Critique or encouragement?

[voodoocat]

dont get me wrong .. this is a great forum for beginners ... there is a lot to learn here ... im not a pro yet (but i will be someday) ... but im not a beginner and i feel the need to be amongst fellow photographers that share a true passion for photography and always wanting to go to the next level ...

i am on a mission to perfect and fine tune my skills ... i need to surround myself with people who share that vision ... not to create good photographs, but to create great photographs ... good is not good enough

there are a handful of great photographers here ... i wonder what keeps them going :?

This is only my opinion and I could be wrong, but keep in mind that sometimes teachers can learn just as much their students. Helping others to enhance their skills can result in you digging deeper into your own skills and knowledge as well as potentially opening the door for other areas that you may not have explored.

I know that in the computer field, my experiences with teaching various levels of computer users had a major impact on my personal knowledge in the field. Helping people that knew less than me pushed me to continue expanding my skills and knowledge and often raised questions that I was humbled by.

Just my 2 cents...

<---somehow I knew I would get a lot of use out of this little guy!

Quite true Chase.

Learning is finding out what you already know. Doing is demonstrating that you know it. Teaching is reminding others that they know it just as well as you do. You are all learners, doers, teachers. - Richard Bach

 

[Dew]

honestly, i have learned nothing here in the past few months ... everything that i have acquired as far as my skills is from the hubby and if he doesnt know it .. he will find the answers for me

im with ksmattfish .. i like to socialize with others to talk about the thing i love .. photography

a lot of times i like to get a second opinion about something, so i'll post it here to get a different perspective ... but that will not make me a better photographer ... i will be boxed in at an amateur level ... very few people here really knows how a photo can be made better .. because they simply dont know

i've been researching what the big boys are doing for a few months now ... and the photos that they reflect are so different than what is presented here ... one day i will stand alongside the big boys and not be ashamed to show my work ... im driven and my new projects reflect growth for me artistcally and technically .. but im serious about what im doing ....

i'll stick around for a minute.. and im sure no one here will bat an eye when im gone .. but in a few yrs .. be looking out for me in your next photography magazine or the like

 

[markc]

I've also found that giving critiques and doing how-tos have been instrumental in helping me advance in my work. When I have to put into a coherent written or spoken statement something that I've been doing by gut feel, it forces me to take a closer look at what I'm actually doing. I usually end up discovering that I'm making some choices out of default. I might not change my mind in how I do them, but at least it becomes more of a conscious choice so that I can look for other places where similar choices might be made and I may not be acting consistantly. My focus has much improved, no pun intended.

When I explain ideas to someone else, on some level, I'm also explaining it to myself.

 

[ksmattfish]

When I explain ideas to someone else, on some level, I'm also explaining it to myself.

Beautiful.

Heck, I feel like I'm learning a lot just in this thread. You know, there are a million how-to books that can teach you all you need to know to take a picture. It's the other stuff that no one writes books about that you learn in the conversations here.

 

[Dew]

im getting the impression that growth is a bad thing :? ... can u imagine a 20yr old in 6th grade? :scratch:

i think to discourage growth is a bad thing and beginner photographers need to get real and be honest where they stand on the totem pole ...

for example ... "we" make think their stuff is great .... they get out there in the real world and find out that that stuff is garbage ...

like i said, i've seen the "big boys" stuff ... im not there yet .. but im not too far away ...

i think to mislead a photographer/hobbyist about their work is not doing them a favor in the long run ... they may have false pretenses

 

[markc]

honestly, i have learned nothing here in the past few months ...

... very few people here really knows how a photo can be made better .. because they simply dont know

i've been researching what the big boys are doing for a few months now ... and the photos that they reflect are so different than what is presented here ...

