value.

Choose the method that provides the best photography, not the one that sounds the most elitist when discussed on the Internet.

I'm going to play around with this and see how it goes. Thanks for taking the time to respond.

 

[table1349]

Eagle74, One thing that I can't stress enough to young photographers is the need to learn and understand light itself. Once you have a good working knowledge of light, your equipment and how it works then your job becomes much easier. The histogram is a tool, a useful tool, but still a tool. If you don't understand the basics of that tool, then it's use is diminished. If you learn and understand light you will gain the ability to know and understand the range a histogram should fall in for a properly exposed photo. Realize, that properly exposed doesn't mean just what the meter says, but what you as the photographer are trying to achieve.

This may give you a bit of a start on the understanding of light. Understanding Light in Photography ? Beginner Level | Beyond Megapixels

 

[Eagle74]

Eagle74, One thing that I can't stress enough to young photographers is the need to learn and understand light itself. Once you have a good working knowledge of light, your equipment and how it works then your job becomes much easier. The histogram is a tool, a useful tool, but still a tool. If you don't understand the basics of that tool, then it's use is diminished. If you learn and understand light you will gain the ability to know and understand the range a histogram should fall in for a properly exposed photo. Realize, that properly exposed doesn't mean just what the meter says, but what you as the photographer are trying to achieve.

This may give you a bit of a start on the understanding of light. Understanding Light in Photography ? Beginner Level | Beyond Megapixels

Thanks for the link, just read it and bookmarked the site for later.

Just got my copy of Understanding Exposure today as well. I was getting overwhelmed with how many different things there is to learn. I am loving photography and its becoming apparent there is no end to learning and growing. Y'all who know so much thank you for contributing.

 

[apaflo]

I was simply pointing out a semantic (as you say) mistake [...]

You were and are still just confusing things. There was no semantic mistake. We put the words in quotes to show that the usage was not normal.

 

[EIngerson]

There's no need to be all defensive. I was simply pointing out a semantic (as you say) mistake for clarity of anybody following along who doesn't know what priority modes are. It's a beginner's forum. Beginners need consistent semantics.

Priority means "this is important, so the photographer has control of it as a priority."
Aperture priority = you control the aperture and let other things vary.
Shutter priority = you control the shutter speed and let other things vary
etc.

Saying the opposite is potentially confusing to any beginners who are passively learning how their camera modes work as they read any of these threads.

It's okay to be wrong bro.

 

[unpopular]

ETTR... I don't. Most of the time I don't have the chance to check the histogram and adjust/try again; and I would much rather protect highlights than clip them.

If you use the spot meter properly and have a good understanding of camera latitude then you will never, ever clip with ETTR. In fact, this is the main reason I use the technique. Clipping is only a risk if you arbitrarily increase exposure without paying attention to hilight placement.

 

[WayneF]

There's no need to be all defensive. I was simply pointing out a semantic (as you say) mistake for clarity of anybody following along who doesn't know what priority modes are. It's a beginner's forum. Beginners need consistent semantics.

Priority means "this is important, so the photographer has control of it as a priority."
Aperture priority = you control the aperture and let other things vary.
Shutter priority = you control the shutter speed and let other things vary
etc.

Saying the opposite is potentially confusing to any beginners who are passively learning how their camera modes work as they read any of these threads.

Don't worry about them, you are of course precisely correct. I think "ISO Priority" is a Pentax term, where user selects ISO. It does not mean Auto ISO, instead, it rules it out.

In a similar way, Nikon and Canon say Aperture Priority and Shutter Priority meaning exactly what you said (user sets it, to be given priority). This is true regardless if we selected ISO, or let Auto ISO do it.