Olympus M.ZUIKO 60mm f/2.8 Macro Lens and Raynox 250

[Derrel]

Looks like the gear is doing the job, but to shooter needs better technique and better lighting gear/methodology. True "macro" work (not close-up work, but true 'macro' work) is _very_ demanding, and requires impeccable technique and flawless understanding of multiple aspects of photography. I would stress understanding that, over the last 10 years, we have started seeing MANY "stacked" images which are NOT labelled as such, and quite possibly, you have fallen into the trap of mis-conceptualizing how "easy" it is to take single-frame Macro shots of live insects..

How would you suggest that I improve them? Normally with my Canon lens I can get better than this
Hoverfly IMG_7703 by davholla2002, on Flickr

I would have expected to get equal with the Panasonic.

Research, education, practice, and time...

Look at this video,and how SHALLOW DOF is used,creatively...plus, how the majority of the images were made with a small flash connected via a pigtail cord...a relatively standard set-up these days for high-magnification work.

 

[Derrel]

I am now on my phone using speech to text. The first really high magnification super detailed medical files I ever saw that weren't as good as many of today's digital files we're done with the hybrid method, which was to take a close up using Kodachrome 25 in a flash Unit from 1 to 2 feet away, and two then take a high magnification close-up of the slide. I first saw these photos in 1990 or 91 in amazing close of detail of insects and other macro subjects.

At the time, the photos were absolutely staggering. This was about two years before Photoshop was invented and released to the public, and the photos were probably 10 years old at the time of first publication.

The difficulty with the 55 or 60 mm macro lens, is that it is inherently relatively low magnification, and does not provide a highly magnified image no matter what distance it is from the subject. This is why longer macro lenses such as 90 mm 105 mm 180200 mm lenses,I have been made by several manufacturers over the years. For bugs my favorite used to be the sigma 180 mm APO F/3.65 HSM macro,which gve a 1:1 life(-size image at 18 inches from the focal plane to the subject

 

[Derrel]

In a nutshell, my advice would be this; practice, practice, practice. For example, you need to be able to utilize extremely small amounts of depth of field. For example, at high magnification's, the depth of field is less than 1 mm, so even the body of a fly, will not totally be in focus. The trick is to find something that is interesting, and which may be shown in A very limited amount of in focus picture area. Because the back of the camera is not parallel to the entire subject, either the back or the front of the focused area will be out of focus. One of the secret is to approach the subject so that the back of the camera is parallel to the greatest part of the subject. Your second fly photo above is a good example of the subject and the depth of field not being in harmony. In the video I linked to, Notice the green beetle; while only its head and antennae are in the plane of Sharp focus, and the carapace of the insect is mostly well behind the point of sharpest focus, it is still an interesting and compelling photo. This is a good example of utilizing very limited depth of field any creative manner. The whole area of high magnification macro is plagued by very shallow depth of field, and as I mentioned in my first post to you people have found a technological way around this, in both the Fillm era, and in the digital era.there is also a creative/artistic way around limited depth of field. Without a swinging front standard, any fixed body camera gives the photographer only a certain amount of depth of field. Stopping the lens down to F 16 or F 22 or F 32 makes for a deeper depth of field, but without any weight to tilt the front standard i.e. the lens, there is only so much one can do in a single exposure.

I was being totally sincere above, when I suggested more research, education, and practice.

 

[BrentC]

Before you give up take a look at this thread to see what kind of results you can get. Also this might be a better place to ask your questions regarding that combo. But you should have no issue getting stellar results from that combo.

Showcase - Olympus 60mm f/2.8 Macro

 

[davholla]

Before you give up take a look at this thread to see what kind of results you can get. Also this might be a better place to ask your questions regarding that combo. But you should have no issue getting stellar results from that combo.

Showcase - Olympus 60mm f/2.8 Macro

Thanks for that, I have asked there. I don't just want good results, I want to see if I can get better than with my existing

So far not really any better.
Here aremore two examples.
Canon, ok reasonable detail, single shot minimal editing
DaresCanon by davholla2002, on Flickr

Panasonic, not very good, post focus about 20 images (I think).

DaresPanasonic-1 by davholla2002, on Flickr

I think the problem is not the gear but the relative experience, now as I could send this back for the next few days I would like to get better to make it worth while

Any advice?

 

[BrentC]

First I would suggest take shots without the focus stacking. See if you can get a good single shot. How is your flash setup with the panasonic?