No offense intended Dew, but it sounds like you are placing the responsibility for growing as an artist on the community here. I can understand understand feeling frustrated. I feel that way with my local camera club. They seem more interested in competitions than the exchange of knowledge. But it seems like you are putting everyone down.

im getting the impression that growth is a bad thing :? ... can u imagine a 20yr old in 6th grade? :scratch:

I don't think anyone is discouraging growth.

i think to discourage growth is a bad thing and beginner photographers need to get real and be honest where they stand on the totem pole ...

I have to be blunt here. Screw the totem pole. I don't care where I "stand" and I don't plan on caring the future. That's great if you have ambitions that involve comparisons with someone else, but I don't think it's fair to apply that to all beginers. They should be the one making that choice.

i think to mislead a photographer/hobbyist about their work is not doing them a favor in the long run ... they may have false pretenses

I think that pushing a load of expectations on them can discourage them from even trying. I'd rather encourage someone along, and let them deal with the rest of the art world at their own pace.

 

[Dew]

you're right .. its no one's fault that i continue to stay .. its mine, but i will resolve this ...

i want to share the knowledge that i have ... but i also want to grow more .. there is no room for growth here for me ... im at a wall .... it is time for me to move on ...

thanks for your hospitality

i will keep in touch with a few of you here ... see how you're progressing

 

[markc]

you're right .. its no one's fault that i continue to stay .. its mine, but i will resolve this ...

i want to share the knowledge that i have ... but i also want to grow more .. there is no room for growth here for me ... im at a wall .... it is time for me to move on ...

thanks for your hospitality

i will keep in touch with a few of you here ... see how you're progressing

I didn't mean that you should leave. If your time is limited and you think that you will get more of a return by leaving, I can understand that. What I was trying to say is that I don't think that staying here has to prevent growth. It's all about what you do with what you have. If you think you need to be elsewhere, I'm not going to argue with that. I just meant that placing the burden of growth on someone else, no matter who they are or what group, it's being a bit unfair.

 

[photogoddess]

:shock: WOW! That got ugly fast! :shock:

I am pretty new to this group and I am still learning about this forum and it's members. What I have learned so far is that there are many types of photographers here - from snap-shooters to professionals. In all truthfulness, I most likely fit in right near the middle of that spectum.

While I have worked as a pro, I hesitate to apply the title "Professional Photographer" to myself. This is because I honestly feel that much of my prior work was lacking in that special something that sets it above the standard for "true" professionals. I try to look at all of my photos objectively. But, when you are really close to a shot, that is hard to do sometimes. Thankfully I can get some of that objectivity here.

I looked at a couple of different sites and chose this one because it seemed the most friendly. Photosig just seemed a bit sterile to me. I know that many people like to hear the nice stuff about their photos - who doesn't! When I post photos here, I like the fact that many of you are honest about what they like and don't like about the post. I have gotten some REALLY valuable feedback on this forum and I think we all have something valuable to add here. As long as photography continues to change, we ALL have something to learn. Do I aspire to be a better photographer? Always! I don't have the ability to work on it full time so maybe it's a slower progression than someone who lives and breathes photography. That doesn't mean that I am not serious about improving. I am sure that I am not alone in this thought. :?:

Dew, you have some great things to add to this forum and some of your posts have been extremely helpful. Please don't feel that by continuing to view and post on this forum that you are stranded in 6th grade. When you go on to the "Big Boys Club", maybe it will be nice to find some comfort from your friends here at this forum. Stick around, it would be nice for you to pass on some of that "insiders" information and tips on to those of us that haven't reached that level. YET!

 

[metroshane]

Wow, look what's happened here....where have i been?

I understand Dew's position but feel she's having a hard time articulating it in a non-offensive manner. An online community is a wierd little thing and still a very new sociology. Sometimes we get caught up and find ourselves checking the forum every few minutes to see if anyone has answered my question, laughed at my joke, told me how great my pic was, or mentioned my name at all. Strange and unhealthy.

