Is Photography More Luck than Skill?

[21limited]

I think you're being too harsh here. Are there disciplined digital shooters and sloppy film shooters? Of course. But when you are limited by the number of rolls of film you have, it changes the way you shoot. And when you are going digital and you can shoot until your battery is dead, that alters how you shoot--it would be naive to argue otherwise.

The discussion isn’t about how you shoot. That changes. its about whether those who take advantage of high frame rate lack discipline. Back in the day, you’d see accomplished photographers handing their first camera to a helper for a film change while shooting 6 fps with motor drive. Before motor drives, there was the trick of holding the shutter button down and working the film advance lever, which meant the shutter fired as soon as the film advanced.we practiced between classes. It takes practice to hold a camera steady while advancing the film manually. Only the best could afford an assistant of course. What digital did was so people who were so inclined could shoot like a pro, but digital didn’t start something new, it just brought those techniques to the masses. Again, nothing at all to do with discipline. When I finished my year in photography, the better shooters among us were always looking for people they could work as assistants for. It paid nothing, but eventually you’d be the second shooter, then eventually if you were good enough, you’d soon be out on your own,. The sort of informal photography apprenticeship system.

That whole progression, where you learned the whole process from beginning to end, including how you interacted with people is no longer. So I suspect what is being noticed here, is not a lack of discipline, but a lack of relevant training. The difference being, one is a lack of focus, the other is a lack of understanding of process. Let’s not make judgement calls, over who’s disciplined an who isn’t. A photographer shooting riders at a rodeo or sports event has to be incredibly disciplined, even shooting 30 FPS. It’s not productive going down the “WHo’s more disciplined than who” rabbit hole. If you consistently take great images, I don’t care how you get them. Single shot or burst. Who’s more disciplined than who is pretty much irrelevant, at least to those of us who just like great iamges. At craft shows I’ve never seen or heard a client say “I don’t like that image, the photographer lacked discipline because it’s probably shot in burst mode.” They buy the images they want on their walls.

“ old dude rambling on here.” Sorry if I bored you.

 

[smoke665]

That changes. its about whether those who take advantage of high frame rate lack discipline

No you made it about that, and your persistent diatribe, fails to recognize the fact - Not "ALL" photographers use burst mode correctly, not "ALL" photographers use it incorrectly. To claim @JoeW lacks "relevant training" is either naivety or unabashed arrogance, I've seen his work! All opinions are relevant, and deserve equal consideration, you expessed an opinion, as did others, now you really need to move on!

 

[21limited]

All opinions other tham mine apparently. Read the thread dude. I din’t start the “film shooters have more disciplen” theme.

 

[smoke665]

All opinions other tham mine apparently. Read the thread dude. I din’t start the “film shooters have more disciplen” theme.

I've read all the comments including yours. As in all things photography once past the basic technical points it becomes a matter of opinions. Everyone can accept or reject any opinion, but regardless everyone is "expected to respect others". Your continuing need to disrespect other opinions while pushing yours as the only correct one is getting tiresome.

 

[21limited]

To quote myself.

Let’s not make judgement calls, over who’s disciplined and who isn’t.

Whatever.

 

[snowbear]

Everyone knock it back a notch or the thread gets locked.

Go outside and shoot something.

 

[terri]

Everyone knock it back a notch or the thread gets locked.

Go outside and shoot something.

Yeah - with a camera, of course.

 

[DanOstergren]

Yeah - with a camera, of course.

This gave me a good chuckle!

 

[PhotoHobbyist]

Interesting segment of a photographer stating most of his best shots were caught by accident not planning.

 

[21limited]

Ya, I can be lucky like that too…...
2016-02-02-Gcanda-Jay-Photography by Norm Head, on Flickr

Here I am, thermal boots coat and hood, -20º C, setting up for images like this… 2016-01-20-Canada-Jay by Norm Head, on Flickr

And
2016-01-20-AP-Pine-Martin by Norm Head, on Flickr

Obviously luck was with me, and a lot of trying to keep myself and my camera warm. I wonder why there wasn’t anyone else lucky out there with me.

It’s not like I’m completely alone out there either. One of the guys, the nature writer for a news paper, up taking some background shots for his articles. You run into some very interesting people, but most of us know the best shots are taken when we are out there alone, so we chat a bit and move on.
2016-01-18 by Norm Head, on Flickr

These guys are my usual companions.
2016-02-04-Red-Squirrel by Norm Head, on Flickr

2016-02-05-Blue-Jays by Norm Head, on Flickr

And sometimes a pile of other photographers, in this case, on the wrong side of the tree. Amazing how many people with really expensive gear don’t know how to position themselves to take advntage of the light.
2016-02-05-Pine-Marten by Norm Head, on Flickr

And I do take my DSLR every where, although these days, sometiems just my phone gets used.
Where you go and set up isn’t luck, although sometimes what happens there is.

In this case, I waited until after everyone else had left, and stayed for some out of focus sunset light behind my subbject. Sometiems, it’ just matter of out waiting everyone ellse. I’ve seen hundreds of Pine Maren images, but never a set like this one.
2017-01-16-AP-Cameron-Rd-Pine Marten-6 by Norm Head, on Flickr

Some luck of course, but set up by patience, understanding where to be an when to be there. I’m not discounting luck, just saying, you have to earn it. You have to put yourself into a position where you can get lucky.

 

[AlanKlein]

Wonderful shots.

 

[SharonHearn]

Wow, they are gorgeous!