The Coffee House

[Frank F.]

Speaking of Climatization and Ventilation I wrote a little piece on it, watching construction in the neighbourhood:

Picture & Story, 12 September:

Wärmedämmverbundsystem, Energieeinsparverordnung, Passivhaus

A little German lesson today covering a new cultural phenomenon described in the words above.

So what is it all about?

Traditionally humans built houses that breathe, which means the walls let air and water in and out to a certain extent meaning there will never be too much water inside, because it can go through the walls to the outside and balance the concentration out.

Trouble is that this kind of house needs a lot of energy except you build very thick walls that insulate against heat and cold but this has gotten so expensive that most people do not do it and build thin walls.

To save energy, people had the idea to build houses that are air tight. The air and heat exchange will then be conducted through a passive or active air flow system. That means, that the hot air that is going out is heating the incoming cold air or vice a versa, depending on the time of year.

This way you save tremendous amounts of money and energy for heating and cooling both of which contribute about 1/3 to world energy consumption.

A lot of development in that technology has been done in Germany and so the German government tried to push the stuff into the market which is not a very bad idea but the way they did it means, it will in the end not save energy but waste it.

The reason for that is a technical one. The government says how much energy the house shall consume at maximum but they give no technical guidelines how to and how not to reach this kind of insulation values. So what most people do is basically to buy mountains of styrofoam and nail them directly to the walls. This might work in a new construction, a house that is from the beginning planned as air tight with a good air flow planning, active or passive.

But many companies do the same to houses that are 100 years old or 50 years old and were from the beginning constructed as air conducting, as breathing houses.

What happens then is, that the water can not get out of the house and in consequence the house gets mouldy and rots.

It is possible to insulate an old house correctly but it requires a lot of skill and precision and it is much more expensive.

Foam insulation is also a problem for the fire brigade. If you plan to insulate your house it's a good idea to not only consult an architect and someone who really knows how to manage the air flow in a construction but also the fire experts that will evaluate how your insulation will behave in case of a fire. The Kensington Torch in London, killing a lot of people should be a warning to all.

The planning and qualified execution of the plan will be very expensive compared to getting some cheapo-workers from Eastern Europe hammering styrofoam to your outer walls and cashing in on the state money.

Trouble is that the law doesn't make any distinction between the qualified and unqualified way to do it so Germany will see hundreds of thousands of houses rot and being torn down and mega tons of styrofoam having to be dumped in some way. I am looking forward to the time in roughly 10 years, 15 years 20 years when the consequences of what we do today will surface.

Now the little German lesson:

Wärmedämmverbundsystem

This is the insulating construction in its totality including the air flow planning and execution.

Energieeinsparverordnung

This is a law requiring you to save energy but not telling you in detail how to do it and how not to do it.

Passivhaus

This is a very clever idea to build a house from the beginning in the way that it saves energy in the climate it is being constructed and that it saves energy without any active airflow management, heating or cooling system. This is the most intelligent way to build a house, but it is also very expensive and only a few people know exactly how to do it. In general it is easier and cheaper to realise such a thing in huge constructions than in the small constructions.

Very interesting read by one ofd the greatest architects of our time: https://www.amazon.com/BIG-HOT-COLD...1505361073&sr=8-2&keywords=bjarke+ingels+book


About The Picture:

Brown is the nice house, roughly 100 years old

Ugly is the old cladding which alloweded the house to breathe giving the wooden constructon between the house and the cladding

Ugly & dangerous is the new cladding quite possible air tight & burnable....

 

[tirediron]

Now, my sister in law has a generator that runs off natural gas, so that might be the best option. If we go that route.

As long as there's natural gas available. Don't forget that LNG pumping stations need power, and major storms can disrupt underground utilities as well. You can always find some gasoline; natural gas? Not so much. A nice little Honda 4Kw unit will run essentials all day on just a couple of gallons of gas, and is so quiet that you could sit beside it and have a conversation at normal volume.

 

[Frank F.]

Now, my sister in law has a generator that runs off natural gas, so that might be the best option. If we go that route.

As long as there's natural gas available. Don't forget that LNG pumping stations need power, and major storms can disrupt underground utilities as well. You can always find some gasoline; natural gas? Not so much. A nice little Honda 4Kw unit will run essentials all day on just a couple of gallons of gas, and is so quiet that you could sit beside it and have a conversation at normal volume.

In my area lots of people have underground gas tanks big enough to get them through the winter. In addition to heating you can have your A/C run on gas as well as cooking and you can produce electricity with it in case of emergency.

 

[Frank F.]

Good morning hosers! On my desk since 5 a.m. with a coffee of course!

 

[Frank F.]

Today autumn started and showed its ugly face: cold, dark, wet ... unfriendly ... grey. At a point my camera got so wet, the pictures were full of grey spots, unusable. I had a second body on me with a lens featuring a more recessed front element. Much better for rainy environment. The pictures are better anyway, ultra wide angle is still my weakness.

I just developed one of the pics I took in the pouring rain (D500, 1.8/85G):

 

[smoke665]

Traditionally humans built houses that breathe, which means the walls let air and water in and out to a certain extent meaning there will never be too much water inside, because it can go through the walls to the outside and balance the concentration out.