 

[BrentC]

Also tell me what setting you are using

 

[Derrel]

Yeah, I see that you get better results using the Cannon vs. the Panasonic. Is it a matter of viewfinder size and clarity? Or familiarity with the gear? How long have you owned each camera? How much have you shot each?

 

[davholla]

First I would suggest take shots without the focus stacking. See if you can get a good single shot. How is your flash setup with the panasonic?

Good idea, I haven't got a flash for it yet.

Also tell me what setting you are using

Looking at what other people had used, I was using aperture setting and 4.0.

Yeah, I see that you get better results using the Cannon vs. the Panasonic. Is it a matter of viewfinder size and clarity? Or familiarity with the gear? How long have you owned each camera? How much have you shot each?

Cannon years, thousands of keepers. Panasonic 3 days and 1 keeper (if that).
It is definetly familiarity and because I am trying to do something different - use something that doesn't exist in Canon.

 

[BrentC]

I think light is your biggest issue. Try single shot with flash first and get comfortable with that with the new gear. Then go to focus stacking. I am not sure about the Panasonic but I can use flash with my focus stacking on Olympus.

Also did you use the Raynox on this shot? I would not have bothered. That looks to be a decent sized insect. Also try focus stacking without the Raynox first.

Also looks like a few of the frames were left out from the stack. Possibly they couldn't be aligned. I use focus bracketing more often and let PS or something else stack the frames. But even when I use focus stacking I tend to grab the frames and use PS. I turns out better than the in camera stacking.

 

[waday]

get comfortable with that with the new gear

Brent and Derrel provided great responses, and I don't have anything to add, except with the quoted section here. This is really important, especially when you're trying to get similar results from a camera that you've only known for days compared to a camera you've become extremely accustomed to using.

When I switched from Canon to Olympus, relearning the camera/menu/etc was a lot and it took several months for me to get used to it. In fact, it took me 15 minutes after I opened the box for me to figure out why the camera wasn't using autofocus and was stuck in manual focus. My first thoughts were that the camera was broken, until I realized there was a MF clutch on the lens.

Jeez, that was embarrassing; thankfully only the internet knows about it now. LOL

 

[davholla]

get comfortable with that with the new gear

Brent and Derrel provided great responses, and I don't have anything to add, except with the quoted section here. This is really important, especially when you're trying to get similar results from a camera that you've only known for days compared to a camera you've become extremely accustomed to using.

When I switched from Canon to Olympus, relearning the camera/menu/etc was a lot and it took several months for me to get used to it. In fact, it took me 15 minutes after I opened the box for me to figure out why the camera wasn't using autofocus and was stuck in manual focus. My first thoughts were that the camera was broken, until I realized there was a MF clutch on the lens.

Jeez, that was embarrassing; thankfully only the internet knows about it now. LOL

Why did you switch? Apparently Panasonic is meant to be more user friendly than Olympus.

 

[BrentC]

Take a look at this guys photos. He has same combination as you.

Panasonic Post-Focus Stack

Springschwänze (Springtail) Collembola

 

[waday]

get comfortable with that with the new gear

Brent and Derrel provided great responses, and I don't have anything to add, except with the quoted section here. This is really important, especially when you're trying to get similar results from a camera that you've only known for days compared to a camera you've become extremely accustomed to using.

When I switched from Canon to Olympus, relearning the camera/menu/etc was a lot and it took several months for me to get used to it. In fact, it took me 15 minutes after I opened the box for me to figure out why the camera wasn't using autofocus and was stuck in manual focus. My first thoughts were that the camera was broken, until I realized there was a MF clutch on the lens.

Jeez, that was embarrassing; thankfully only the internet knows about it now. LOL

Why did you switch? Apparently Panasonic is meant to be more user friendly than Olympus.

Various reasons, including cost, size, and better features. Going for the EM1, I have a camera that is weather resistant and pretty darn tough. I have a 12-40 f2.8 pro lens that’s the same size of a Canon 18-55 f/variable, yet is much higher quality. The lens selection is great, and I can pocket most of my lenses.

I tried both Olympus and Panasonic (and several others), but the Olympus felt the best in my hands.

 

[davholla]

Take a look at this guys photos. He has same combination as you.

Panasonic Post-Focus Stack

Springschwänze (Springtail) Collembola

I have, I asked him for advice but I didn't hear back.