Schooling vs. Self-taught

[skieur]

School is ALWAYS a good thing, but not required. To be successful as a photographer comes down to marketing. Pure and simple. You can hire someone to do all the business stuff, but you had better know how to find work or you will never be a success, no matter how good you are.

No, schooling of some sort is required more and more. With better educated clients, it is rather important for any photographer to have a very good level of spoken and written literacy, which is usually attained through schooling. Act like someone who cannot compose a coherent sentence and as a photographer you will be treated as someone who can be taken advantage of, financially, because of your apparent ignorance.

In dealing with businesses this attitude increases exponentially. Respect in dealing with businessmen is directly related to intelligence and education demonstrated in part through spoken and written literacy.

skieur

 

[newimage]

With better educated clients, it is rather important for any photographer to have a very good level of spoken and written literacy, which is usually attained through schooling. Act like someone who cannot compose a coherent sentence and as a photographer you will be treated as someone who can be taken advantage of, financially, because of your apparent ignorance.

You're talking about education on a high school level. If a person still can't compose a coherent sentence as an adult then odds are being a business owner is not the best option. LOL

 

[JG_Coleman]

You're talking about education on a high school level. If a person still can't compose a coherent sentence as an adult then odds are being a business owner is not the best option. LOL

And yet so many of the business owners I've worked for seem to "defy gravity" in this respect... *sigh*

 

[kkamin]

There is so much talk about business in this forum and I think the OP now understands that most photographers that work freelance, whether they do retail or commercial work, will be counting on their marketing and business skills to remain active.

But besides that requisite business skill set, would an emerging photographer benefit from a higher education in photography/visual art or would it not make a difference.

Think hard...Do you think a self taught dentist is generally as good as a licensed dentist? Do you want them working on your teeth? Do you want the self-taught hippie at the co-op prescribing you herbs or a doctor with a prescription?

School can be amazing. take advantage if you can!

 

[magkelly]

I think it can be done either way, but going sans school is tough unless you're extremely disciplined and have a good natural business sense. That being said being in a GOOD school is paramount and unfortunately when it comes to design and photography there are a lot of racket schools out there.

I will never forget the day I wasted 20K on total crap teaching. I went to school originally to become an illustrator and a web designer. Photography was a secondary thing, and I went in with quite a bit of knowledge from reading a lot, having taken quite a few art classes in high school and with a fair idea of how to use Photoshop, Illustrator and the like for the basics.

Their idea of a comprehensive 2 year degree design curriculum? 2 semesters worth of very basic art history, painting color comparisons by hand, playing with shapes and noodles, and finally taking some barely competent digital imaging classes using only Apple computers and versions of software that were 2 steps back. 3rd and 4th semester? A little more drawing, some more painting, no illustration, and nothing more advanced in terms of learning to do proper illustration, etc via computer. No basic HTML, nothing about coding for web, making web graphics, nothing, else, just the above.

That was supposed to prepare me for working in the design field?

NOT

I left there, 20K in debt, and a lot wiser, went out to the West Coast, started teaching myself the more advanced tech stuff from books and videos, and while NOT working in my chosen field, finally found a decent photography mentor, or rather he found me, but that's another story.

Honestly I think 75% of what I know now, and for the record I have quite a ways to go, I'm not pro material, not yet, and I freely admit that, I taught myself. But that other 25% the GOOD stuff I got from my first mentor that was just invaluable.

If I had to do it over again I'd just learn the tech stuff myself and only take classes in photography one at a time. No college, no design school just good tech classes, seminars and such focusing more on the things I really want to learn. I'd still study with my mentor if I could. Taking the to spend learning with him was the best decision I ever made, and I really regret that I had to leave before I got to finish with him, but I'd definitely go back and just forget the college and formal design school.

There are other places you can take photography classes. Most bigger cities have art centers with photography classes and labs, mentor programs. That's the route I'd go if I could. On top of that there's always video tutorials, and seminars. It's a much more effective use of the money than college for someone who wants to be a good pro photographer I think.

That's not to say you can't do it yourself, but I do think it's harder. A mentor, classes, it does help keep you focused.

