The Pact

[musicaleCA]

With all due respect Onion, you haven't been here as long as some of these guys. In fact, I haven't been here so long either. They've seen a different forum, that apparently had a lot more quality of critique and some simple mutual respect.

The biggest issue is the quality of critique provided here, which is lacking. It's a photography forum, and people seeking critique need, well, critique. There's far too much patting on the back and saying "good job" without even stating what was done well in the photo. That kind of response doesn't help anyone; not the writer, not the poster, not the other readers of the forum.

I will also note that this pact (or whatever you want to call it) is meant to discourage the kind of reply you posted above that kundalini referenced; snarky replies don't help anyone either.

 

[Onion]

I have seen enough to have an opinion. Any problems here will have to be solved by management, not a few bullies that have swore to each other to be rude and inconsiderate to any one who does not agree with them, or asks the wrong question.

The good photographers are gone. I doubt that they will be replaced by the cliquish and arrogant behavior as demonstrated in this thread.

There are limited choices. Rogue vilgilantes are the least desirable.

"Fuque off?" That's very mature.

If I had paid for membership here I'd be angry too.

 

[musicaleCA]

I have seen enough to have an opinion. Any problems here will have to be solved by management, not a few bullies that have swore to each other to be rude and inconsiderate to any one who does not agree with them, or asks the wrong question.

Agreed to be rude and inconsiderate? Can you quote what you're referring to for me? Are my eyes deceiving me? (Seriously, I want to know how you reached that conclusion.)

 

[Onion]

I'm taking Kundalini's response to Fuque off as a response that will be typical of the pact.

I was just making a joke in the first place. I guess only pact members (bullies) are the only ones allowed to go off topic and have fun with stupid videos and talk about forcing people to "succumb."

Stay crunchy. I can't stand this place.

 

[manaheim]

Hey guys, if we're agreeing to the pact as we should be, just block/Ignore Onion. He has his opinions. He is as welcome to them as we are. I personally find his behavior here pretty unconstructive, but whatever... the internet is full of them. If we let them drag down the discourse, we let them win.

Now if I can just FIND the stupid ignore/block thing...

 

[Garbz]

Joke? Kundalini's post was funny, yours Onion was downright offensive. The only person here who is rude and inconsiderate because they don't like what someone said is YOU.

Maybe pay a little attention and you'll find this has nothing to do with noobs asking basic questions.

 

[manaheim]

Ok, changes made. Check it out. I also put something in my sig. Woot.

 

[kundalini]

I'm taking Kundalini's response to Fuque off as a response that will be typical of the pact.

Typical of someone reading into a response what that want to see rather than the actual content.



If you go back to my original comment it was "could you please kindly phuque off". I was trying to be cordial and considerate of your feelings with the "please" and "kindly", but nowhere did I say Fuque off.



Carry on..............

 

[blash]

Absolutely signed!

manaheim check your PMs - and by the way see about adding a standard Pact signature for all of us to use.

As for Onion - he's a provocative-type troll who comes onto a thread where he knows his opinion is unpopular and unhelpful and posts anyways. Don't feed the trolls - he's a classic example of why more moderation is needed on these forums to keep trollage in check by the classic banhammer. In the meantime, if someone will let me know where this fabled "Ignore" button is, I will be more than happy to use it.

 

[Dagwood56]

I want to begin by saying that I respect you and the theory behind this "pact", but I have to say that I'm not sure its the right way to "fix" things on the forum either. I'm very much opposed to labeling as I mentioned in an earlier thread regarding the silly "thank you" button and I'm not crazy about clicks [wrong spelling I know] either and to me, this pact, will be yet another offset group that is going to draw fire from many others on the forum. There are already the "work groups" that have many members hanging within one long thread that I suspect other members feel they are not welcome to comment on [its content] if they aren't a "group" member, and there are also threads popping up by other members starting their own mini gallery rather than posting individual image threads. DwayneOaks C&C thread....why have a forum in the first place if everyone in the "COMMUNITY" is going to hide within their own little houses? The contents of this "pact" are practical, but I just feel it needs to be implemented in a different way to really make a difference and get TPF back to a helpful, and friendly Community.

Thank you very much - the podium is now open for comments.

 

[JerryPH]

that 4000 posts thing is eating at you?

What you have written is well done, but it should be "common" sense. I think we are realizing that it really is "rare" sense though.

No pact should be needed if you just do what is right, and do it with courtesy and respect.

You would be surprised how uncommon "common sense" really is. If there are people that want to critique and they are strong-armed into not participating becuase the people who are posting in the CC sections have no clue what to expect or how to receive or even ASK properly for CC, they make the entire experience something that no one wants to really do again, so of course *good* CCers will not poarticipate.

It may not need to be there forever, because once the direction of the way CC is asked and given, and it becomes a forum standard, everyone who does this, will follow "THE PACT".

My method is only slightly different and more basic.

When I post a shot for CC, I have a very simple methodology:

1. I also ask for things that I am specifically looking for (PP, composition, artistic, technical, etc... suggestions).

2. I read the CC of the person that gives me their point of view and REALLY try to see it from their side

3. I *never* argue, disagree or finnagle with them.

4. I ask questions if there is something that is not clear to me

5. ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS thank them for taking the time to help me out. I was not raised in barns or in the jungles with apes. A little courtesy goes a long way.

It is a simple system, very basic common sense, really... but how many actually do it this way?

Imagine if everyone did it this way? I think that this is the goal that was trying to be accomplished, but in a more formal and structured manner.

Edit:
I don't usually do things like this, but in this case, if it would help, I added the link to my sig. I want TPF to improve over the downhill slide it's fallen into recently.

 

[PhotoXopher]

I like the idea, see if it catches on.

 

[SrBiscuit]

Stay crunchy. I can't stand this place.

then go away.

you say it's site management's job to do this, but again, perhaps you're too new to see that management does not typically step in. there was a comment made last week to the effect of: mgt has their ad dollars, so they dont care anymore.

i think this effort is nothing more than an effort by the users to better the site. if it works i think we can all expect an improved community. i think manaheim has the site's best interest in mind, and just wants users to get the best from being a member here.

good on ya manaheim.:thumbup:

*also adding link in sig.*

 

[Chiller]

Good on y'all for giving this a go.:thumbup::thumbup: I honestly hope it works out.
The management and whoever else must bend tho. It has been proven by the number of threads that keep popping up about attitudes,critique and so on, that people wish that TPF would improve. They just keep hoping these threads go away, and their lack of support shows how much interest they really have in fixing the issues. Believe me, Im all for the change, but it is going to take a small miracle for anyone to actually implement them here....but keep pushing...miracles happen
Good luck

 

[Overread]

I spend a few days away from active posting and you lot start a cult!
Well I guess I agree, though it dissapoints me a bit that such basic things must be spelled out - good manners should be automatic (I mean heck most people here are past 10 years old - heck most are past 25!).......

But don't expect me to start kissing dead chickens, dancing round maypoles and other such initiation thingies

Good luck to the plan!!