Pulling my hair out... Looking for someone to take me under there wing!! and help me!

[Kbarredo]

but..but...but...what if the "fact" the newbie posts is not a fact but rather an opinion of a very polarizing (and doubtful) nature?

Bitter called you out and rightfully so...

The crap storm already started and I'm looking for an umbrella vendor.

Sorry I was not able to find the statistics of photographers hired in the last 100 years. I could also ask him to post the source disproving my opinion. In the end if he does not have the source does that not make kmh statement an opinion as well. Not knowing the extent of kmh knowledge about the photography sales in the last 100 years; that would make his statement as worthless as mine.
As for the source, I had already offered it in my original statement. Look at your parents and grandparents wedding photos. Not many were done by professionals. Nowadays professionally done photographs are becoming a more popular trend. Then again my parents were poor filipinos therefore none of them could afford photographers.

The difference between your opinion and KMH's opinion are as follows:

KMH's opinion is valued among the members of TPF. It is well established.
KBarredo's opinion is no longer valued because you have ruined your reputation through numerous trashed threads.

You could have responded to Bitter's post with a logical post:
"this is why I feel this way...yadda...yadda...yadda."

but instead you said it was:
"common sense"

Which indeed it was not.

You just proved my point. Because they are more liked, their opinion is right no matter the lack of evidence they have to show for it. So this is like highschool all over again. The popular ones are praised for their words no matter how wrong and insulting. While the social outcasts are ignored or alienated even if they are right. This attitude allows certain people to be wrong and get away with it, while forcing others to be 100% accurate all the time. In this case I could have a degree in every aspect of art and photography but could still have no credibility because i am disliked by many of the more popular users.
Elron hubbert's opinions are valued among the scientology community, it does not make his theories any less absurd.

 

[Bitter Jeweler]

Dude. If you are going to state a "FACT", you would have to have proof. The burden is not on us to prove you wrong.

Your OPINION is based on your own personal evidence and experience, but says nothing about the world as a whole, or any particular country therein.

My grandmother DID have a professional photographer photograph her wedding. So did my parents, and neither come from "money".

So my personal experience negates yours. It says nothing towards the trends YOU are claiming to be FACT.

If you don't like your simple opinions to be challenged, do not post them. If you wish to appear credible, have SOURCES to back up your claims.

You are right. I know nothing about your knowledge and wisdom, other than what you post here. As far as what you have posted here...well...

 

[Bitter Jeweler]

The smarter ones are praised for their words no matter how (assumed, yet to be proven) wrong and insulting.

How was asking for sources for your claims an insult?

While the social outcasts are ignored or alienated even if they are right.

Still waiting for proof.

This attitude allows certain people to be wrong and get away with it, while forcing others to be 100% accurate all the time.

Please cite examples. Again, if you are going to make a statement, you absolutely must be able to prove it.

In this case I could have a degree in every aspect of art and photography but could still have no credibility because i am disliked by many of the more popular users.

But you don't, DO YOU? You are making suppositions, which are worthless in debate.

Elron hubbert's opinions are valued among the scientology community, it does not make his theories any less absurd.

The same can be said for all of christianity, no?

 

[Kbarredo]

Dude. If you are going to state a "FACT", you would have to have proof. The burden is not on us to prove you wrong.

Your OPINION is based on your own personal evidence and experience, but says nothing about the world as a whole, or any particular country therein.

My grandmother DID have a professional photographer photograph her wedding. So did my parents, and neither come from "money".

So my personal experience negates yours. It says nothing towards the trends YOU are claiming to be FACT.

If you don't like your simple opinions to be challenged, do not post them. If you wish to appear credible, have SOURCES to back up your claims.

You are right. I know nothing about your knowledge and wisdom, other than what you post here. As far as what you have posted here...well...

You are right it is my own personal opinion and not a fact. Then again we come from 2 totally different backgrounds. My family is from a poverty stricken country where art was the last thought in anyone's minds. When I told my family I paid 3500$ for a professional photographer they went nuts. My opinion is based on my experience and yes I could be wrong but unless there is a study performed, we will never know.

 

[Bitter Jeweler]

You are right it is my own personal opinion and not a fact.

