I think im still not understanding how my flash works

[Light Artisan]

First questions I have is why the high ISO with flash, and what aperture are you using?

1/128th is not a lot of juice, something isn't right there, but you don't mention which flash you're using.

Could have answered my first 2 questions from the start to give a better understanding of the situation, no?

 

[Robin Usagani]

My apology lightartisan. I was just got a little ticked off that I asked about flash power and it turned into Understanding Exposure 101.

 

[Light Artisan]

I just wasn't understanding the situation - was trying to pull information to better help is all.

No sweat.

 

[ababysean]

me too.

 

[table1349]

Guys read the question and lets stop with the cheapshots at each other


pretty please :hugs:

So I was taking a photo of my daughter a few minutes ago. I used manual, pretty high ISO and I used manual flash at 1/128 power. On my preview it looked too bright for my taste. Then I changed the flash to E-TTL and kept the same shutter, aperture and ISO and the result was good. How come the ETTL can set the flash power lower than 1/128 power but I cant do it manually? 1/128 is as low I can go.

Basic answer to your question, the camera and flash are communicating with each other to produce the shot at set parameters. This communication provides a range of maximum power down as it sees fit.

You are not communicating with the flash. You are imputing designed parameters, full power, half power, 1/4 power etc. It would be excessively costly to put and external control for a human to dial up any power setting. That is what a light meter is for. Set two of the three parameters of the exposure triangle and it calculates the third parameter to get a proper exposure.

Hmm this is interesting since using flash manually is often quoted as "the" way to shoot flash; yet here you say what I've guessed, but never had confirmed, that the flash in ettl can select different powers to those that the photographer can in manual mode. (which goes some way to explaining why flash power output isn't recorded in EXIF data -least to my understanding).

For me I prefer camera in manual and flash in ttl/ettl. The camera then adjusts the flash output to the needs of the shot. Shutter speed then plays a part in the depth of the ambient light/background. The camera/flash combo can make that determination easily inside the programed parameters.

When not in ttl/ettl mode I am using a flash meter to get the right exposure in a full manual mode.

The only way to have a true manual variable power would be a rheostat of some sort. The issue then becomes one of duplication. With distinct power settings two flashes set to the same setting should put out the same amount of light. How do you get the exact settings if it is totally variable rheostat setup? You have no controlled settings except full power and no power. Everything in between is a guess.

 

[phiya]

Schwettylens,

I suspect maybe in E-TTL mode the flash is changing the zoom of the flash itself to a wider angle which in effect diffuses the light? I'm not sure whether or not the E-TTL can set the flash below 1/128 power, so I would check the zoom value first.

 

[Robin Usagani]

phiya.. the flash was pointed to the ceiling with blank value on the zoom. I dont think that is the case. I think it can just lower than 1/128 on ETTL mode. I didnt know this before.

 

[phiya]

That was vital info I didn't have!

Well, it was a guess, but I thought it was a possibility anyway. I'll have to do some reading up on this. You'd think you could turn the flash power down at least to a value near where the TTL feature can, but I guess not!

As a side note, how was 1/128 power too strong bounced off the ceiling? Does that flash contain the power of the sun?

 

[Robin Usagani]

LOL.. high ISO. I wanted to light up the background. Practicing my event photo taking skill.

 

[table1349]

LOL.. high ISO. I wanted to light up the background. Practicing my event photo taking skill.

You can also accomplish the same thing by lowering the shutter speed. I would stay at a least 1/60th.

 

[Village Idiot]

You FAILED reading my question kundalini

You failed to make a correct statement. ISO does have an effect. You should know that by now. Think about all the newbies that could have read that comment as fact.

He has a Canon 5D. ISO doesn't matter. :er:

Guys read the question and lets stop with the cheapshots at each other


pretty please :hugs:

So I was taking a photo of my daughter a few minutes ago. I used manual, pretty high ISO and I used manual flash at 1/128 power. On my preview it looked too bright for my taste. Then I changed the flash to E-TTL and kept the same shutter, aperture and ISO and the result was good. How come the ETTL can set the flash power lower than 1/128 power but I cant do it manually? 1/128 is as low I can go.

Basic answer to your question, the camera and flash are communicating with each other to produce the shot at set parameters. This communication provides a range of maximum power down as it sees fit.

You are not communicating with the flash. You are imputing designed parameters, full power, half power, 1/4 power etc. It would be excessively costly to put and external control for a human to dial up any power setting. That is what a light meter is for. Set two of the three parameters of the exposure triangle and it calculates the third parameter to get a proper exposure.

Hmm this is interesting since using flash manually is often quoted as "the" way to shoot flash; yet here you say what I've guessed, but never had confirmed, that the flash in ettl can select different powers to those that the photographer can in manual mode. (which goes some way to explaining why flash power output isn't recorded in EXIF data -least to my understanding).

Manual flash is the way to go if you're using multiple light sources off camera with subjects that won't be moving around much. TTL has it's place, and there are ways to cut the power down on manual, like ND filters of moving the flash farther back if it's on a stand.

But yes, in TTL mode, if can power the flash lower if what I've read is correct.

 

[MohaimenK]

Whoever said with ETTL the flash goes lower than 1/128 has no idea what they're talking about. Sorry its just the wrong information.

When you need to squeeze every very bit of power from your Speedlite, switch it to Manual mode and set it to 1/1. In E-TTL, the Speedlite uses a bit of its power for the pre-flash. By switching to Manual, you eliminate the pre-flash and send all the juice straight out in one big burst.


Conversely, if you are shooting in Manual at the lowest power setting and still have too much light, switch over to E-TTL. The pre-flash will suck up a bit of power and thereby reduce the intensity of the flash. The change will be small, but it might be just enough.


and no Kundalini, if the subject is away from background then the shutter speed/iso won't matter UNLESS shutter speed is ridiculously low and ISO is extremely high. When using flash, the flash will be same intensity on the subject at 1/125 shutter speed vs 1/160 shutter speed. The flash doesn't doesn't stay open enough to matter. Same with 400 ISO or 800 ISO. ONLY thing will change is the ambient light being darker vs brighter. (please don't start an argument with me saying I don't know what I'm talking about)

 

[Village Idiot]

Whoever said with ETTL the flash goes lower than 1/128 has no idea what they're talking about. Sorry its just the wrong information.

This is wrong. If it's not shooting at less power than 1/128 in Manual mode, then it's shooting at less than 1/128 in ETTL mode.

If you put the flash in ETTL mode and shoot a scene that would normally be blown out at 1/128, it will adjust for the scene and fire appropriately. Google, "ETTL lower than 1/128". There's lots of post on other forums and sites about it.

 

[o hey tyler]

So Mo, you're saying that if you have your ISO at 100, your flash off camera, shutter speed at 1/60th, and the flash is at 1/4 power, if you up your ISO you will only increase the brightness of the ambient light?

 

[Dao]

So Mo, you're saying that if you have your ISO at 100, your flash off camera, shutter speed at 1/60th, and the flash is at 1/4 power, if you up your ISO you will only increase the brightness of the ambient light?

From what I learned, it will affect both ambient light as well as the reflected flash light when ISO value is increased.