Learning Off Camera Flash

[Stradawhovious]

Well, after the (unsurprising) response to my frozen waterfall thread, it has become painfully clear that I have a ways to go in the world of OCF. The fact that I didn't even bother to try to take the flash off the camera in that series is now painfully disheartening.

Don't get me wrong, I understand the basic idea, and indoors, in a generic sized room in a house, I'm all over it. I can (reasonably well) figure out where to put the flash, and use it. The problem comes in places that are a little different. In the case of the waterfall pics, I didn't even bother taking the flash out of the hotshoe since I would have no idea what to to with it in that venue.

For example.. the frozen falls pics, or a church, or an outdoor venue, or a dress rehersal for a play, or a rock climing wall or etc. etc. etc. What to do there?

How are some of you able to look at these scenarios and say "well, I will put a strobe there, there and there....." and be reasonably assured of your results?

I realize that there is a little tweaking involved in everything, and some of it has to do with trial and error, but I would like to think that there is an online resource or book that some of you have learned a bit from as far as how to read a scene for lighting.... I will be taking a class later this month, but I'm pretty sure that it will be the very basics and not much more. And before someone recommends it, I do frequent the "Strobists" post here.

Any input is valuable.

 

[Tight Knot]

Well, after the (unsurprising) response to my frozen waterfall thread, it has become painfully clear that I have a ways to go in the world of OCF. The fact that I didn't even bother to try to take the flash off the camera in that series is now painfully disheartening.

Don't get me wrong, I understand the basic idea, and indoors, in a generic sized room in a house, I'm all over it. I can (reasonably well) figure out where to put the flash, and use it. The problem comes in places that are a little different. In the case of the waterfall pics, I didn't even bother taking the flash out of the hotshoe since I would have no idea what to to with it in that venue.

For example.. the frozen falls pics, or a church, or an outdoor venue, or a dress rehersal for a play, or a rock climing wall or etc. etc. etc. What to do there?

How are some of you able to look at these scenarios and say "well, I will put a strobe there, there and there....." and be reasonably assured of your results?

I realize that there is a little tweaking involved in everything, and some of it has to do with trial and error, but I would like to think that there is an online resource or book that some of you have learned a bit from as far as how to read a scene for lighting.... I will be taking a class later this month, but I'm pretty sure that it will be the very basics and not much more. And before someone recommends it, I do frequent the "Strobists" post here.

Any input is valuable.

GREAT QUESTION!!! I'm waiting for some quality info myself.

 

[bluetibby1]

Me as well.
Blue

 

[Village Idiot]

Being able to see the light and experience.

Visualize the light as a physical object and it will help. You know an unmodified speedlight will shoot out light in a specific direction and will have a certain pattern and fall off no matter what. From there, visualize how the light reacts with the atmosphere (is is clear or foggy), the objects it's falling on (is it something that's flat black and absorbs most of it or is it shiny and reflective, causing the light to bounce off the object at other things in the scene), and how modifiers affect the light (do you have an umbrella on it that changes the beam spread from tight to wide and creates soft shadows instead of hard or do you have something on the flash head to create a smaller light source for tighter harder shadows).

It's really about being able to see that and knowing from experience how light will work with your subjects and scene.

Light is science, it's not some mythical property that only a master can use. Until the laws of physics go changing on us, it will always work the same.

 

[KmH]

Also frequent the Strobist web site www.strobist.com.

 

[Stradawhovious]

Being able to see the light and experience.

Visualize the light as a physical object and it will help. You know an unmodified speedlight will shoot out light in a specific direction and will have a certain pattern and fall off no matter what. From there, visualize how the light reacts with the atmosphere (is is clear or foggy), the objects it's falling on (is it something that's flat black and absorbs most of it or is it shiny and reflective, causing the light to bounce off the object at other things in the scene), and how modifiers affect the light (do you have an umbrella on it that changes the beam spread from tight to wide and creates soft shadows instead of hard or do you have something on the flash head to create a smaller light source for tighter harder shadows).

It's really about being able to see that and knowing from experience how light will work with your subjects and scene.

Good info! Thanks. To the point, and common sense. I would assume that there are many here that have a firm grasp of this, and view it as second nature.

In regards to this....

Light is science, it's not some mythical property that only a master can use. Until the laws of physics go changing on us, it will always work the same.

Herin lies the problem. Much like any othe type of science, it comes much eaier to some than it does to others. Some can just "get it" and others need to dive in and digest the science for a while before it clicks. Unfortunately, I'm in the latter category with "lightology". I realize that the basic properties of light are fairly simple. It goes in a straight line. The shape and "hardness" can be controlled by the delivery method (strobe etc.) and distance, as well as any outside forces acting upon it. (reflectors, diffusers etc).