 

[David Dvir]

I for one have never taking any schooling in regards to photography or business. As well, Next month we're are opening our studio up for a class, so now I'll be teaching to boot.

However I think something needs to be mentioned that people are all different. For some, learning something may come easy and for others it may require a lot more work. I never took any courses but I know that it doesn't mean I'm any better or worse at photography. I just learn best by making my own mistakes and taking the time to figure things out.

Other people may not have the patience to learn this way and so taking a course may be better for them.

 

[Sbuxo]

I'm on my way to getting a Bachelor of the Fine Arts, (majoring in Photography) and I don't feel that school doesn't make "better" photographers, but can lead you down the right path, (faster?), sometimes! I'm still in the process but I believe the two best pros of going to school: more opportunities for exhibitions and internships. Besides, when you go to a University and take upper level photo classes, you're just focusing on building your portfolio, finishing major projects, making connections and being critiqued, you're not being told how to make your photos amazing, I don't believe that by going to school for photography you are "paying" your way through, some people do believe that but art majors have a lot of pressure on them and whether you decide to be schooled or be self-taught, either way: a lot of hard work is required.

I'm not sure which is the road less traveled, Schooling or Self-Taught, but both have their pros & cons.
Scholarships are nice too.

 

[Browncoat]

Just some food for thought:

Nationwide (U.S.), applicants to the College of Education at major universities have the lowest test scores, GPA, and average IQ compared to other programs of study. This means that the old adage is true:

Those who can, do. Those who can't...teach.

 

[Sbuxo]

Just some food for thought:

Nationwide (U.S.), applicants to the College of Education at major universities have the lowest test scores, GPA, and average IQ compared to other programs of study. This means that the old adage is true:

Those who can, do. Those who can't...teach.

Can you cite the source of that? And I didn't see any stats.
Just curious, :er:

 

[Browncoat]

Can you cite the source of that? And I didn't see any stats. Just curious, :er:

Pretty much common knowledge. The study and official results are even on .gov websites.

 

[skieur]

Just some food for thought:

Nationwide (U.S.), applicants to the College of Education at major universities have the lowest test scores, GPA, and average IQ compared to other programs of study. This means that the old adage is true:

Those who can, do. Those who can't...teach.

That is not the case in Canada, but then test scores don't mean very much. Any true expert in education realizes that text scores relate more to the expertise or lack thereof in the make-up of the test. It is easy to create a test to get the results you want. Some provinces in Canada have been doing exactly that for political reasons for years.

If you want to reduce teacher pay, then you create more difficult region-wide testing to show that teachers are not doing their job. If you want to prove that government initiatives have improved education then you create easier region wide tests to show a great improvement in results.

skieur

 

[Christie Photo]

Just some food for thought:

Nationwide (U.S.), applicants to the College of Education at major universities have the lowest test scores, GPA, and average IQ compared to other programs of study. This means that the old adage is true:

Those who can, do. Those who can't...teach.

How do your figure? Are you saying the applicants are teaching? Your assertion is irrational.

-Pete

 

[kkamin]

School is a huge waste of time. It's also apparently taught by the unexceptionally minded. When I have kids I'm never going to ever let them near a school. I will supposedly "home school" them, but in fact I'm just going to let them watch cartoons and music videos all day long. When they reach age 18 I'm sure my illiterate, uneducated children will have the same intellectual and creative problem solving faculties as anyone else.

Schoolz 4 suckas!

 

[ghache]

Ive been 5 year in college in computer systems and spent around 60k. i got out of it with a 36k dept that i am currently paying off.
i am currently working as a network/system consutlant for the feds. i just wish i had more time for photography.

I learned everything i know about photography by myself in the last 2 years. i just wanna kick myself in the nuts when i think about what i could have accomplished, learned or invested in during that time. thats 8 years ago.
I was ****in broke for 5 years anyway. i should have been broke trying to start a business instaid of being broke going to school.

 

[Browncoat]

How do your figure? Are you saying the applicants are teaching? Your assertion is irrational.

:er: Yeah, that must be it. Apparently deductive reasoning is a learned skill. Next time I'll be sure to draw pictures and use big words.