What has occured here is the same thing that has happened to every small town high school kid. "I can't wait to get outta this lousy town". We've become so much a family that we all eventually need to set out on our own. We got to get out in the world and test our limits, set our own course. So, I believe Dew isn't leaving because of anomosity, but rather to focus more on the activity of photography...not just the discussion. I mean I for one admit I'd probably be twice as good if I dedicated the time I'm here to the actual art. Think of it as a sojourn where we can all come home anytime. I for one have learned a whole heckava lot and will continue to come on a regular basis...but some have you have noticed that I haven't posted much in the gallery lately. Not b/c I don't want your opinion...just that I've destracted myself.

I think it's a good idea for Dew to set out on her way...then I guarantee she'll come back with some great stories.

 

[MDowdey]

im going to be the one to ask the question?


have i stepped into the twilight zone?

when did this forum have ANYTHING to do with the progress of anyone here? its just a meeting place, you know, common ground.

this is not school, and there is no effort made to shape photographers here. dew, i love you, and im sorry you feel that way...but the fact is, its not the forums that are making you feel this way, its your intense drive to be the best at what you do. with or without this forum, you would be feeling the same way. i believe this to be true. i will miss you and your wit.

md

 

[photogoddess]

when did this forum have ANYTHING to do with the progress of anyone here? its just a meeting place, you know, common ground.

While I agree that this is a great meeting place for photographers, I don't think that is all that this forum is about. I happen to think that this is also a fantastic place to get educated opinions and critiques of your work and about photography as a whole. As a photographer, if you are truly willing to hear the good, the bad and the ugly about your photos, you can't help but learn something and grow as an artist.

Honestly, I originally had my mind set on joining another forum. After reading a few of their posts, I got a major case of cold feet. I realized that I needed to get some objective opinions from some educated, friendly photographers about my work before jumping into the deep end of the pool. I found that help here. In the short time that I have been a member of this forum, I have also learned a great deal. Whether you realize it or not, there are many things that we can learn from each other. We just have to be willing to hear the lessons.

 

[voodoocat]

Think about where the word forum came from...

It's essentially a public meeting place for open discussion...

 

[Not Neve]

:shock:

 

[Tammy]

When I decided to search for a photography forum, I knew from experience with a different genre what I was looking for - a place where experienced people and beginners worked together in order to improve their craft. I wasn't looking for a social club, a place where "this is pretty" would be critique. I was looking for a where they why's of 'this is pretty' were discussed - honestly.

Dew (hoping you aren't really gone) - When I first came here, I saw your website and was very impressed with your work. You were the reason I kept looking around, and eventually, I decided to become a member. I've come to admire your knowledge and passion for photography, as well as many other members on this site; and as much as I'd love to be able to dedicate as much time and effort to learning more about the craft of photography as you and others have - the simple truth is - I can't... there simply isn't enough time in the day. So, does this mean I shouldn't try to improve and become the best photographer I can be?.... I don't think so. Let's face it - if I only did the things I was great at - I wouldn't be doing much.

To that end, I'm thrilled that the topic of critique is being discussed. I've always been uncomfortable asking for critique as part of my post, because it seemed to me that posting in the Photo Gallery in and of itself indicated that critique would be welcome and is desired... to me, asking is like begging/nagging, and I don't like to beg.

I always want critique. I want to learn - and since my husband doesn't understand why I'd want to take a perfectly good color photo and turn it into black and white - I figure I need to outside the home to get any feedback. So I came here, where I'm still trying to figure things out - not only photographically speaking, but also socially speaking.

Seems to me that most forums have their own personality and an underlying set of unwritten rules - here for example, there have been many times when I've seen a photograph that in my opinion was more of a snapshot - but no one calls it a snapshot - so I wonder why not? Did the people who commented see something I didn't see or were they simply being nice? I know what I think - but I could be wrong and don't want to step on toes, and I don't feel as though I've paid enough dues to say 'I do't get it' - so I probably don't say anything especially if the post is from one of the more established members.

All that being said - if I post a snapshot - please feel free to let me know. And if I do something right - I'd love to hear from you all about that as well.

Thanks for this thread, for comments given, and photos shared. Cheers.