Thank you, come again.

 

[Kbarredo]

The smarter (yet to be proven) ones are praised for their words no matter how (assumed, yet to be proven) wrong and insulting.

How was asking for sources for your claims an insult?

I was talking about kmh. He came out of nowhere insulting me.
Lets not get intelligence and knowledge mixed up here. You are definately more knowledgeable in photography but it does not make you more intelligent.

 

[480sparky]

 

[shortpants]

I would say a lot of people hire a photographer for their weddings, judging by the amount of my friends on FB that have beautiful photos posted. I'm not sure how that even matters though. The point is that if someone IS paying a "photographer" to shoot one of the most important events in their life, they better know what they're doing! It's almost shocking me that people take on these jobs with no experience. I would never in a million years.

 

[subscuck]

Man, I miss too much workin' at night and sleeping during the day. All the good stuff is over by the time I get up. :meh:

 

[lyonsroar]

Man, I miss too much workin' at night and sleeping during the day. All the good stuff is over by the time I get up. :meh:

Get up earlier! It's worth it!


Is there a Big Mike here?
Paging Big Mike.
eKool?
Is there an eKool in the building?

 

[Moe]

Dude, let it go. It's not because he's "popular" and "liked". It's because he's experienced.


Oh...and because he's right.

 

[kundalini]

Lets not get intelligence and knowledge mixed up here.

You are your own worst enemy. I suggest you stop while you're behind.

 

[enzodm]

It is difficult to find facts on this topic.
In Italy, the average expense for a wedding in 2009 was 27000 euros. Among items considered necessary, there was of course photographer and also video service (on average, 1000-2000 + 600-800).
Quando costa il matrimonio? Analizziamo voce per voce | Guadagno Risparmiando
http://www.tisposo.it/preparativi/budget/preventivo.php
This is the only fact I found.

Regarding personal experiences, for the value they may have, at all weddings I participated there was a professional photographer, except mine (I left a camera on a table, and some friends took snapshots, but all the wedding was uncommon - starting from the fact people came without knowing the reason).
Pictures of my parents wedding were taken by a professional (and they were poor, actually they knew each other when emigrated abroad). My parents-in-law have only friends snapshots - they did a very small ceremony, again uncommon).
I do not have wedding pictures of my grandparents -it is likely they did not do a real ceremony. However, all pictures I have of them when young were taken by professional photographers - a hobbyist camera was a luxury much more than a professional service. First true snapshots I see at home are of my parents, taken by "rich" relatives that sooner or later were able to buy a camera.

If we have to consider this on a worldwide level, I would consider even snapshots as a luxury. However, all people here, independently from where they came from, share at least the luxury of a dSLR or an advanced P&S -so, no one is truly representative of developing world.

 

[Ron Evers]

In my circle of friends & relatives only one had a pro photographer & his parents owned a construction company. Fifty years ago I did three weddings for relatives or else they would only have snapshots from Kodak Brownies to keep. I think I shot two rolls of colour print film with my Minolta SLR on each. I gave them the negatives no charge to print what they wanted. With the one exception, nobody had $ to spend on a photographer. Times have changed.

 

[subscuck]

Hense asking for help from people who know what there talking about..

Then that's who you should listen to.

I have been told by friends & family that I have the eye for photos.. so I take that support any day...

While it's nice to feel supported by them, unless they're photography pros, they are the last people you should listen to.

Every mom with a camera feels the snap shots of little Jimmy and Jane are world class photos worthy of the Louvre. We call this wearing "Mommy Goggles". Your friends and family are also wearing goggles. Their assessment of your work is based on their emotional attachment to you. You come to a forum to get honest feedback from people who don't know you and don't have that emotional attachment. This is the only way to get objective, rather than subjective, opinions/critique/advice.

There is quite a bit to be learned on this forum, but as already stated, there are always threads about "Hey, just got my first DSLR yesterday, a Canikon DxxxD with an 18-55mm kit lens. I'm shooting my first wedding this Saturday, what settings should I use?" If you stick with this hobby, and learn and grow, you'll come to love the taste of popcorn as well.

Remember, having an eye for photography is great, but it needs to be backed up with technical mastery.