What I don't get is how to use those delivery methods to my advantage, or how to "see" the impact of light placement before taking test shots. That to me is more of an art than a science. I want to try and learn that art, or at least get a basic understanding of it with the gear I have. I'm tired of ruining shots due to incompetence.

Also frequent the Strobist web site www.strobist.com.

Good safety tip Egon! I will go there now. :thumbup:

 

[gsgary]

I think one of the most important things about OCF is controlling Ambient light.
You have to decide how much you want in the shot, this is controlled by shutter speed and ISO, lower you shutter speed or raise your ISO will raise the amount of ambient in the shot, the flash exposure is controled by aperture once you have adjusted your flash exposure leave it alone.
The quickest way to set up your exposure (if you have a flash meter) is to take an ambient reading and chose a setting with about 1/100-1/125 this way you can raise your shutter speed for a different effect, now we set the flash to the same settings as the ambient this will give you a nice looking shot but nothing special . Now by adjusting your shutter speed you can alter the background, to make it darker raise your shutter speed and if you want to blow out your background or make it lighter lower your shutter this can come in very handy at a wedding when the weather is too bad outside to shoot, using this technique will bring the outside inside
Sorry for the bad writing hope you all understand

 

[Village Idiot]

Being able to see the light and experience.

Visualize the light as a physical object and it will help. You know an unmodified speedlight will shoot out light in a specific direction and will have a certain pattern and fall off no matter what. From there, visualize how the light reacts with the atmosphere (is is clear or foggy), the objects it's falling on (is it something that's flat black and absorbs most of it or is it shiny and reflective, causing the light to bounce off the object at other things in the scene), and how modifiers affect the light (do you have an umbrella on it that changes the beam spread from tight to wide and creates soft shadows instead of hard or do you have something on the flash head to create a smaller light source for tighter harder shadows).

It's really about being able to see that and knowing from experience how light will work with your subjects and scene.

Good info! Thanks. To the point, and common sense. I would assume that there are many here that have a firm grasp of this, and view it as second nature.

In regards to this....

Light is science, it's not some mythical property that only a master can use. Until the laws of physics go changing on us, it will always work the same.

Herin lies the problem. Much like any othe type of science, it comes much eaier to some than it does to others. Some can just "get it" and others need to dive in and digest the science for a while before it clicks. Unfortunately, I'm in the latter category with "lightology". I realize that the basic properties of light are fairly simple. It goes in a straight line. The shape and "hardness" can be controlled by the delivery method (strobe etc.) and distance, as well as any outside forces acting upon it. (reflectors, diffusers etc).

What I don't get is how to use those delivery methods to my advantage, or how to "see" the impact of light placement before taking test shots. That to me is more of an art than a science. I want to try and learn that art, or at least get a basic understanding of it with the gear I have. I'm tired of ruining shots due to incompetence.

Experience. when you first put a flash behind a white shoot through umbrella (assuming you have), did you know what it would look like in a small room? Like a kitchen, bedroom, living room, etc?

Did you know that it would light your subject and create soft shadows, but also spill light throughout the room, also illuminating your subject from bounced light?

After shooting with a particular setup long enough, you'll realized what light and what modifiers look like and how to use them for a specific scene. When I set up the zombie shot I took, i placed my lights and fired, the only movement that I needed to do after setting up my lights was to pull the lower ambient light back so that it wasn't so bright in the photo.

A setup that I really like for portraiture that can make your subject pop uses three lights, two back at 45 degrees behind the subject on either side. Strip or softboxes are best as the allow more control, but an umbrella or bare flash will work. The last light is with a beauty dish or umbrella close and above your subject. The lights from behind add secular highlight with the main light above creating a nice soft light to illuminate the face and features. It's simple and used a lot, but I know what I'm getting when I use that setup.

 

[Blake.Oney]

To build on what VI said, here's what I usually do. I try to visualize the light as a line. I will bend down or step up to my flashes and look from their "viewpoint" and imagine there is a line coming directly from the flash. If I'm bouncing then I do the same thing to figure the angles out. From there you're only a few test shots away from fine tuning it as far as the spread you want, the power etc.

 

[Stradawhovious]

Experience. when you first put a flash behind a white shoot through umbrella (assuming you have), did you know what it would look like in a small room? Like a kitchen, bedroom, living room, etc?