Interesting. Our house as most of those built in the last several years are wrapped in Tyvek, Tyvek ® | Tyvek ® Brand Applications | DuPont USA prior to application of siding material. It's a unique fiber material that prevents water and air intrusion from outside, but allows water vapor to pass out. Works really well. As to insulation, our house is conventional fiberglass batt in the walls and ceilings. Of late I've seen expanding spray in foam being used, but frankly I have serious questions as to the air quality in the house from this.

 

[Frank F.]

Cool stuff. Like a Gore Tex Jacket for the house???

 

[smoke665]

Gary thinks that the energy requirement for heating/cooling are significant less out here than in Alabama. There is a band of older residential housing near the coast which has no A/C.

Gary has central air, but only runs it about two weeks total out of the year.

Yup, each of the heat pumps are on their own 50 amp circuit. Granted the load on every circuit isn't utilized to the maximum at all times. Unlike you we have summer heat/humidity that starts in early spring and runs through September/October. Temperatures remain mild till late December when the cold weather kicks in, by February we're back to mild.

The heat pumps are extremely efficient down to the low 30's where the supplemental heat strips kick in. Unfortunately they are not known for longevity, about 10 years is the average life of a system. Already had to replace our big unit this spring. Have another unit that we're hoping will survive another year.

 

[smoke665]

Cool stuff. Like a Gore Tex Jacket for the house???

Yup, I can attest to how well it works. On our old house it just seemed like you couldn't stop the cold winter drafts no matter how much you caulked and mold (under floor) was always a concern over crawl spaces. I truthfully don't feel any of the drafts now. Course the other things is that all windows are insulated, low e-glass, including the large floor to ceiling windows in the great room. Still amazed at how well they work. The temperature could be freezing outside yet the glass is warm to the touch on the inside. Something that was a concern on a 2 story wall of glass. This wall is a prow shape oriented to catch most of the sun through about 2-3 in the afternoon. The coating on the glass is designed to reflect the infrared energy when the sun is high during the summer months, but allows it in during the winter months when at a lowered angle.

 

[limr34 4]

Speaking of Climatization and Ventilation I wrote a little piece on it, watching construction in the neighbourhood:

Wärmedämmverbundsystem, Energieeinsparverordnung, Passivhaus

Don't take this the wrong way - your post does look interesting and I'll read it more carefully at some point - but honestly, I stopped reading right here because all I care about at this exact moment is the ability of German to shove so much meaning into one fantastically beautiful monster word. Compounding is a hell of a thing. English, being a Germanic language, maintained this ability to a certain extent, but it's not nearly as robust a process as it is in German. So a compound of two words like passivhaus wouldn't really be a stretch for English, but we couldn't manage anything like the first two words.

This has done my linguist's heart good this Thursday morning

 

[Gary A.]

"Wärmedämmverbundsystem, Energieeinsparverordnung, Passivhaus"

Gary agrees with Leo, German can be amazing. But Germans ... that is something else.

 

[Gary A.]

@Frank: Airtight doesn't work with small structures like homes. Energy efficiency has been a big thing since the 1960's here in California. One construction company built "airtight" homes which could be heated seemingly with a single match. But the odors and smells from cooking simply made the houses uninhabitable. Tyvek, (or equal), is standard construction material on all government facilities. Those thin, fiber-ish, large mail envelopes that you can't rip open with your bare hands ... that's Tyvek. The US has construction companies which have qualified by our EPA as ESCO companies. ESCO is an Energy Service Company. ESCO's bring in all the disciplines of construction, engineering and energy management, from landscaping to insulation to solar to et cetera, in order to construct building with the smallest energy footprint. It is a comprehensive approach to construction and retrofitting. Example: Planting trees is specific areas will reduce the need of mechanical cooling or LED w/sensors will reduce the number of solar panels.

Our government will issue Requests For Proposals which can only be bid upon by an ESCO.

Typically, an ESCO contract requires the ESCO company to pay for their portion of the construction/retrofitting and the ESCO company gets paid back over time through the energy savings. Example: If it costs $100 a month to heat/cool/vent/power/light the facility and the ESCO can reduce the costs to $60 a month. Then the ESCO captures and pockets the $40 difference, until the contract is fulfilled.

Gary has worked with ESCO type contracts with hospitals, schools and military facilities. Gary has seen the payments amortized for as little as three years to as long as 12 years.

 

[Overread19]

Hey we still have antidisestablishmentarianism!

 

[vintagesnaps]

Climatization and ventilation are enough long words without the warmdamnwhateversystem. Even the computer doesn't like these words...

Frank has floating red hot chili peppers over his desk. Made for a nice picture.

JC is a Yooper this week. Nice picture of the cabin!

 

[smoke665]

6 month checkup at with a new Pulmonologist. My old doctor that I thought the world of moved to Miami. Every now and then you stumble on a good one, such was the case with this lady, really sad to see her go. The jury is still out on the new one, he's younger - though at my age most specialists look like my youngest kids. And, of course, there, are more tests to done, as this one flexes his wings believing he can improve my breathing. Not complaining really, because I'm pretty Dam**d fond of breathing, I can attest to how much the alternative sucks, but I've resigned myself to dealing with Asthma symptoms, and living my life. Unless I'm in ER sucking on Oxygen, I prefer to leave things be.