Photography Lawsuit

[smoke665]

It was a written and signed contract

Then depending on the strength of the contract you should be ok. As others stated, contact an attorney, for advise. The initial conference won't be much if anything, and then you'll know how to proceed. Bear in mind that a lot of times even if you win the battle you lose the war, when you go to court. Legal fees, lost time, bad press, all add up in a hurry.

 

[table1349]

Dear Dewy, Cheatum & Howe LLC. Attoney's at law.

My daughter is getting married next month and I would like to hire your law firm as the wedding photographers for my daughter's wedding. Please contact me so we can make arrangements.

Asking for legal advice on a photography form is like asking a toilet salesman how to become a photographer. Lawyers don't usually advise their clients to to discuss their cases with others while in litigation, especially in writing on a world wide public forum.

 

[Designer]

Lawyers don't usually advise their clients to to discuss their cases with others while in litigation, especially in writing on a world wide public forum.

True, but at least our advice is free. You can't get that just anywhere.

 

[VincentPaul]

Thank you everyone for your input I really appreciate them. Just some

I want to be as fair as possible but,
Given that photography is not my full time job yet I had to take time out from my job to make it to this event (that cost me money)
I've spent days, weeks and nights working on this product (time I will no get back)
Drove over an hour to this shoot (Gas & mileage spent)

You need to decide if this is an appropriate career path for you. These last complaints from you are completely irrelevant to the client. Your description of events and how you fulfilled your contract have not convinced me that you conducted yourself as a professional photographer.

Therefore; if you choose to treat wedding photography as a business, you've got a lot of ground to make up with the client. Otherwise, keep photography as your hobby, and don't try this again.

Thank you for your feedback, I'd like to know which parts of the description would have given you those impressions. There are many things I now would have differently in hindsight but I ask to get a different perspective of how I could have done better.

 

[VincentPaul]

Dear Dewy, Cheatum & Howe LLC. Attoney's at law.

My daughter is getting married next month and I would like to hire your law firm as the wedding photographers for my daughter's wedding. Please contact me so we can make arrangements.

Asking for legal advice on a photography form is like asking a toilet salesman how to become a photographer. Lawyers don't usually advise their clients to to discuss their cases with others while in litigation, especially in writing on a world wide public forum.

Ok I'd like to clear up my reasons for posting this if I haven't been clear. I'm asking for advise from photographers about what a photographer would do in my situation, I am NOT asking for legal advise. I'm not sure how your statement is of ANY value to this discussion as others have pointed out some valuable points from a photographers perspective. You may and should keep your sarcastic comments to yourself, if you have nothing of value to bring to the discussion please do not comment on any more of my post(s).
Thank you

 

[table1349]

Dear Dewy, Cheatum & Howe LLC. Attoney's at law.

My daughter is getting married next month and I would like to hire your law firm as the wedding photographers for my daughter's wedding. Please contact me so we can make arrangements.

Asking for legal advice on a photography form is like asking a toilet salesman how to become a photographer. Lawyers don't usually advise their clients to to discuss their cases with others while in litigation, especially in writing on a world wide public forum.

Ok I'd like to clear up my reasons for posting this if I haven't been clear. I'm asking for advise from photographers about what a photographer would do in my situation, I am NOT asking for legal advise. I'm not sure how your statement is of ANY value to this discussion as others have pointed out some valuable points from a photographers perspective. You may and should keep your sarcastic comments to yourself, if you have nothing of value to bring to the discussion please do not comment on any more of my post(s).
Thank you

Perhaps you should show this thread to your lawyer and ask them what they think.

 

[astroNikon]

Dear Dewy, Cheatum & Howe LLC. Attoney's at law.

My daughter is getting married next month and I would like to hire your law firm as the wedding photographers for my daughter's wedding. Please contact me so we can make arrangements.

Asking for legal advice on a photography form is like asking a toilet salesman how to become a photographer. Lawyers don't usually advise their clients to to discuss their cases with others while in litigation, especially in writing on a world wide public forum.

Ok I'd like to clear up my reasons for posting this if I haven't been clear. I'm asking for advise from photographers about what a photographer would do in my situation, I am NOT asking for legal advise. I'm not sure how your statement is of ANY value to this discussion as others have pointed out some valuable points from a photographers perspective. You may and should keep your sarcastic comments to yourself, if you have nothing of value to bring to the discussion please do not comment on any more of my post(s).
Thank you

The whole problem is that if we give you "advice" and they do sue .... and anyone' statements here could be construed as giving "legal" advice, which we aren't and can't.

Since you mentioned one of their options was going to court .... that's just a big red flag for us.

You had a contract, etc. The contract is interpretable by the court. And the situation and provided materials (pictures, etc) can be deemed by the court as meeting the contract or not.

But it *seems* as though you did the right things, but we can't be the judge of that .. literally and figuratively.

As mentioned before .. try to give them a partial refund and see if they are happy about that. It all depends upon the other party and how far they push.

The bad thing about the internet (a) we do not know how accurate your statements are; (b) we have no idea what the contract actually states; (c) we have no idea on how well you did per contract; (d) any and everything else that we cannot see nor read or interpret.

but as a photographer you just want out of the situation as quickly as possible in order to move on. In any profession, the more time you waste doing nothing but dealing with a problem, the less time you have to make income/revenue (or just relax).

 

[VincentPaul]

Usually the biggest failing in a "paid" photo gig is not having a contract. But you didn't make that mistake. You did a contract, and that is excellent. By your description, it sounds like your dealing with a couple of %$#@'s. Those kinds of people simply exist.