I can really appreciate this, and figured this was the best way. My experience with anything other than a speedlight is EXTREMELY limited at best, and my experience with the strobe is not much ahead of that. I have had exactly 4 hours of time to play with some studio setups, and that wasn't even enough to satisfy a tiny portion of my curiosity. The time I did spend made me pretty certain that in a decent sized room, with 90 degree angles on all the walls, and enough room to move, that with Keylight A, and fill B I can get decent acceptable lighting. Not so much when the angles change, the size is strange, and the area deviates from the traditional "box" that can give you the illusion of infinite space like a studio space can.

The problem with the "let experience be your guide" method is that it intensley cost prohibitive. In order to see what the result of the shoot through umbrella is, I have to obtain a shoot through umbrella. This can be done by borrowing one if you are lucky, and purchasing one if you are not.

I have never been particularly lucky.

Also, lets take the Frozen Falls example from above...... (only because the mental scars of that one are still fresh).....

If I am unfamiliar with how the light is going to react in a certain environment, I am going to go through a whole lot of methods before stumbling on to the right one.

For example, in the case of the falls, lets say that I get a shoot through umbrella or two, and set them up. I may find the *best* way to set up that particular medium for that particular scene, but it might be better lit with a white reflective umbrella, or a silver reflector, or a soft box, or one shoot through, and one reflecting, or........ or......... :head asplode:

That is my issue. How does one learn about making the best educated guess possible, as to the best tool for the job.....

Or is it worlds easier than that, and you just know how what you have will react and you use it?

If the latter, how do you know what to buy first?

O jeez. I'm getting great answers, but they are just making me ask more questions. (all the good answers generally do)

I'm sure that I am drastically overthinking this, but please still Keep the answers coming. The have been great so far.

If anyone needs me, I will be in the corner slowly rocking in the fetal position, and possibly crying and drooling.

 

[OrionsByte]

Can I answer your question(s) with a question?

How do you know what f/stop to use to get the DOF you want? How do you know what shutter speed is going to be enough for you in a given situation? To be sure, at first you probably relied a lot on your meter and on trial and error, but as you gain experience you start to think about those things less and less.

A couple weeks ago someone pointed out to me that using a flash through a shoot-through umbrella will have a "hot spot". I wanted to see what that looked like so I literally took a series of pictures of a bare wall with the flash about 4 feet away; one set without the umbrella at a few different zoom settings, and one set WITH the umbrella at the same settings. As a result I have a bunch of pictures of a blank wall with (intentionally) blown out highlights that form a very specific pattern, and from those I was able to form a mental image about how the flash behaves that I can use from now on.

So my advice is just to go through similar exercises. It doesn't matter if the photo is any good, the important part is that you learn how the light behaves. Observe what effects there are when you change the angle of flash-to-subject, or bounce the flash, or change the zoom setting, etc.

Also someone already mentioned the strobist blog - check out their "Lighting 101" and "Lighting 102" posts. You can find them in the right-hand margin in pull-down menus. There is a TON of information there as well as experiments for you to try out.

 

[Village Idiot]

Any idea where experience comes from? It wouldn't be from experimenting, would it?

 

[Stradawhovious]

Any idea where experience comes from? It wouldn't be from experimenting, would it?

Nope. I had no Idea. Turns out I was born yesterday.

What I have: The desire to experiment.

What I haven't: The appropriate tools. (All I have it one, count them one speedlight.)

What else I haven't: The slush fund necessary to buy the tools for the sole purpose of experimenting. (that ****'s expensive!)

I'm simply interested in knowing more about the science of lighting, so I can start understanding the art, and decide which tools to buy first. I was hoping there was an informative resource available like I have found with many other subjects in life. It seems that the stobist site is a good place to start.

I have gotten some good responses here, will continue my journey and find a good starting point. In the mean time, I will be playing with what I have, and learning more about it.

Thanks for all of your responses!

 

[kundalini]

What I don't get is how to use those delivery methods to my advantage, or how to "see" the impact of light placement before taking test shots.

That's why they are called test shots. I have spent hours upon hours alone in a darkend room with a stupid pink monkey named Wilson to see light patterns, light fall off, effects of different modifiers, etc. You will go mental at times. It is a process. I still have so much more to learn.

 

[Stradawhovious]

I have spent hours upon hours alone in a darkend room with a stupid pink monkey named Wilson to see light patterns, light fall off, effects of different modifiers, etc. You will go mental at times. It is a process. I still have so much more to learn.

Don't take this the wrong way, but you have no idea how relieved I am to hear this.