It sounds like you've made an effort to satisfy them that goes beyond the contract. While that's admirable, you may have sent a signal that you'll bend (and keep bending) to their whining. That's not a bad thing, but has possibly put you into a bit of a hole.

Whether you *actually* hire an attorney to send a letter, or you say that you're hiring an attorney to send a letter, that might be your best next step. At this point, it sounds like "cease-and-desist" is in order (firm, but as nicely as you think it needs to be).

You said that there is a connection to another client from the past. Hopefully, this isn't crossing over into friend territory, because that sadly would get awkward for you.

The only other thing as a "lessons learned" for going forward is to put a clause in your contract that describes photography as an aesthetic thing. I have this exact clause in my contract:

"The Client acknowledges familiarity with The Photographer’s portfolio and is requesting services with knowledge of The Photographer’s style; that The Photographer’s work is constantly evolving; that The Photographer’s services are of unique and artistic nature; that the photographs may be different from those taken by The Photographer in the past; and that in creating the photos, The Photographer shall use his personal artistic judgment to create photographs consistent with his personal interpretation of the event(s), which may be different from The Client’s and/or the Subject’s vision of the event. Accordingly, The Client acknowledges that Payment for the photographs shall not be subject to rejection on the basis of taste or esthetic criteria."

Good luck.

Correct and thank you sharing. The client is someone I have known through mutual friends in the past so although I could've made the mistake of going on verbal agreement I decided to protect myself just in case. Here is what section 5 of my contract stated;
5. Image Size, Colour, Style and Composition
All image sizes are approximate. The photographer will provide a pleasing colour balance but cannot guarantee exact colour matching. It is sometimes not possible to record on film or in print the exact colour as seen by the human eye. There is no right to reject on the basis of style or composition.

As far as the DVD claim I did send them a link to download the full video as soon as they alerted me the first DVD was not working. So suffice to say they have the video available to view, only that they wish to have it in DVD format.

 

[smoke665]

@astroNikon

and - (E) the laws of your state, country, etc.

 

[VincentPaul]

It was a written and signed contract

Then depending on the strength of the contract you should be ok. As others stated, contact an attorney, for advise. The initial conference won't be much if anything, and then you'll know how to proceed. Bear in mind that a lot of times even if you win the battle you lose the war, when you go to court. Legal fees, lost time, bad press, all add up in a hurry.

Thank you. I will contact a lawyer about my best options

 

[ClickAddict]

Asking photographers what they would do in a LEGAL situation is asking for legal advice. Yes, there is a photographic spin on it that may be particular to photography (although not unique) and getting a photographer's perspective (in case they have faced similar issues) is valid, however it's still a post requesting advice on how to handle a contractual/legal situation. (It's like going to a motorcycle gang and saying I want to take photos of some Harleys, how do I go about doing it? It's impossible to help without giving photographic advice. Unless they are photographers themselves, your questions should probably be aimed at photographers who specialize in that sort of thing. And when the field in particular is legal.... and can lead to some major financial problems.... experts are best.

 

[Derrel]

Regarding the DVD and it not playing in their player: it is very possible that you did not follow the right DVD authoring format for **their** hardware, or that there are illegal characters or chapters or headings in the internal structure of the DVD. Are you really, trulty experienced in DVD authoring and DVD software requirements?

Are they trying to play a "Windows DVD" on a set-top player perhaps?

What exact format was the DVD authored in? A good case in point these days: Mac OS El Capitan no longer recognizes many of my very own computer-formatted (Win/Mac) discs that I authored under earlier versions of Mac OS, yet OS El Capitan will still play ISO 9660 (or whatever) generic DVD-Video discs that I have. Is it possible that they have a Mac OS computer? Or that you somehow authored the DVD in a somewhat "proprietary" or "OS-specific" type format that will not play on other machines?

 

[VincentPaul]

One last point,
The contract did state the initial 1st deposit was non-refundable which was paid through Paypal. I am willing to reimburse them the $350 check they sent in to help rectify the issue. Given that they did receive the products I don't believe a full refund make sense. The only issue however is that in my 10 plus years doing business with Paypal in my last 2 client claims, they have ALWAYS sided with the buyers so maybe I will simply reimburse them the paypal payment instead (which was greater than half the amount).

 

[VincentPaul]

Regarding the DVD and it not playing in their player: it is very possible that you did not follow the right DVD authoring format for **their** hardware, or that there are illegal characters or chapters or headings in the internal structure of the DVD. Are you really, trulty experienced in DVD authoring and DVD software requirements?

Are they trying to play a "Windows DVD" on a set-top player perhaps?

What exact format was the DVD authored in? A good case in point these days: Mac OS El Capitan no longer recognizes many of my very own computer-formatted (Win/Mac) discs that I authored under earlier versions of Mac OS, yet OS El Capitan will still play ISO 9660 (or whatever) generic DVD-Video discs that I have. Is it possible that they have a Mac OS computer? Or that you somehow authored the DVD in a somewhat "proprietary" or "OS-specific" type format that will not play on other machines?

I'm not too sure what DVD system they are using. They did mention having Mac laptops that did not have dvd drives, so I don't believe it's on a mac system. My DVDs were compiled on my PC windows 10 with DVDStyler. I tested on my laptop, desktop and PS2 player which is my only other DVD player as I do not normally play DVDs at home. It all played just fine prior to me sending it out to them.

 

[jcdeboever]

Why get lawyer involved? Isn't a small claims court easier, providing the married couple haven't started formal litigation? I am not a legal person but more curious as to why no one seems this is a viable alternative for the photographer?